OT: Agent says that Spain's Rubio To Enter Draft

[Manic Devourer]

Spanish point guard Ricky Rubio will declare for the 2009 NBA Draft, according to his agent.

Dan Fegan told ESPN from Barcelona on Monday afternoon that he's confident that the guard will keep his name in the draft.

"Ricky will be in the 2009 draft," Fegan said of Rubio, who is considered the best young international player in the world.

He's special," one NBA GM told ESPN.com. "There aren't many kids you'll find at his age with such a terrific feel for the game. He just knows how to play. When he gets out there with players 10 years older than him, he just looks like he belongs. He'll have some adjusting to do in the NBA, but the truth is, he's as NBA ready as most of the college kids that are coming out. He's playing on a very big world stage."

http://basketball.realgm.com/src_wiretap_archives/58672/20090420/agent_spains_rubio_to_enter_draft/

 

[Morten Jensen]

Hello 2nd overall.

Most hyped international guard in history. I think his lack of athleticism will hurt him in the beginning. But his court vision and general approach to the game is elite. I have no idea what to expect. I don't expect him to become anything close to Rose as it looks right now.

Should be interesting. I really hope he goes to Minnesota. They need some talent, and I've always liked their team.

 

[Newskoolbulls]

Morten Jensen wrote:

Hello 2nd overall.

Most hyped international guard in history. I think his lack of athleticism will hurt him in the beginning. But his court vision and general approach to the game is elite. I have no idea what to expect. I don't expect him to become anything close to Rose as it looks right now.

Should be interesting. I really hope he goes to Minnesota. They need some talent, and I've always liked their team.

egh I could carless about Rubio. If I am the Suns I offer Barbosa and picks to get Rubio.

 

[Rose1]

John Wall will go overall if he enters.

 

[Newskoolbulls]

doubt it. Blake will go first.

 

[Rose1]

The PG position is the most crucial and with Blake abilities, he will have more flaws on the next level opposed to Wall. Wall upside is to large. His wingspan and leaping ability, not to mention his speed is in the Great Wall land.

 

[Morten Jensen]

Newskoolbulls wrote:

egh I could carless about Rubio. If I am the Suns I offer Barbosa and picks to get Rubio.

The Suns would get an instant no from that. So why even make that sort of offer? He's highly touted due to his defense, which might already (at age 18) be worthy of all-nba defensive teams. He's got the most remarkable anticipation on steal I've ever seen. However, the NBA is just much better athletes. So he might struggle early in that department too. But make no mistake. The kid is good.

I'm only questioning what to expect from him early on. I do doubt he'll ever become much like Rose as an offensive threat, but as a half-court point guard, I think he'll be fantastic.

This helps us tremendously BTW. Everybody else just moved a pick back in the draft.

 

[Newskoolbulls]

Rubio will struggle to contain NBA PGs. Deron, Chris, Derrick, Russell etc. I dont trust international athletes until I see them play a season or two here. I could careless how he played over there.

 

[Hendu0520]

Yah the foreign players are hyped so much yet there still are very few great ones. Dirk, Yao, Parker, Ginoboli and that's about it. I don't count Nash. Rubio might make 1 all star team but if I am picking 2nd in the draft I would want an allstar player. I think someone will take him way too high, he is slow and speed is the game now. He is a small upgrade from Zoran Planinic the guard that played for the Nets. Plus most of the successful foreign players are big men or shooters, he's no sharpshooter, and besides Parker and Ginoboli are extremely quick. It would be interesting to see him on Minnesota but I think stupid D'Antoni will pick him in NY and they will suck and not get Lebron.

 

[JimmyBulls]

I think Rubio is more euro-hype then anything else. I would be pleasantly surprised if he has a better career than White Chocolate.

I hope he stays in because this draft need as much top heavy talent as possible. Because of Rubio's presence, it's safe to say there is another team in the draft that won't be drafting Evans or Williams in the lottery.

 

[Morten Jensen]

I think it's ridiculous to throw away his accomplishments due to him being european. The Euroleague compares nicely with the NCAA when it comes to overall talent. The US has more athleticism, I'll never doubt that. However european players shouldn't be high on the bust scale.

Nowitzki, P. Gasol, Parker, Diaw, M. Gasol, Fernandez etc. The European players have gotten increasingly better which has also raised the overall level of play in Euroleague. Spanish players in particular are being prepared for the NBA game and is trying to speed their game up more to match the intensity.

Look, I'm not saying Rubio is a 100% sure thing. Dismiss him if you don't think his talent will translate But don't dismiss him due to his nationality. That's just ignorant.

