Why are the Pistons better than the Bulls?

[??? ??????]

This is a question that I want to see an answer to. At 8-12 (.400), the Pistons are setting with a better record than the Bulls, who are at 7-11 (.389).

The Pistons have been missing their second best player, Rip Hamilton, since the first game of the season. He has missed 19 games total.

The Pistons third best player, Tayshuan Prince, has missed 17 games on the season, and has been out since the 3rd game of the season.

The Pistons best player, Ben Gordon, suffered an ankle sprain, and missed 2 games from that. Since coming back, he has struggled dealing with the injury, only being able to play 21 MPG in the three games since his return.

Charlie Villanueva has missed 1 game on the season, and is the Pistons fourth best player. His various injuries have caused him to play less than 24 minutes in 6 of the Pistons' games this season.

Quite simply, the Pistons have been hit by injuries worse than anyone in the league. Yet they still have a better record than us. Why is that?

Strength of Schedule isn't really a factor here. Bulls are 5th in SOS for the season, and the Pistons are 6th, so they're pretty much in the same boat as far as SOS goes.

What is it that makes a team that is starting Rodney Stuckey, Chucky Atkins, Jonas Jerebko, Jason Maxiell, and Ben Wallace better than us?

Is it simply coaching? Is it that their hobbled players and scrubs are better than our core guys? A combination of both?

 

[Dpauley23]

The Bulls have tried to play half court so it could help them out on defense. It worked
at first, but the rebounding has sucked and thus so have we. We need to just run and win games by scoring not playing defense

 

[houheffna]

Last year, the Pistons were 4 games or so better than they are this year, with a better team. The Bulls last year were a game better than this year, with no Hinrich, but otherwise a relatively healthy team. The Bulls would eventually catch and pass the Pistons and make the playoffs. The Pistons did not. We are a quarter through the season. I would not be surprised if the same thing happens.

The bottom line is both teams are bad, and were no good from the first day of the season, not contenders or even fringe contenders. The Bulls should not feel any better about themselves because they have a better record than the Pistons...they should be worried about 2010.

 

[??? ??????]

houheffna wrote:

Last year, the Pistons were 4 games or so better than they are this year, with a better team. The Bulls last year were a game better than this year, with no Hinrich, but otherwise a relatively healthy team. The Bulls would eventually catch and pass the Pistons and make the playoffs. The Pistons did not. We are a quarter through the season. I would not be surprised if the same thing happens.

The bottom line is both teams are bad, and were no good from the first day of the season, not contenders or even fringe contenders. The Bulls should not feel any better about themselves because they have a better record than the Pistons...they should be worried about 2010.

The Pistons looked pretty deadly in the first game of the season, blowing out the Grizzlies (who are now 8-12) in the first game of the season. That was the only game that they had their full cast of players.

The Bulls also looked pretty good early on starting the season 6-4.

Definitely not teams that are going to be competing for championships (but there's only 4-6 teams in any given team that are going to be doing so), but they did look like teams that could compete for that 5th seed with Miami.

One team, the Pistons, has been hit much worse by injuries than the Bulls, but has been able to stay competitive, only being blown out once this season, against Phoenix.

The Bulls on the otherhand have been getting blown out in almost all of their recent losses, and look like a very non-competitive team.

Why is it that one team, with worse injuries, can stay competitive, while the Bulls cannot.

It has to be the coaching? Right? Or is our roster just that poorly constructed that it is going to be a struggle to win games regardless?

 

[MikeMeraz]

Because they have BG.

 

[JimmyBulls]

The injuries were/are a blessing to the Pistons. They will start having major problems when Stuckey, Hamilton, Gordon and Bynum have to split time and shots. Those guys will have a problem when Prince comeback as well. They're forwards are getting regular minutes and will have to take a back seat when Pirnce get back his 30 plus minutes of running time. The minutes and shots crunch didn't work last year and there is no sane reason to believe it will work this season. The Pistons are nothing morethan a long term mess, unless they make some major trades to upgrade their roster balance.

