scottiepippen1994
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Too all those who have been arguing for months over "Pippen was this, Pippen was that", let it be boken down for all the non believers and Pip Haters.
Who is Scottie Pippen? Is he that hotheaded malcontent who walked out on the Bulls when Phil Jackson called the final shot for Toni Kukoc? Is he that bitter old man who, a few years ago, touted how great he was as a player, even greater than His Airness himself? Or was he simply the second best player on the Bulls' championship teams: the Robin to Jordan's Batman?
I don't really know how to quantify the comparisons with Robin, since there seems to have been a jillion different versions of Robin. Personally, I need to reach into my inner nerd to bring out another comparison
ippen mayhavebeentheRobin to MJ's Batman as a player, but otherwise, he was essentially the Oracle of the team (that's Batgirl after she was paralyzed).
Barbara Gordon - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
As Oracle, Barbara Gordon was Batman's intellectual equal, a brilliant computer genius who operated as Batman's eyes and ears in places he couldn't reach, hear, or see. As great as Jordan was (I'll get to that in a second), he honestly couldn't have won 6 championships without Pippen.
Jordan (and Batman) may have been absolutely brilliant, but he also had trouble communicating what he wanted to express to his teammates. You can see that in his development of Kwame Brown: if you weren't up to the task of playing athislevel,MJ would rip you to shreds and destroy your confidence. Let's face it: MJ the player, just like Batman, was a complete a$$hole. That smiling, affable young man dressed nattily in a suit during press conferences, endorsing Big Macs with Larry Bird, and hawking Gatorade in commercials? That young man was Bruce Wayne - the charismatic billionaire alter-ego, that thin facade that hid the deep torment within.
So as Oracle, what was Pippen's role on those Bull's teams (besides being the second best player)? He was the de facto coach on the court. Jordan may have possessed that legendary work ethic which was highly inspiring to his teammates, but he couldn't communicate this inspiration or his desire to win in light and easy manner. Pippen, the eyes and ears on the court, provided this communication by encouraging his teammates and listening to what they had to say.
What else was Pippen? The master of the triangleoffense. Besides Tex Winter and Phil Jackson, no other person was better versed in the triple-post offense. Certainly not MJ (who needed quite some time to figure it out when he first learned it). On offense, Pippen directed his teammates on which spot to go to, when to go to that spot, and how to go to that spot. In fact, Phil Jackson recognized that Pippen in his later years with the Blazers would direct his teammates on defense on when and how to go to certain spots in order to disrupt the Lakers' triangle offense schemes.
Anything else? Pippen was the master of the Bull's defense. Just as on offense, he directed his teammates on how to play their man and when to go to a certain spot. In fact, of all the players on that Bulls' team, he was the only one given leeway in coaching the players on defense. Not even MJ was given thisleeway. Once, after Phil Jackson noticed a Bulls player had broken a defensive assignment, Jackson asked the player why he did that. The player answered, "Scottie told me to go there." Jackson simply shrugged, and said, "Okay".
The comparisons between Pippen and Oracle are quite striking. I'm personally amazed that I was able to think it up on the spot.
Over the years, many fans and critics have been yearning to remove players from the "NBA's 50 Greatest Players" list in order to put in their new favorite players. A name frequently, if not always, mentioned is Pippen's. And I can tell you right now: I will defend Pippen's placement on that list against anybody. He really was that important of a player.
That said, the question remains: did Jordan really make Pippen and the rest of his teammates better?
My answer?
Yes, yes he did.
I'm not detracting from anything that Pippen did. And Ludachris: I don't agree with your argument that Jordan was simply a super great player on thatteam,nothing more, nothing less. From the books I've read on greatand/ornotoriouspeople - such as Robert Caro's The Power Broker, a biography on Robert Moses - brilliant leaders can inspire their underlings not just through sheer brilliance,but also working harder than anyone else.
And Jordan fits this example perfectly. As important as Scottie Pippen was on those teams as the de facto player-coach; as important as Phil Jackson was as a coach-mediator; as important as Tex Winter was as the creator of the triangleoffense; as important as Jerry Krause was as the evaluator of talent (he picked up Pippen, Grant, Kukoc, and others); nobody was as important on that team as Michael Jordan was. He was the leader of that team and its most important piece.
