My main beef with this offseason

[LonghornBob]

On a straight transaction basis, of course I'm a little cheesed that there were several two line centers we could have gotten that we just let get away. Talbot and several, several others were relatively cheap and would have allowed us to solidify our lines and move Sharp back to wing where I think he belongs. That said, that isn't even my biggest worry.

Who are we? That's my big problem...

A few years ago our D looked fantastic even though we didn't really have a tough, physical group. We didn't exactly have a bunch of Paul Coffey types either, but we moved the puck well. Other than the times Campbell would make some dumbass cross-ice pass in front of our netminder and turn it over, we were up to the task. Keith was playing like an animal and we just didn't have to face a lot of shots.

A lot of people forget that our defense didn't have to be great because we kept control of the puck in the offensive zone the majority of the time. We were skaters. Our D activated and stayed at THEIR blue line. We had plenty of nights we'd only give up 15-17 shots.

Granted, we weren't physical on either end of the ice, except maybe Bolland and Byflugien, but we controlled the action. Ladd gave us some gumption in front of the pipes too but in general we were a skating team that got outhit every night but had a TON of odd-man rushes and owned the puck.

Now I'm not sure what the hell we're trying to do.

We got more physical with guys like Montador and Mayers and Carcillo, but how is that going to work?

I still don't see us as trying to be a Nashville that grinds it out, keeps the D packed in, and rarely tries to rush the D or activate them deep.

I don't think we're a puck control team anymore either. We've got Brunette up there now and I'm not sold on him as a nifty skater. We've got Olesz and I have NO IDEA what his niche is. Mayers and Carcillo are goons.

So who the heck are we? Are we becoming a physical, fewer opportunities but stronger blue line grinding team, or are we still a puck control team that added some grit?

I'm afraid that we just don't have a personality and I'm not sure how some of these guys are going to fit into our lines or how we're going to mesh into a style, any style, that we can play.

So make me feel better... Who are we?

 

[nwfisch]

:dennis::dennis:

 

[ClydeLee]

Theyre seems all this overreaction from unfamiliarity but there's hardly any difference to what the main team is and what their doing. Mayers and Carcillio were added to the team that 2-3 years ago won many games and a cup with Eager and Burish on the 4th line... nothing major changed there, the only change is a no Campbell. Obviously their expecting Leddy to replace part of that and Montador and Lespito are not solid rocks who can't move the puck or chip offensively at all.

Olesz is the type of player similar to Ladd, no he isn't proven to be as good but he's a decent sized solid defensive winger who has ability to produce effectively on offensive if given top 6 time with solid linemates. Kinda like Ladds Atlanta offense or what he got with havlat may be what they see in him, especially if they put him at times with Hossa in the same fashion Kopecky was with him. He'll probably be injured ot moved around with time given to Smith or Morin getting calls up anyway.

Yeah Brunette is in the top 6 now... but they had Brou & Kopecky there before, they weren't the epitome of speed or puck moving skill themselves.

 

[LonghornBob]

Eager and Burrish were fast. Neither was particularly nifty with the puck, but they could flat out motor when it was required. My mother could outskate Mayers from blue line to blue line...

 

[icehogfan08]

On a straight transaction basis, of course I'm a little cheesed that there were several two line centers we could have gotten that we just let get away. Talbot and several, several others were relatively cheap and would have allowed us to solidify our lines and move Sharp back to wing where I think he belongs. That said, that isn't even my biggest worry.

Who are we? That's my big problem...

A few years ago our D looked fantastic even though we didn't really have a tough, physical group. We didn't exactly have a bunch of Paul Coffey types either, but we moved the puck well. Other than the times Campbell would make some dumbass cross-ice pass in front of our netminder and turn it over, we were up to the task. Keith was playing like an animal and we just didn't have to face a lot of shots.

A lot of people forget that our defense didn't have to be great because we kept control of the puck in the offensive zone the majority of the time. We were skaters. Our D activated and stayed at THEIR blue line. We had plenty of nights we'd only give up 15-17 shots.

