Are the "New" teams really better?

[nwfisch]

Just an observation, it seems as though the "new" Magic, you know, the team that was supposed to overtake Boston and Miami has fell solidly to 4th in the conference, with Atlanta hot on their heels.

New York has leveled off after trading for Carmelo Anthony and Chauncey Billups.

New Jersey has gotten worse since trading for Deron Williams.

Even the Celtics have slowed down since trading Perkins, though I think it's more of the grind of the schedule getting to the veterans.

Looks like the Bulls, Celtics, Lakers and Spurs have it right in having significant depth.

:thinking:

Just my 2 cents.

 

[WearShades]

Just an observation, it seems as though the "new" Magic, you know, the team that was supposed to overtake Boston and Miami has fell solidly to 4th in the conference, with Atlanta hot on their heels.

New York has leveled off after trading for Carmelo Anthony and Chauncey Billups.

New Jersey has gotten worse since trading for Deron Williams.

Even the Celtics have slowed down since trading Perkins, though I think it's more of the grind of the schedule getting to the veterans.

Looks like the Bulls, Celtics, Lakers and Spurs have it right in having significant depth.

:thinking:

Just my 2 cents.

The moves by the Magic and the Celtics have not worked out (more so for the former). However, the moves by the Nets and Knicks were with an eye on future seasons so to evaluate them now seems irresponsible to me. If the Knicks can fill out their holes over the next season or two, that move will have made them into a power, and the Nets now have ammunition to go after another star player with Deron in the mix.

 

[Crystallas]

You can't say that the Magic failed their attempts at improving, although you need to look at a few very important variables that are affecting them.
1.) Stan Van Gundy is a decent coach, but he has lost his cool one too many times this season and it's likely that the core players are losing faith in him.

2.) It takes time for GOOD teams to gel with new players. Bad teams don't have much to lose, and you can see trades boost their abilities instantly.

3.) You have to recognize who the Magic have gotten rid of. Vince Carter, who is not able to perform anywhere near as consistent as J-Rich has at the respectable points in their careers. Gortat was HUGE for them, and that loss did set them back as far as the depth the Magic need to match up with the elite in the playoffs. But, guys like Dwight love the added weight on his shoulders and he's performing well in the role. That means the Magic identified chemistry problems with Gortat being a second fiddle, when he could start for many teams in the NBA. The Magic traded him for hopes to land someone who accepts the backup role. Will it happen? Maybe, maybe not, but Gortat's stock wasn't going to go up if they ignored the problem.

So really, the Magic were damned if they did anything, but that doesn't mean they are out of the picture. They just need time, and when you have once a decade Center like Dwight, you wont really be a bad team. They could easily bring back the same exact team next season and improve a great deal, just as long as the players are on-board with SVG or whatever coach.

Now, the Celtics... that's a different story. They basically said to themselves that they can't afford to keep this team together, and if they have opportunities to make a small, low impact move, that they were going to be open to it. When Ainge commented on re-signing Peirce in the offseason, he made it clear that it was due to loyalty more than business. This would lead me to believe that at some point, good players are going to be shed off the books. Why Perkins now, and not after the season? Nobody still knows, but the only reason why it makes sense, is the sense in Ainge's head.
That doesn't mean it was a failed move, but will it come to fruition by the time the Celtics need it the most this season? It very well could, and just like the Magic, the move might be too early to really tell.

Personally, I think Jeff Green is a good player, but for a PF, he has the same consistency as a bench shooting guard. You just never know if he's going to play to his potential.

 

[Shakes]

My take ...

Magic is worse: Arenas and Hedo are abysmally bad, which more than offsets the loss of Lewis since they're playing more minutes than Lewis was. The also lost a productive playing in Gortat, and without Nash Richardson has regressed and isn't doing any better than Carter was.

Suns are better: Gortat balances their roster a lot better than what they gave up to get him.

Wizards are who gives a crap: They wanted to lose anyway, whether they do it with Arenas or Lewis doesn't really matter.

Knicks are about the same: They've actually gotten worse defensively and better offensively, but having the best offense with the worst defense makes you a .500 club which they are. Was really a stupid trade for them, gives up whatever flexibility they had for a guy who didn't solve any of their needs.