Pistons wins: Grizzlies, Magic, 76ers, Bobcats, Wizards, Hawks, Bucks, and Wizards
Bulls wins: Spurs, Bucks, Cavs, Bobcats, 76ers, Kings, and Pistons

Nuff Said.

 

[houheffna]

The Pistons looked pretty deadly in the first game of the season, blowing out the Grizzlies (who are now 8-12) in the first game of the season. That was the only game that they had their full cast of players.

The Bulls also looked pretty good early on starting the season 6-4.

Definitely not teams that are going to be competing for championships (but there's only 4-6 teams in any given team that are going to be doing so), but they did look like teams that could compete for that 5th seed with Miami.

One team, the Pistons, has been hit much worse by injuries than the Bulls, but has been able to stay competitive, only being blown out once this season, against Phoenix.

The Bulls on the otherhand have been getting blown out in almost all of their recent losses, and look like a very non-competitive team.

Why is it that one team, with worse injuries, can stay competitive, while the Bulls cannot.

It has to be the coaching? Right? Or is our roster just that poorly constructed that it is going to be a struggle to win games regardless?

So I take it you know the reason....what is it?

 

[??? ??????]

What is enough said about the difference between the Bulls/Pistons wins?

The Pistons have beaten teams with a combined record of 74-82 (.474) and the Bulls have beaten teams with a combined record of 63-71 (.470).

Nuff said?

 

[JimmyBulls]

??? ?????? wrote:

What is enough said about the difference between the Bulls/Pistons wins?

The Pistons have beaten teams with a combined record of 74-82 (.474) and the Bulls have beaten teams with a combined record of 63-71 (.470).

Nuff said?

The Bulls beat the Pistons head to head, and that trumps all this early in the season. But if you're trying to con people with the idea that the Pistons schedule is tougher than the Bulls...good luck with that.

Nuff said.

 

[RC_Skinny22]

Bulls will win the next game and they are 8-11. If the loose against the Hawks they are 8-12, too. So the Pistons are not better but equal.

Nuff said

 

[Hendu0520]

Yes it is coaching. The Bulls should be better than the Pistons if all were healthy as well but we aren't because we

1)Tempo: we do not run with the fastest PG in the league
2)Spacing: the Bulls crowd the paint with 4 or 3 players constantly, please spread the floor!
3)Attitude: like watching Jack tie his shoes the Bulls attitude is pathetic, they don't want it!

This can easily be turned around because the coaching X's and O's is improving but these are the 3 main problems with the Bulls right now. Injuries should not matter as much as they are.

 

[Shakes]

This list has the Bulls schedule at #3 and the Pistons at #9:

http://www.teamrankings.com/nba/ranking/strength-of-schedule-by-team

And the answer to why the Pistons are better is simple: Even with injuries, they have 4 players posting a 15+ PER (Wallace, Gordon, Villanueva and Bynum) and the Bulls have two (Noah and Deng). Heck, even the much maligned Stuckey has a higher PER than Rose at this point. The Bulls simply don't have enough players playing well right now.

 

[??? ??????]

Shakes wrote:

This list has the Bulls schedule at #3 and the Pistons at #9:

http://www.teamrankings.com/nba/ranking/strength-of-schedule-by-team

And the answer to why the Pistons are better is simple: Even with injuries, they have 4 players posting a 15+ PER (Wallace, Gordon, Villanueva and Bynum) and the Bulls have two (Noah and Deng). Heck, even the much maligned Stuckey has a higher PER than Rose at this point. The Bulls simply don't have enough players playing well right now.

I didn't see any rationale for those strength of schedule rankings. But Bulls are 5th and Pistons are 6th with Hollinger's SOS.

http://espn.go.com/nba/hollinger/powerrankings/_/sort/sos

And I agree that the cause of the Bulls doing so bad is the result of players playing bad.