Granted, we weren't physical on either end of the ice, except maybe Bolland and Byflugien, but we controlled the action. Ladd gave us some gumption in front of the pipes too but in general we were a skating team that got outhit every night but had a TON of odd-man rushes and owned the puck.

Now I'm not sure what the hell we're trying to do.

We got more physical with guys like Montador and Mayers and Carcillo, but how is that going to work?

I still don't see us as trying to be a Nashville that grinds it out, keeps the D packed in, and rarely tries to rush the D or activate them deep.

I don't think we're a puck control team anymore either. We've got Brunette up there now and I'm not sold on him as a nifty skater. We've got Olesz and I have NO IDEA what his niche is. Mayers and Carcillo are goons.

So who the heck are we? Are we becoming a physical, fewer opportunities but stronger blue line grinding team, or are we still a puck control team that added some grit?

I'm afraid that we just don't have a personality and I'm not sure how some of these guys are going to fit into our lines or how we're going to mesh into a style, any style, that we can play.

So make me feel better... Who are we?

The reason for no #2 center, is because of a Sharp extension. I would rather have Sharp over the available ceter anyday.

You cant call them goons because they can play the game, and provide to the team

 

[Capt. Serious]

On a straight transaction basis, of course I'm a little cheesed that there were several two line centers we could have gotten that we just let get away. Talbot and several, several others were relatively cheap and would have allowed us to solidify our lines and move Sharp back to wing where I think he belongs. That said, that isn't even my biggest worry.

Who are we? That's my big problem...

A few years ago our D looked fantastic even though we didn't really have a tough, physical group. We didn't exactly have a bunch of Paul Coffey types either, but we moved the puck well. Other than the times Campbell would make some dumbass cross-ice pass in front of our netminder and turn it over, we were up to the task. Keith was playing like an animal and we just didn't have to face a lot of shots.

A lot of people forget that our defense didn't have to be great because we kept control of the puck in the offensive zone the majority of the time. We were skaters. Our D activated and stayed at THEIR blue line. We had plenty of nights we'd only give up 15-17 shots.

Granted, we weren't physical on either end of the ice, except maybe Bolland and Byflugien, but we controlled the action. Ladd gave us some gumption in front of the pipes too but in general we were a skating team that got outhit every night but had a TON of odd-man rushes and owned the puck.

Now I'm not sure what the hell we're trying to do.

We got more physical with guys like Montador and Mayers and Carcillo, but how is that going to work?

I still don't see us as trying to be a Nashville that grinds it out, keeps the D packed in, and rarely tries to rush the D or activate them deep.

I don't think we're a puck control team anymore either. We've got Brunette up there now and I'm not sold on him as a nifty skater. We've got Olesz and I have NO IDEA what his niche is. Mayers and Carcillo are goons.

So who the heck are we? Are we becoming a physical, fewer opportunities but stronger blue line grinding team, or are we still a puck control team that added some grit?

I'm afraid that we just don't have a personality and I'm not sure how some of these guys are going to fit into our lines or how we're going to mesh into a style, any style, that we can play.

So make me feel better... Who are we?

C'mon man stop being silly. Stan Bowman is god to people here.

Every move he makes is the greatest thing.

 

[icehogfan08]

C'mon man stop being silly. Stan Bowman is god to people here.

Every move he makes is the greatest thing.

:talktohand:
I guess nobody compares to Ken Holland though

 

[bobferg]

I agree with you, but at the same time the league evolves all the time.

It doesn't hurt to try something else, and its not like we got rid of all the puck movers.

 

[DMelt36]

On a straight transaction basis, of course I'm a little cheesed that there were several two line centers we could have gotten that we just let get away. Talbot and several, several others were relatively cheap and would have allowed us to solidify our lines and move Sharp back to wing where I think he belongs. That said, that isn't even my biggest worry.

