Winning with a Rose

[Chitown773]

I hear fans doubting Rose prematurely but that should be expected when you have inexperienced Basketball minds at the sight. I decided to make this small article to highlight the possibilities of winning with Derrick Rose and what it will take.

Derrick Rose weaknesses:

He's not vocal.
His decisions on offense is readable on defense 60% of the time.
Not a good defender on the ball.
Perimeter shot isn't respectable.
Commits turnovers too much.

Suitable Roster for his weaknesses:

SG: A tall Combo Guard that has great help-side ability on offense. His mission should be spot-up shooting, and ability to create. He should also be the vocal leader.

SF: This position should have a great help-side on defense. He should be able to contain most offensive juggernauts.

PF: This position should resemble our second go-to-guy on offense. We need him to provide offensive rebounding and reliable spot-up shooting.

------------------

SG: Jamal Crawford. Joe Johnson. Dwyane Wade. Manu Ginobili. Stephen Jackson. Eric Gordon.

SF: Danny Granger. Shane Battier. Hedo Turkoglu. Carmelo Anthony. Danilo Gallinari. Tayshaun Prince.

PF: Carlos Boozer. David West. Al Harrington. Amar'e Stoudemire. Chris Bosh.

 

[pinkizdead]

hedo as a defender? jamal crawford as a good defensive player?

 

[houheffna]

There have been some criticism concerning Rose, some just some unjust...


keep in mind though that some criticism is coming from "BG's Goons" they have been sent out to dump on all of the Bulls in order to justify their feelings about him...that is not that many people. The ones who say keeping Rose over BG is a mistake? .....yeah them.

He has gotten off to a slow start, but he is injured. However, those who want to trade him for Chris Paul have nothing personal against any of the Bulls, they would trade any of them for a top 5 player in the league and the best pg easily in the league. Rose is not expendable in my mind, but lets not get ridiculous. Lebron? You do that in a heartbeat, trade a decent pg who is not yet top 20 for the guy who maybe THE HOOPSTER OF THIS GENERATION...that is a nobrainer.

 

[Chitown773]

pinkizdead wrote:

hedo as a defender? jamal crawford as a good defensive player?

I don't think it'll matter if you have Dwyane Wade alongside Hedo. I think Jamal Crawford would be perfect alongside Shane Battier. It's my personal opinion.

 

[Shakes]

Well assuming Rose becomes a star, here's what I'd do.

C: Defense and rebounding. We have that guy in Noah.
PF: An all round player who can score a bit, defend a bit, rebound a bit. Someone without too many holes in their game without needing to be an out and out star. Unfortunately the first guy who comes to mind as being a good young fit is Aldridge.
SF: Primary offensive player and star. Obviously LBJ or Durant is ideal. If we're talking non-stars then it needs to be someone who can at least shoot 3s, so not Deng.
SG: Versatile defender who can take the best offensive wing. Ideally can also hit open 3s. Someone not too expensive to make the roster work cost wise. Someone like a prime Bruce Bowen type is ideal here. Probably the position I'd look to fill with a vet each year.

Basically I think you need a strong defender next to him in the back court, scoring from at least 2 other positions, and someone else who commands attention (either through being a star or an excellent 3 point shooter).

 

[fola]

houheffna wrote:

The ones who say keeping Rose over BG is a mistake? .....yeah them.

Who? what? where? When?
please put that in context.


As far what rose needs around him, some of the suggestions are just bad. JCraw (good guy but a chucker), Stephen Jackson (no way I or anyone in the Org would want his kind of vocal leadership), Manu (a great player but give his age and the fact that he'll prob die a spur, i'd say almost unattainable). Also, Deng is pretty much locked in (for the moment) as our SF. Are you taking into consideration our current situation or is this just a wish list (no sarcasm intended). And even if we get some of the players on this list (bosh or amare) we could still end up being a slightly better than average team.


All that said, i'm really warming to the idea of getting Wade.

 

[??? ??????]

