Joe Johnson or luol deng?

[pinkizdead]

Who do you think is a better player? I was wondering about this while a barrage of marathon runners prevented my morning walk to 7-11. Christ, 30k people is a crap ton of bodies preventing you from getting a slushie.

If the rumors from last summer were true that we had handshake agreements with JJ and carlos boozer, i think we lucked out that JJ signed elsewhere for a ridiculous amount of money. I think we were going to offer JJ a near max deal.

Really if you think about, JJ can get his own shot, but he's not a very efficient scorer this year. Deng is just a quality 3 that rebounds, defends, and scores. I think JJ attempts to defend, but he's just a piss poor rebounder/defender, but he's a decent scorer. Sadly for the hawks, he's a terrible catch and shoot player. I think he's hitting 30% of his 3's this year. His iso game has been off and on. Deng isn't 2006 Peja, but he's hitting a respectable percentage of his shots. He's been a great team player, because he's finding his shots in the flow of the offense.

Let's get to the grit of the debate. i've never seen an unathletic 240lb 6-7 sg. He's a sf masquerading as a 2. In addition, he's 29? When's the last time you saw a 29 year old big 2 that weighs 240lbs. At this point in his career, JJ is a sf. Unfortunately, the bulls already have their own quality 3, deng. The question presents itself, which would you rather have this year Deng, or JJ?

I'm going with deng. better scorer off the ball, better defender, better rebounder, and younger. I'm glad JJ signed with the hawks.

 

[Crystallas]

For the Bulls?

I think it's easier to replace a top SF than an All-Star SG. If the Bulls simply have Johnson, and don't have Deng, that wouldn't make any sense to me. If the Bulls had Johnson for Deng's salary, and filled in the SF position with Matt Barnes, then you have the argument that Joe Johnson would perform differently under Thibs, and I would say that Johnson would improve this team. But that move also changes the rest of the landscape, and we wouldn't know if Brewer, Korver, or Blogans would be Bulls right now.

 

[houheffna]

The Bulls had an agreement with Johnson for about 15mil a year. He was Rose's number one choice in free agency supposedly...even over Lebron and Wade. His skillset compliments Rose better than any of them, including Deng.

Calling J-Smoove nonathletic just doesn't make sense. He is much more athletic than Deng. Deng has a lot of value but lets not get carried away here. Johnson is a multiple allstar. You don't need him to rebound...like you don't need most shooting guards to rebound...and he is NOT a small forward, don't know where you getting that from either. He is also a very capable defender.

Why do you have such a mad on for Johnson anyway...it used to be Gordon is better than him...now Deng...of all the guards bantered about in conversation...Johnson was the best of that bunch outside of Wade.

That said, Deng fits this system well, so that is something that doesn't need to be touched. That doesn't mean at all that he is a better player than Johnson, he thrives in Thibs system...no telling what Johnson would have done. I believe that with the pressure off and the team in place now, he makes this team damn near unbeatable for the next 3 years or more...

 

[CODE_BLUE56]

tough one....with joe you get great scoring at the SG position and would work very well with Rose....although Joe is older and his production seems to be heading downward...not to mention the possible mega contract he requires(^although 15 mil is a pretty good deal imo)

Deng is also a great fit...not the best shooter but very versatile and a good supporting scorer...also very underrated defender...also has years left in him...barring extensive injury of course

i'd go with Deng...but either way would work well for the Bulls

 

[pinkizdead]

The Bulls had an agreement with Johnson for about 15mil a year. He was Rose's number one choice in free agency supposedly...even over Lebron and Wade. His skillset compliments Rose better than any of them, including Deng.

Calling J-Smoove nonathletic just doesn't make sense. He is much more athletic than Deng. Deng has a lot of value but lets not get carried away here. Johnson is a multiple allstar. You don't need him to rebound...like you don't need most shooting guards to rebound...and he is NOT a small forward, don't know where you getting that from either. He is also a very capable defender.

Why do you have such a mad on for Johnson anyway...it used to be Gordon is better than him...now Deng...of all the guards bantered about in conversation...Johnson was the best of that bunch outside of Wade.

That said, Deng fits this system well, so that is something that doesn't need to be touched. That doesn't mean at all that he is a better player than Johnson, he thrives in Thibs system...no telling what Johnson would have done. I believe that with the pressure off and the team in place now, he makes this team damn near unbeatable for the next 3 years or more...

i have a passionate hatred of joe johnson. I don't even know why. he's a really nice guy, but i hate him as a player.
You think Joe's a 2? Still? He's just so damn slow. I think he was a 2, 2 years ago. He just doesn't have the foot speed to play the 2. i think he's a 3.

 

[RamiTheBullsFan]

Joe Johnson is easily better than Deng but Deng is the better defender and rebounder. Deng is needed on the Bulls more than a player like JJ would be.

 

[pinkizdead]

hopefully this works, the new signature should explain a majority of my sentiments towards JJ. Also, i don't think JJ was worth of an allstar vote over deng this year.

 

[houheffna]

hopefully this works, the new signature should explain a majority of my sentiments towards JJ. Also, i don't think JJ was worth of an allstar vote over deng this year.

If JJ didn't deserve to go...someone besides Deng most likely did...

 

[nwfisch]

Pink you are so funny!

 

[pinkizdead]

Pink you are so funny!

hey little kid i got a joke for you, nwfisch. get it. get it? get it? hardy har har har.