I liked most of what you wrote and you made some great points, but I don't understand this part. Who were these second line centers that were relatively cheap?

Max Talbot's career high for points is 22. I see no top 6 potential there. Fourth line center? Sure, but not second.

I'll take Sharp at center over any of the other guys that were available for a reasonable price (aka not Brad Richards)

 

[LonghornBob]

My pick would have been Boyle the RFA from NYR, but we could also have had Handzus or Gagne at reasonable prices and put Sharp back on a wing. Connally wasn't too much more...

 

[bobferg]

My pick would have been Boyle the RFA from NYR, but we could also have had Handzus or Gagne at reasonable prices and put Sharp back on a wing. Connally wasn't too much more...

Connally without the injury concerns would have been ideal.

But other then him, Sharp > all

 

[icehogfan08]

My pick would have been Boyle the RFA from NYR, but we could also have had Handzus or Gagne at reasonable prices and put Sharp back on a wing. Connally wasn't too much more...

Boyle would have been good, but he would cost as a RFA. Plus the Rangers could match if we got him cheap enough. Handzus has alays been a #3 center, and had is chance in Chicago. Gagne is a winger not a center, and Connolly is so injury prone I wuld nver have wasted any mone on him. Again the reason there is no #2 center is because of the Sharp extension. Once they see what he is going to cost they can play with the cap, which is why Bowman said he'd like to save room at the deadline. His plan could be to get Sharp locked up and get that Center at the deadline.

Connally without the injury concerns would have been ideal.

But other then him, Sharp > all

Agree

I also dont get some fans. People complained last season we don't have the toughness or grit, this off-season we get the best thatcan bring us that grit and people complain about there not goingto be skill. This team has a mix of both, and is going to be very tough to play against with offense and toughness.

 

[tbo41fan]

On a straight transaction basis, of course I'm a little cheesed that there were several two line centers we could have gotten that we just let get away. Talbot and several, several others were relatively cheap and would have allowed us to solidify our lines and move Sharp back to wing where I think he belongs. That said, that isn't even my biggest worry.

Talbot is not a #2 center, and although I agree he would be better on the wing, nobody was available that would be better at center than he would (except Richards except he was expensive)

Who are we? That's my big problem...

A few years ago our D looked fantastic even though we didn't really have a tough, physical group. We didn't exactly have a bunch of Paul Coffey types either, but we moved the puck well. Other than the times Campbell would make some dumbass cross-ice pass in front of our netminder and turn it over, we were up to the task. Keith was playing like an animal and we just didn't have to face a lot of shots.

A lot of people forget that our defense didn't have to be great because we kept control of the puck in the offensive zone the majority of the time. We were skaters. Our D activated and stayed at THEIR blue line. We had plenty of nights we'd only give up 15-17 shots.

Granted, we weren't physical on either end of the ice, except maybe Bolland and Byflugien, but we controlled the action. Ladd gave us some gumption in front of the pipes too but in general we were a skating team that got outhit every night but had a TON of odd-man rushes and owned the puck.

Now I'm not sure what the hell we're trying to do.

We got more physical with guys like Montador and Mayers and Carcillo, but how is that going to work?

Well, we wont know entirely how it all will work out, but we can guess..

Alot determines on how Carcillo will play...if he plays like he did in PHX, we got a steal of a deal...if he plays like he did in PHI, we will have problems...

Mayers, Carcillo make our 4th line 10 fold better than last year which will only benefit our top 5 as Q wont be as hesitant about playing his 4th line and our top lines can rest more..

Same on defense...Keith, Seabs have long summers to relax and refocus, and now with DEPTH, again they wont have to carry as much of the load

I still don't see us as trying to be a Nashville that grinds it out, keeps the D packed in, and rarely tries to rush the D or activate them deep.

I don't think we're a puck control team anymore either. We've got Brunette up there now and I'm not sold on him as a nifty skater. We've got Olesz and I have NO IDEA what his niche is. Mayers and Carcillo are goons.