His obsessive hatred for losing and ultra-competitiveness has made him a complete a$$hole elsewhere in the world: cheating in cards against his UNC teammate/roommate's, Buzz Peterson's, mother; storming off whenever he lost a game of pool; betting vast amounts of money playing golf and card. But in the NBA, and on a team with the support system to accept this hyper-competitiveness, it was a match made in heaven.
Nobody worked out more, practiced more, and honed his skills on the Bulls. Heck, or anybody in the NBA for that matter. He certainly wasn't required to push himself to such levels by the Bulls, given that he was their best player already.Butherequired himself to do so. And this work ethic rubbed off on his teammates, who thought, "The absolute best player in the league, no questions asked, is still working his ass off more than anyone else? Well, I'm going to start to work my assoffaswell!" If anyone was lolly-gagging, Jordan would have kicked his ass, literally and figuratively,and shoved him right out the door. See Sellers, Brad for an example.
So no question about it: Jordan elevated the play of his teammates simply by inspiring them with his competitiveness and relentless training, and by making them work as hard as he did.
That said, this hyper-aggressiveness and competitiveness only worked because a perfect storm brewed at the right time. Phil Jackson, that smart-as hell, bigger-than-life figure who used psychological mind games to get what he wanted, was the Bull's new head coach. He was able to get the whole team on the same page almost immediately.
Krause, a glory hog who was always bitter about not getting the credit he was supposedly due, was a brilliant scout who had a great eye for talent. He saw guys like Pippen and Grant, and knew that they were immensely valuable. As a GM, however, he almost destroyed the 97-98 Bulls, which I will explain a bit lateron.
Pippen.....I don't even need to explain anymore about how valuable he was for the Bulls. That said, he was not a "Franchise Player" as MJ was. But as the out-of-the-spotlight (again, just like Oracle) player-coach for the Bulls, he thrived.
Unfortunately, Pippen had a couple of incidents that almost destroyed his reputation. I already mentioned the Kukoc incident of the 94 playoffs. Another happened in the 97-98 season.
See, Pippen came from a very poor family in Arkansas, so he pounced on the first chance he had to sign a long-term contract. He signed a multi-year contract worth a couple of million per year back in the early 90's - that made him one of the better-paid players at the time. The problem, of course, was that he couldn't foresee the vastly inflated salaries that were to come a few years later. Think Glenn Robinson's and Jim McIlvaine's ludicrous contracts (Robinson's less so, because he had the talent out of college but was lazy afterwards, but McIlvaine's contract...wow). Thiswasn't Pippen's fault, though - nobody could have foreseen who outlandishly players were going to be paid.
So in 97, he was being paid on par with or less than some of his teammates were getting paid, and over 10 times less than MJ was being paid at the time. Check out at the bottom of this page:
1997-98 Chicago Bulls Roster and Statistics - Basketball-Reference.com
He tried to renegotiate with Krause and Jerry Reinsdorf, but neither would hear him out. Like Krause, Pippen always had a bit of a Napoleon Complex when it came to feeling recognized for his achievements. As the second best player on that team (given his statements from a few years back, he might have even thought of himself as the best player) he demanded to be paid like one. But Krause, stillbitterabouthis own supposed lack of recognition, refused to even consider it. In fact, he refused to even keep that Bulls team together any longer than the rest of that season because he wanted to show everyone that he was the most important part of the team. Krause wanted to build a championship team from scratch with no MJ, no Pippen, no Rodman, no Phil Jackson - well, we know how that ended, right?
So Pippen sulked. He refused to rehab his leg injury properly, and almost decided to sit out the season completely in protest. It certainly didn't help that Krause, for whatever reason, decided to join the team on the road and ride in the same bus. Rather than remove himself from the day-to-day lives of his players, he made himself a target of their frustrations by joining them in their world. Not surprisingly, Jordan and Pippen were absolutely relentless against Krause, insulting him around every turn and with chance they got.
The season was salvaged only through the intervention of Phil Jackson, master motivator and manipulator. He convinced Pippen to put aside his financial squabbles, nurse his bruised ego, properly rehab his injury, play out the season and aim for a championship, and then earn his riches next season onward. And the rest is history!!!!!!!!!!!!!:bow:
END OF STORY........Everything you Pippen haters and false propoganda preachers say from here on in regards to the subjet will be nothing but spewed vomit. So just keep your mouths shut and swallow your own puke.......:bigfinger:
SO GIVE IT UP PEOPLE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!:rolling:
Who is Scottie Pippen? Is he that hotheaded malcontent who walked out on the Bulls when Phil Jackson called the final shot for Toni Kukoc? Is he that bitter old man who, a few years ago, touted how great he was as a player, even greater than His Airness himself? Or was he simply the second best player on the Bulls' championship teams: the Robin to Jordan's Batman?