Nuggets are better: Without Carmelo & Billups the defense is much improved and they haven't lost much offensively since they already had other good offensive players.

Nets are better: They've just won 5 in a row, that's nearly as many as they won last season!

Utah are worse: But they were already melting down so I don't know if the trade had a lot to do with it.

Boston is incomplete: Depends on what happens once they get Shaq back whether it was a mistake or not. If Shaq can come back then maybe they didn't need Perkins and it'll work out OK. Still don't like the trade but it might not hurt them.

OC is incomplete: Perkins has only played a couple of games for them, we'll see how much he helps once he's fully fit. Although getting rid of Green's poor shooting probably helps them no matter what.

 

[houheffna]

Just an observation, it seems as though the "new" Magic, you know, the team that was supposed to overtake Boston and Miami has fell solidly to 4th in the conference, with Atlanta hot on their heels.

New York has leveled off after trading for Carmelo Anthony and Chauncey Billups.

New Jersey has gotten worse since trading for Deron Williams.

Even the Celtics have slowed down since trading Perkins, though I think it's more of the grind of the schedule getting to the veterans.

Looks like the Bulls, Celtics, Lakers and Spurs have it right in having significant depth.

:thinking:

Just my 2 cents.

You are totally off about New York and New Jersey.....

 

[nwfisch]

You are totally off about New York and New Jersey.....

Yeah, I decided to lump those 2 in there. However, like WearShades said, (and I think you'll agree too) their trades were made for the future in mind. Not #winning now

 

[nwfisch]

The moves by the Magic and the Celtics have not worked out (more so for the former). However, the moves by the Nets and Knicks were with an eye on future seasons so to evaluate them now seems irresponsible to me. If the Knicks can fill out their holes over the next season or two, that move will have made them into a power, and the Nets now have ammunition to go after another star player with Deron in the mix.

Agree with what you said, I was incorrect in my earlier thought, but just wanted to start discussion.

I wouldn't exactly depend on Deron Williams staying in New Jersey, just because Cleveland thought their star player would stay, you know the rest.

 

[Anytime23]

Nets are on their longest winning streak since 06. Williams is a top 3 PG. Not a bad trade for Harris and a pf who has yet to prove his worth

 

[pinkizdead]

The knicks went from an okay .500 team to .500 team with a lot of potential.

The nets and knicks seem to be building for the future. I don't think it's fair to assess them this year.

The nuggets are like the hawks of the west. Not in terms of their roster, but the fact that they're a good team, but they dont have a real star on the roster. I like them though.

I think boston made a move for the future in jeff green. I don't think perkins is as good as everyone made him out to be. I do think it's interesting to see what happens when garnett gets into foul trouble. Think about it. After garnet, the celtics best post defender is glen davis.

 

[RamiTheBullsFan]

New Jersey has definitely gotten better since making their trade. Not even a question about that.

New York is still iffy, but I am confident this deal will ultimately make them better going forward.

The Magic were never top 3 in the East this season and the trades probably helped them out more than it hurt them. But the unfortunate part for them is it crippled them financially for even longer because Turkoglu's and Arenas' deals are far worse than the 3 years Rashard Lewis had remaining on his contract.

 

[Diddy1122]

The Celtics shouldn't have traded Perkins during the season imho. Granted Perkins was not fully healthy & back, so it's tough to tell what his impact would be in the playoffs. However, trading him for an inconsistent 3-4 tweener, who must now learn the system in a couple months, figure out his role & perform on the big stage in the playoffs, doesn't make much sense to me. It's the old adage "If it ain't broke, don't fix it".

Thibs called Perkins "the best low-post defender in the NBA". I think it's safe to say we all agree Thibs knows a thing or two about defense. I suspect the Celtics will suffer for this trade during the playoffs.

 

[Bullsman24]

i think it was a stupid move to trade perkins. sure, you may not have been able to sign him this offseason. but who cares? you threw away all your building blocks by getting garnett and allen, so why are you caring about next year? that's like the bulls trading kukoc for a future first in 98. you're all in now, who gives a crap about the future???