 

[dougthonus]

Morten Jensen wrote:

I think it's ridiculous to throw away his accomplishments due to him being european. The Euroleague compares nicely with the NCAA when it comes to overall talent. The US has more athleticism, I'll never doubt that. However european players shouldn't be high on the bust scale.

There are very few European players who go on to be good NBA players relative to NCAA players though the population size of the NCAA is probably far larger. All Euroleagues combined may have as many players as D1 schools combined, but they're mostly guys who are older and way past their draft age.

As a percentage of legitimate prospects, I'm not sure that Europe is any better or worse than the NBA. The mistakes people have made in Europe are similar to the ones they make with US players too. Taking guys based purely on physicals and hoping the rest can figure itself out.

Rubio is going to be a fricken stud I think. What's hard to remember about this kid is that he's 18. He needs to work on his shot still, but it's pretty good for an 18 year old. He needs to get in the weight room too and improve his athleticism, but he has jaw dropping court vision already.

He's been one of the elite players in Europe since 17 and was playing at a very high level at 16. You can't look at him as a finished product. You have to remember how far he has to go in his learning curve still.

 

[dougthonus]

(and I'm not meaning to make it look like you were disagreeing with me Mort, I was just commenting on the competition level and then went off on a tangent)

 

[dougthonus]

I do agree that Rubio will get murdered defensively in the NBA initially though.

 

[Morten Jensen]

dougthonus wrote:

There are very few European players who go on to be good NBA players relative to NCAA players though the population size of the NCAA is probably far larger. All Euroleagues combined may have as many players as D1 schools combined, but they're mostly guys who are older and way past their draft age.

Which is exactly the problem. Many of those older guys never really got a chance to prove themselves in the NBA, simply because their time of youth was spent in an era where international talent wasn't as common.

Then we also have the annoying little problem with mid-round picks. The players simply choose to remain in europe because their team will pay them significally more than what the rookie scale suggests. I'd say a good chunk of NBA caliber players are currently in the Euroleague only due to money.

As a percentage of legitimate prospects, I'm not sure that Europe is any better or worse than the NBA. The mistakes people have made in Europe are similar to the ones they make with US players too. Taking guys based purely on physicals and hoping the rest can figure itself out.

And also taking shooters who are just that and nothing more. Juan Carlos Navarro was a hot topic for a long time and people thought he'd be huge. Navarro himself stated several times he was a shooter and not a creator. This was even apparent in international competition.

Also, some players tend to remain in their european clubs to get the star tag. They want to be out there 30 minutes a night and see kids wear their jerseys. In the NBA, they might be role players and that's simply not preferable to them. And again, we move back to dollars and cents. A euro star can make upwards to $6 million or even $8 million a year. In the NBA, their role could be worth $2 million.

Rubio is going to be a fricken stud I think. What's hard to remember about this kid is that he's 18. He needs to work on his shot still, but it's pretty good for an 18 year old. He needs to get in the weight room too and improve his athleticism, but he has jaw dropping court vision already.

My thoughts exactly. He desperately needs work on his scoring game, but no one has ever stated otherwise. He's a defensive-minded, pass first point guard with excellent rebounding skills. The best comparison right now is Rajon Rondo, only with better court-vision and less quicknes.

 

[Morten Jensen]

dougthonus wrote:

(and I'm not meaning to make it look like you were disagreeing with me Mort, I was just commenting on the competition level and then went off on a tangent)

I know.

I've seen you post since 2004. Your habbits are well known to me, by now

 

[dougthonus]

Which is exactly the problem. Many of those older guys never really got a chance to prove themselves in the NBA, simply because their time of youth was spent in an era where international talent wasn't as common.

Then we also have the annoying little problem with mid-round picks. The players simply choose to remain in europe because their team will pay them significally more than what the rookie scale suggests. I'd say a good chunk of NBA caliber players are currently in the Euroleague only due to money.

I think there are very few European players who could go to the NBA and do more than be role players even if they had come over earlier. The total number of people playing might be similar to D1 basketball, but that represents the age groups of 15-35. D1 basketball represents the age groups of 18-22 in the US.

I'd say the top 1% of European basketball players can probably make it in the NBA similar to the top 1% of D1 NCAA guys, but there are probably still 30x as many guys going through the D1 system.

Also, some players tend to remain in their european clubs to get the star tag. They want to be out there 30 minutes a night and see kids wear their jerseys. In the NBA, they might be role players and that's simply not preferable to them. And again, we move back to dollars and cents. A euro star can make upwards to $6 million or even $8 million a year. In the NBA, their role could be worth $2 million.