I don't really know how to quantify the comparisons with Robin, since there seems to have been a jillion different versions of Robin. Personally, I need to reach into my inner nerd to bring out another comparison
ippen mayhavebeentheRobin to MJ's Batman as a player, but otherwise, he was essentially the Oracle of the team (that's Batgirl after she was paralyzed).Barbara Gordon - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
As Oracle, Barbara Gordon was Batman's intellectual equal, a brilliant computer genius who operated as Batman's eyes and ears in places he couldn't reach, hear, or see. As great as Jordan was (I'll get to that in a second), he honestly couldn't have won 6 championships without Pippen.
Jordan (and Batman) may have been absolutely brilliant, but he also had trouble communicating what he wanted to express to his teammates. You can see that in his development of Kwame Brown: if you weren't up to the task of playing athislevel,MJ would rip you to shreds and destroy your confidence. Let's face it: MJ the player, just like Batman, was a complete a$$hole. That smiling, affable young man dressed nattily in a suit during press conferences, endorsing Big Macs with Larry Bird, and hawking Gatorade in commercials? That young man was Bruce Wayne - the charismatic billionaire alter-ego, that thin facade that hid the deep torment within.
So as Oracle, what was Pippen's role on those Bull's teams (besides being the second best player)? He was the de facto coach on the court. Jordan may have possessed that legendary work ethic which was highly inspiring to his teammates, but he couldn't communicate this inspiration or his desire to win in light and easy manner. Pippen, the eyes and ears on the court, provided this communication by encouraging his teammates and listening to what they had to say.
What else was Pippen? The master of the triangleoffense. Besides Tex Winter and Phil Jackson, no other person was better versed in the triple-post offense. Certainly not MJ (who needed quite some time to figure it out when he first learned it). On offense, Pippen directed his teammates on which spot to go to, when to go to that spot, and how to go to that spot. In fact, Phil Jackson recognized that Pippen in his later years with the Blazers would direct his teammates on defense on when and how to go to certain spots in order to disrupt the Lakers' triangle offense schemes.
Anything else? Pippen was the master of the Bull's defense. Just as on offense, he directed his teammates on how to play their man and when to go to a certain spot. In fact, of all the players on that Bulls' team, he was the only one given leeway in coaching the players on defense. Not even MJ was given thisleeway. Once, after Phil Jackson noticed a Bulls player had broken a defensive assignment, Jackson asked the player why he did that. The player answered, "Scottie told me to go there." Jackson simply shrugged, and said, "Okay".
The comparisons between Pippen and Oracle are quite striking. I'm personally amazed that I was able to think it up on the spot.
Over the years, many fans and critics have been yearning to remove players from the "NBA's 50 Greatest Players" list in order to put in their new favorite players. A name frequently, if not always, mentioned is Pippen's. And I can tell you right now: I will defend Pippen's placement on that list against anybody. He really was that important of a player.
That said, the question remains: did Jordan really make Pippen and the rest of his teammates better?
My answer?
Yes, yes he did.
I'm not detracting from anything that Pippen did. And Ludachris: I don't agree with your argument that Jordan was simply a super great player on thatteam,nothing more, nothing less. From the books I've read on greatand/ornotoriouspeople - such as Robert Caro's The Power Broker, a biography on Robert Moses - brilliant leaders can inspire their underlings not just through sheer brilliance,but also working harder than anyone else.
And Jordan fits this example perfectly. As important as Scottie Pippen was on those teams as the de facto player-coach; as important as Phil Jackson was as a coach-mediator; as important as Tex Winter was as the creator of the triangleoffense; as important as Jerry Krause was as the evaluator of talent (he picked up Pippen, Grant, Kukoc, and others); nobody was as important on that team as Michael Jordan was. He was the leader of that team and its most important piece.