So who the heck are we? Are we becoming a physical, fewer opportunities but stronger blue line grinding team, or are we still a puck control team that added some grit?

I'm afraid that we just don't have a personality and I'm not sure how some of these guys are going to fit into our lines or how we're going to mesh into a style, any style, that we can play.

So make me feel better... Who are we?

Bolded part=false


I agree with icehog here...

We are both...we still have one of the best top 6 in the league and we even added a career 20-25 goal scorer...

Our defense got an upgrade automatically by getting a summer to rest up after the last 2 grueling seasons, and now we have 7-8 QUALITY defenseman where if we have an injury, it wont be detrimental like last year where our only replacements were Scott and Hendry



IMO, we are in for an exciting year...will we finish ahead of the red wings in the central? MAYBE, but probably not.

We are definately at the lowest a 4th seed in the west, and will be much more dangerous than last year

 

[dabynsky]

Well, we wont know entirely how it all will work out, but we can guess..

Alot determines on how Carcillo will play...if he plays like he did in PHX, we got a steal of a deal...if he plays like he did in PHI, we will have problems...

Mayers, Carcillo make our 4th line 10 fold better than last year which will only benefit our top 5 as Q wont be as hesitant about playing his 4th line and our top lines can rest more..

Same on defense...Keith, Seabs have long summers to relax and refocus, and now with DEPTH, again they wont have to carry as much of the load


Our defense got an upgrade automatically by getting a summer to rest up after the last 2 grueling seasons, and now we have 7-8 QUALITY defenseman where if we have an injury, it wont be detrimental like last year where our only replacements were Scott and Hendry



IMO, we are in for an exciting year...will we finish ahead of the red wings in the central? MAYBE, but probably not.

We are definately at the lowest a 4th seed in the west, and will be much more dangerous than last year

This is the biggest part of the offseason that isn't getting enough press. The players that were added provide depth, and that was the biggest thing missing last season. I would love to add another top center to be the number 2 center, but having the various guys we added on cost efficient one year deals puts this team in position to be able to add at the deadline for the first time in 3 years. The top players on this team had to play extremely long minutes because Q had no faith in the bottom of the roster.

The top guys were also coming off finishing in the Western Conference Finals one season, then winning the Stanley Cup and some of the most important players playing in the Gold Medal game at the Olympics. Having a year off from a deep run in the playoffs should improve the play of Keith and a few others.

I think saying that this team is at worst a 4th seed is a bit optimistic, but this is a team that is capable of making the playoffs and doing some damage once they get there. It all depends on how these new pieces mesh with the core which we won't find the answer out until the season starts, however.

 

[Everyday I'm Byfuglien]

Man enough with the 2nd line center talk.

This team isnt deep in the center position, but the forward position and goal production was not an area that really needed a lot of attention this off season. The Hawks had the 4th highest goal total last year. Offensively theyre good.

The team had problems with defense, toughness and the PENALTY KILL. The moves made in the off season were not sexy attention grabbing moves, but they addressed the teams needs.

 

[dabynsky]

Man enough with the 2nd line center talk.

This team isnt deep in the center position, but the forward position and goal production was not an area that really needed a lot of attention this off season. The Hawks had the 4th highest goal total last year. Offensively theyre good.

The team had problems with defense, toughness and the PENALTY KILL. The moves made in the off season were not sexy attention grabbing moves, but they addressed the teams needs.

Can't really disagree with anything here. I will say that counting on Bolland isn't a wise bet given his injury history, but you are right this is a team that didn't have problem putting up points. It did have a problem keeping the puck out of the net, however, especially with the lead.

 

[Captain Iago]

Man enough with the 2nd line center talk.

This team isnt deep in the center position, but the forward position and goal production was not an area that really needed a lot of attention this off season. The Hawks had the 4th highest goal total last year. Offensively theyre good.

The team had problems with defense, toughness and the PENALTY KILL. The moves made in the off season were not sexy attention grabbing moves, but they addressed the teams needs.