 

[pinkizdead]

If JJ didn't deserve to go...someone besides Deng most likely did...

couldn't we have just sent derrick rose twice?

 

[nwfisch]

couldn't we have just sent derrick rose twice?

:rolling::rolling::rolling:

Pink stop it. My sides hurt.

 

[Adog06]

The Bulls had an agreement with Johnson for about 15mil a year. He was Rose's number one choice in free agency supposedly...even over Lebron and Wade. His skillset compliments Rose better than any of them, including Deng.

Calling J-Smoove nonathletic just doesn't make sense. He is much more athletic than Deng. Deng has a lot of value but lets not get carried away here. Johnson is a multiple allstar. You don't need him to rebound...like you don't need most shooting guards to rebound...and he is NOT a small forward, don't know where you getting that from either. He is also a very capable defender.

Why do you have such a mad on for Johnson anyway...it used to be Gordon is better than him...now Deng...of all the guards bantered about in conversation...Johnson was the best of that bunch outside of Wade.

That said, Deng fits this system well, so that is something that doesn't need to be touched. That doesn't mean at all that he is a better player than Johnson, he thrives in Thibs system...no telling what Johnson would have done. I believe that with the pressure off and the team in place now, he makes this team damn near unbeatable for the next 3 years or more...

I actually hate to even think about that. How close we were to signing Johnson and then he takes a Kings ransom from Atlanta and runs with it. I understand thats a lot of money but come on, i think he should have known that ATL was not going anywhere and that Rose would take most of, if not all the pressure off him. Your right Hou, this team would be dam near unbeatable.

 

[houheffna]

I actually hate to even think about that. How close we were to signing Johnson and then he takes a Kings ransom from Atlanta and runs with it. I understand thats a lot of money but come on, i think he should have known that ATL was not going anywhere and that Rose would take most of, if not all the pressure off him. Your right Hou, this team would be dam near unbeatable.

Yeah...you know, he is sitting on that money...but I will have a hard time believing he doesn't think about what could have been...but if I was an advisor of his..I tell him to take that money. The Bulls would have offered him a 4 or 5 year deal at that 15per. As opposed to the 6 year 120mil plus he got with Atlanta. Asking him to walk away from 45-60mil of guaranteed money is stretching it quite a bit.

 

[Anytime23]

Because I'm on my iPhone I didn't read past the OP but I think its an unfair comparison. They don't play the same position and are in diff systems with diff players.

I would love to see what JJ would be capable of next to Rose. In the off-season I said that if we strike out on the big 3 and got stuck with Boozer and JJ that we could compete with anyone in the league. Well I know we prob wouldn't have the same supporting cast on the bench but man looks like I was right.

But I would never want JJ for the max, no way in hell.

 

[Adog06]

Yeah...you know, he is sitting on that money...but I will have a hard time believing he doesn't think about what could have been...but if I was an advisor of his..I tell him to take that money. The Bulls would have offered him a 4 or 5 year deal at that 15per. As opposed to the 6 year 120mil plus he got with Atlanta. Asking him to walk away from 45-60mil of guaranteed money is stretching it quite a bit.

Well money talks lol.

 

[theCHI_Life84]

i like joe johnson, but honestly im kind of on pink's side of the fence on this one. i wouldnt say i hate him but i do think hes kind of overrated. the ball stops when he gets it, hes all-iso, all the time. he only passes when he cant work his way into a shot for himself. i dont know, maybe it was the system in atl that demanded him to go 1v1 on every possession. but i really didnt like that about him. although, he is a much better 1v1 player than deng is.

i feel like deng has more hustle than jj, and naturally a much better off-ball player. he obviously is willing to do what it takes for the team to win (he finally decides to take a step back and shoot the 3). his rebounding tenacity has returned, and he plays more solid D. i cant say how well jj would do if he was forced off the ball the way he surely would have been in chicago. also his contract right now is way too much for too long. id rather have deng.

 

[Shakes]

I can't really believe anybody would vote in favour of a player that is already declining and is going to be under a contract no team in the league will want for the next 5 years. In case that sounds too attractive, he's also had his PER drop between 5 and 6 points the last two years in the playoffs.

Deng, and it's not even close.

 

[houheffna]

I can't really believe anybody would vote in favour of a player that is already declining and is going to be under a contract no team in the league will want for the next 5 years. In case that sounds too attractive, he's also had his PER drop between 5 and 6 points the last two years in the playoffs.

Deng, and it's not even close.

So at one point does he decline...using PER to the point where he is at Deng's level...which is barely average...and he is much more of a skilled player offensively than Deng is. At least the guy can dribble...I like Deng but I know a bit better than that...its closer than you are making it out to be...

 

[Shakes]

So at one point does he decline...using PER to the point where he is at Deng's level...which is barely average...and he is much more of a skilled player offensively than Deng is. At least the guy can dribble...I like Deng but I know a bit better than that...its closer than you are making it out to be...

I wasn't saying PER is a complete measure of a player, but when it's the same player in the same season falling of a cliff you know they're playing poorly. JJ has been terrible the last couple of playoff runs.

Also in the past you could say Joe Johnson is worth considering because he's a better offensive player, but this year he really hasn't been very good at all. Now is he just having a down year, or is he declining due to age? And being on the hook for 5 more years do you really want to risk finding out?