His obsessive hatred for losing and ultra-competitiveness has made him a complete a$$hole elsewhere in the world: cheating in cards against his UNC teammate/roommate's, Buzz Peterson's, mother; storming off whenever he lost a game of pool; betting vast amounts of money playing golf and card. But in the NBA, and on a team with the support system to accept this hyper-competitiveness, it was a match made in heaven.
Nobody worked out more, practiced more, and honed his skills on the Bulls. Heck, or anybody in the NBA for that matter. He certainly wasn't required to push himself to such levels by the Bulls, given that he was their best player already.Butherequired himself to do so. And this work ethic rubbed off on his teammates, who thought, "The absolute best player in the league, no questions asked, is still working his ass off more than anyone else? Well, I'm going to start to work my assoffaswell!" If anyone was lolly-gagging, Jordan would have kicked his ass, literally and figuratively,and shoved him right out the door. See Sellers, Brad for an example.
So no question about it: Jordan elevated the play of his teammates simply by inspiring them with his competitiveness and relentless training, and by making them work as hard as he did.
That said, this hyper-aggressiveness and competitiveness only worked because a perfect storm brewed at the right time. Phil Jackson, that smart-as hell, bigger-than-life figure who used psychological mind games to get what he wanted, was the Bull's new head coach. He was able to get the whole team on the same page almost immediately.
Krause, a glory hog who was always bitter about not getting the credit he was supposedly due, was a brilliant scout who had a great eye for talent. He saw guys like Pippen and Grant, and knew that they were immensely valuable. As a GM, however, he almost destroyed the 97-98 Bulls, which I will explain a bit lateron.
Pippen.....I don't even need to explain anymore about how valuable he was for the Bulls. That said, he was not a "Franchise Player" as MJ was. But as the out-of-the-spotlight (again, just like Oracle) player-coach for the Bulls, he thrived.
Unfortunately, Pippen had a couple of incidents that almost destroyed his reputation. I already mentioned the Kukoc incident of the 94 playoffs. Another happened in the 97-98 season.
See, Pippen came from a very poor family in Arkansas, so he pounced on the first chance he had to sign a long-term contract. He signed a multi-year contract worth a couple of million per year back in the early 90's - that made him one of the better-paid players at the time. The problem, of course, was that he couldn't foresee the vastly inflated salaries that were to come a few years later. Think Glenn Robinson's and Jim McIlvaine's ludicrous contracts (Robinson's less so, because he had the talent out of college but was lazy afterwards, but McIlvaine's contract...wow). Thiswasn't Pippen's fault, though - nobody could have foreseen who outlandishly players were going to be paid.
So in 97, he was being paid on par with or less than some of his teammates were getting paid, and over 10 times less than MJ was being paid at the time. Check out at the bottom of this page:
1997-98 Chicago Bulls Roster and Statistics - Basketball-Reference.com
He tried to renegotiate with Krause and Jerry Reinsdorf, but neither would hear him out. Like Krause, Pippen always had a bit of a Napoleon Complex when it came to feeling recognized for his achievements. As the second best player on that team (given his statements from a few years back, he might have even thought of himself as the best player) he demanded to be paid like one. But Krause, stillbitterabouthis own supposed lack of recognition, refused to even consider it. In fact, he refused to even keep that Bulls team together any longer than the rest of that season because he wanted to show everyone that he was the most important part of the team. Krause wanted to build a championship team from scratch with no MJ, no Pippen, no Rodman, no Phil Jackson - well, we know how that ended, right?
So Pippen sulked. He refused to rehab his leg injury properly, and almost decided to sit out the season completely in protest. It certainly didn't help that Krause, for whatever reason, decided to join the team on the road and ride in the same bus. Rather than remove himself from the day-to-day lives of his players, he made himself a target of their frustrations by joining them in their world. Not surprisingly, Jordan and Pippen were absolutely relentless against Krause, insulting him around every turn and with chance they got.
The season was salvaged only through the intervention of Phil Jackson, master motivator and manipulator. He convinced Pippen to put aside his financial squabbles, nurse his bruised ego, properly rehab his injury, play out the season and aim for a championship, and then earn his riches next season onward. And the rest is history!!!!!!!!!!!!!:bow:
END OF STORY........Everything you Pippen haters and false propoganda preachers say from here on in regards to the subjet will be nothing but spewed vomit. So just keep your mouths shut and swallow your own puke.......:bigfinger:
SO GIVE IT UP PEOPLE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!:rolling:
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