Agreed; however, flipping Soup is kinda a sexy move, though, no matter the return.

 

[Everyday I'm Byfuglien]

Agreed; however, flipping Soup is kinda a sexy move, though, no matter the return.

Yeah, I should have added cap space as one of the problems the team had.

 

[Capt. Serious]

Cap space is fine. Not having depth at center isn't.

Bolland goes down like he normally does, this team is in deep shit at center.

Vinny Prospal is there. Rather have him & RJ than Fossil Mayers.

People drool over him for some god knows reason. (Mayers)

Bieksa will do the same shit when we play em.

 

[southern_cross_116]

Th truth is that they probably have the money to sign Prospal if they want him (although -he is a winger)... which makes lumping him in with the centre discussions (old or no), not really entirely relevant unless talking about potential lines.

He also was coming off of a knee injury (iirc)... but did ok after coming back.

Team has Toews, Sharp, Bolland, and whoever at 4th line centre.

___

Again, though it all comes down to: what are they going to do with what they got... not "wudda, shudda, cudda" - that's stuff for Cub fans to try to therapize themselves out of why it is that they have never won anything in over a century - and it isn't looking good this season for them either (you have to think back to the "cult of the 1969 Cubs' choke" as well as various "curses" -in order to get out of that vicious mental cycle.

Ok, so Mayers is on the team... what does he bring to the team? He does faceoffs... Anything else? Not sure.... Yanick Perrault did faceoffs a couple of years ago too - but I think you could say he had limited use elsewhere... although looking back at his career -there was a guy that the Hawks could have drafted but passed on - he had some top numbers in the Quebec Juniors ... of course lots of teams passed on him, and he became a journeyman - ending up as a faceoff guy for the hawks after they wheeled him out to the circle. He retired after that season.

Ok, the point being -is that the philosophy on the team (mind you Perrault was in the Tallon years) is on faceoff guys... and Mayers seems to fit that same old, even though he sort of plays all of the forward positions. I don't think he is particularly good offensively or defensively, and I would be surprised if he was on a rotational basis, familiar with doing beer runs from the press box. . . same goes for a fair few of the depth guys.

Otoh, that seems to be the point going the depth route. It also might be an over-correction from the lack of the depth experienced last season. The season before ( 2009-10 ), it was pretty nice to be able to put out 9 regular forwards and plug in whomever on the 4th line... I would bet that Bolland, had he been healthy for more of that season would have been the 3rd line center. It was nice that Brouwer was a functional piece of that team, however, aside from Toews and I think Hossa, everyone in that team's top 9 played all over the place. . . that type of versatility is tough to find.

Does this season's team have it? Well who knows, but it sort of depends upon the consistency of the top 9 forwards (same as 2009-10).

Basically the keys to the forward position this coming season, as I see it will be

If Brunette can hack it with the team's top 6.

If Bolland can stay healthy. (And assumes that still equates to performing as a 2 way centre).

Assumes Frolik and Olesz play on the 3rd line, and how they perform; Frolik's goals were down last season -but his assists were up... (although his numbers with the Hawks were off the pace he had set with the Panthers before being traded) and Olesz appears to have been an underachiever... the question being how will both of those guys, with arguable off years bounce back (or will they be able to). I don't think either Frolik or Olesz are 4th line material -so I think the idea with the team might be to bank on having a 3rd line that can sneak under opposing tems' radars and provide some scoring.

-Will they? dunno, no idea...

Now, too, Bolland might be slotted as 2nd line center and put one of the rookies at 3rd line -still the same question ... how will they work out?

Maybe I'll get to the D in another post later... (no promises)

___

Edited to add:

All that being said - I would be on the horn seeing if I could sign Prospal for cheap on a one year deal.. what the hey, if they got the money and don't have to commit past this season ... something like that could be worth it... low risk of a downside and have no impact on retaining Patrick Sharp.