The salary thing is an issue, but extraordinarily few European guys get paid as much as you're suggesting, and their contracts aren't guaranteed. If you get a 10 million dollar deal in the NBA (3/10) then you're getting a legit $10 million. If you get a 3/10 in Europe, then it's only good as long as you don't get hurt and play at a high level. Even then they'll pay you late and force you to sue them.

 

[Morten Jensen]

The salaries have really increased over the past two years. $8 million is of course at the very top, but it's not uncommon to see $6M contracts handed out to a team's best player if he's been with them for a long time.

Keep in mind that the clubs often pay the players taxes too as an incentive. That goes a long way in total earnings as well. Plus; commercials, merchandise and public recgonition has come a long way. So the star players are often seen in commercials where they get a pretty penny. A role player in the NBA is almost never seen in that, and thus isn't getting PR money.

Point taken about the non-guarenteed deals. It's a big problem for a lot of players. I've heard a rumour about this, but please note strongly that it's a rumour.

The non-guarenteed contracts really came into much effect after more and more americans came over. Apparently, a lot of euro team owners believe american players have attitude problems and have tendencies to either not fit in, or play selfish. So they decided on a strict contract policy in order to have the right to remove those player if they wished. Again, it's a rumour and nothing else. It hasn't been officially reported, and a lot of owners have denied it. Speaking as an European, I don't know if it's true or not. Some teams really seem anti-american to me, whereas others practically roll out the red carpet for them. So I have no idea if that rumour carries any merit.

 

[dougthonus]

Morten Jensen wrote:

The salaries have really increased over the past two years. $8 million is of course at the very top, but it's not uncommon to see $6M contracts handed out to a team's best player if he's been with them for a long time.

This has been true for 1-2 years though and only when the exchange rate was through the roof. It doesn't mean anything for all the guys in the past 15 years which you suggested. It also is almost certainly going to be over this summer. You won't see those deals going to European players in a down economy.

European basketball as a whole is run at massive net losses for all the teams with high payrolls.

Keep in mind that the clubs often pay the players taxes too as an incentive. That goes a long way in total earnings as well. Plus; commercials, merchandise and public recgonition has come a long way. So the star players are often seen in commercials where they get a pretty penny. A role player in the NBA is almost never seen in that, and thus isn't getting PR money.

The contracts are compared to 8 million US after you take the taxes into account, you're doubling the benefit there. The lack of any real guarantee on your money vastly overwhelms any benefit as well.

Point taken about the non-guarenteed deals. It's a big problem for a lot of players. I've heard a rumour about this, but please note strongly that it's a rumour.

The non-guarenteed contracts really came into much effect after more and more americans came over. Apparently, a lot of euro team owners believe american players have attitude problems and have tendencies to either not fit in, or play selfish. So they decided on a strict contract policy in order to have the right to remove those player if they wished. Again, it's a rumour and nothing else. It hasn't been officially reported, and a lot of owners have denied it. Speaking as an European, I don't know if it's true or not. Some teams really seem anti-american to me, whereas others practically roll out the red carpet for them. So I have no idea if that rumour carries any merit.

The thing is, they don't have non-guaranteed contracts. The contracts ARE guaranteed. The teams just don't pay them. I wouldn't be surprised if this practice comes up a lot more with American players than European ones. Especially when an American has to go sue them in a local (often corrupt) court.

People have to treat the deals as non-guaranteed regardless of what the contract actually says.

 

[Morten Jensen]

dougthonus wrote:

I think there are very few European players who could go to the NBA and do more than be role players even if they had come over earlier. The total number of people playing might be similar to D1 basketball, but that represents the age groups of 15-35. D1 basketball represents the age groups of 18-22 in the US.

I'd say the top 1% of European basketball players can probably make it in the NBA similar to the top 1% of D1 NCAA guys, but there are probably still 30x as many guys going through the D1 system.

Even so, the competition doesn't vary much. The US is still obviously the more talented and more talent producing area. My point in this is that european play has stepped up to the level of quality the NCAA presents. 15-20 years ago, euroleage teams would probably have been kicked in the mouth by an average D1 team.

It's just a simple measuring stick.

Euroleague have 30 year olds on their roster which of course upsets the balance. But disregarding the talent in europe seems silly in my eyes, when there's been downright scary improvements in quality and increased quantity of good young players.

Of course I'm not arguing that european talent can match what is produced in the US. That'd be crazy. I'm merely saying that the NCAA and Euroleague compares nicely in terms of talent. But that still speaks volumes of american ball, as the NCAA is kids from 18-23 and Euroleague is from 16-40.