But is it a result of the Bulls not having talent, or is it a result of bad coaching, or both? This same offensive scheme had an offense rolling at the end of last year, so that would indicate that the players just aren't as good as last year's.

 

[Chitown773]

??? ?????? wrote:

Shakes wrote:

This list has the Bulls schedule at #3 and the Pistons at #9:

http://www.teamrankings.com/nba/ranking/strength-of-schedule-by-team

And the answer to why the Pistons are better is simple: Even with injuries, they have 4 players posting a 15+ PER (Wallace, Gordon, Villanueva and Bynum) and the Bulls have two (Noah and Deng). Heck, even the much maligned Stuckey has a higher PER than Rose at this point. The Bulls simply don't have enough players playing well right now.

I didn't see any rationale for those strength of schedule rankings. But Bulls are 5th and Pistons are 6th with Hollinger's SOS.

http://espn.go.com/nba/hollinger/powerrankings/_/sort/sos

And I agree that the cause of the Bulls doing so bad is the result of players playing bad.

But is it a result of the Bulls not having talent, or is it a result of bad coaching, or both? This same offensive scheme had an offense rolling at the end of last year, so that would indicate that the players just aren't as good as last year's.

Pistons have too much skill and offensive fire-power.

 

[Shakes]

Well we have 7 players we'd ideally play big minutes. Compared to last year:

Deng: playing better
Noah: playing better
Miller: playing worse (probable explaination: age)
Salmons: playing worse (probable explaination: last year was a fluke year)
Tyrus: injured
Kirk: injured
Rose: playing worse (probable explaination: ankle)

I don't think you could blame any of it on Vinny (which is why I don't understand the calls to fire him based on the record). Given how Miller and Salmons are doing, it's unrealistic to expect us to be at the same level as the end of last year though, even once we get Kirk/Tyurs back and Rose hopefully performing at least at last year's level.

I think the downgrade from last year's Miller/Salmons to this year's version is going to be a bigger factor when it's all said and done than swapping BG from the team at the end of last year to Deng. And that's no slight on BG (who is obviously a better offensive player than Deng), more a comment on how badly those two have declined.

 

[charity stripe]

Well coaching definitely is playing a factor. Kuester is an experienced assistant, and ran the offense for a contending team. VDN is still in over his head, and doesn't know how to pronounce his players' names.

But the biggest reason is that the Pistons backups are much better than the Bulls backups. Guys like Stuckey, Maxiel ,Jerebko, Bynum, Wallace as a group are playing better than Hunter, Gibson, Salmons and Pargo.

 

[Hendu0520]

I don't think the Bulls should fire Vinny yet, but he has to change this or by all star break he should be fired.

According to Doug on Chicago Now the Bulls have had the toughest schedule in the league. Either way we all know they have had one of the toughest schedules ever to open a season by any team. That being said our attitude, spacing and tempo is horrible.

Side note: If the Bulls had hired D'Antoni do you think Deng and Rose would be hitting threes? I hate D'Antoni but atleast he would've made Deng and Rose shoot the 3 even if they weren't making them. He would force them to do it, Vinny needs to make them shoot 3's.

Everytime someone passes up a wide open 3 point shot except (Noah, Tyrus, Gibson) they should be taken out immediately!!!!

 

[Shakes]

I think Deng would be hitting threes, I think Rose would be missing threes.

 

[Hendu0520]

Shakes wrote:

I think Deng would be hitting threes, I think Rose would be missing threes.

Ya Rose would miss them, but you can't get better if you don't shoot, I don't care how much time you practice, you need to be used to the timing in a game.

Should Rose be a better shooter than Channing Frye? Gentry made him start shooting those shots so now he makes them. Rose needs to start shooting some.

 

[Shakes]

I don't know, Frye was a jump shooter coming into the league, and has been in the league for a lot longer than Rose, so I'd say that Frye should be a better shooter than Rose at this point.