You can win with Derrick Rose, but by no means should you be building a team around a non-superstar.

 

[Kush77]

houheffna wrote:

The ones who say keeping Rose over BG is a mistake? .....yeah them.

Who ever said that? And when would a choice between those two players come up? BG and Hinrich, yes. You could of traded Hinrich to keep Gordon or let Gordon walk. But when would BG vs Rose ever have been a issue or question?

 

[Chitown773]

houheffna wrote:

There have been some criticism concerning Rose, some just some unjust...


keep in mind though that some criticism is coming from "BG's Goons" they have been sent out to dump on all of the Bulls in order to justify their feelings about him...that is not that many people. The ones who say keeping Rose over BG is a mistake? .....yeah them.

He has gotten off to a slow start, but he is injured. However, those who want to trade him for Chris Paul have nothing personal against any of the Bulls, they would trade any of them for a top 5 player in the league and the best pg easily in the league. Rose is not expendable in my mind, but lets not get ridiculous. Lebron? You do that in a heartbeat, trade a decent pg who is not yet top 20 for the guy who maybe THE HOOPSTER OF THIS GENERATION...that is a nobrainer.

Simple as this, Rose is the most crucial player we've had in 10 years. Everything starts with him.

 

[Chitown773]

Kush77 wrote:

houheffna wrote:

The ones who say keeping Rose over BG is a mistake? .....yeah them.

Who ever said that? And when would a choice between those two players come up? BG and Hinrich, yes. You could of traded Hinrich to keep Gordon or let Gordon walk. But when would BG vs Rose ever have been a issue or question?

I know, man. What are you smoking houheffna? Rose can sustain the whole season with assist and scoring. He's a difference maker in every sense, not Gordon.

 

[Chitown773]

??? ?????? wrote:

You can win with Derrick Rose, but by no means should you be building a team around a non-superstar.

Detroit did it.

 

[Shakes]

??? ?????? wrote:

You can win with Derrick Rose, but by no means should you be building a team around a non-superstar.

What's the alternative? When you get the number one pick (through being bad, not a trade) it makes sense to assume he's going to be a superstar and try to build around him.

 

[houheffna]

Who ever said that? And when would a choice between those two players come up? BG and Hinrich, yes. You could of traded Hinrich to keep Gordon or let Gordon walk. But when would BG vs Rose ever have been a issue or question?

Uhhhhh....you need to read some of the posts on the forum...doubts have been raised...I am just saying...

 

[??? ??????]

houheffna wrote:

Who ever said that? And when would a choice between those two players come up? BG and Hinrich, yes. You could of traded Hinrich to keep Gordon or let Gordon walk. But when would BG vs Rose ever have been a issue or question?

Uhhhhh....you need to read some of the posts on the forum...doubts have been raised...I am just saying...

It's not hard to see that there is a a good chance Ben Gordon ends up being the bette rplayer of the two. He's playing at a high level, and has that killer instinct that Rose lacks.

No one ever made this a Rose vs. BG thing though. I think that everyone who wanted to keep Ben Gordon wanted to keep Rose too. The people who wanted to keep Gordon wanted to get rid of Hinrich, or Deng to do it....or you know, have Jerry Reinsdorf just suck it up and pay the luxury tax. No one ever suggested getting rid of Derrick Rose to keep Ben Gordon.

 

[jsain360]

??? ?????? wrote:

You can win with Derrick Rose, but by no means should you be building a team around a non-superstar.

Like Ben Gordon

 

[houheffna]

Like Ben Gordon

Exactly...pointing this young player's faults and then saying "we let a star player go for him" is just erroneous thinking. Rose's upside is much higher than Gordon's or anyone else on the team. And no player on this team over the last decade was a star. And that is what a team depends on when he has not reached his full potential.

No one ever made this a Rose vs. BG thing though. I think that everyone who wanted to keep Ben Gordon wanted to keep Rose too. The people who wanted to keep Gordon wanted to get rid of Hinrich, or Deng to do it....or you know, have Jerry Reinsdorf just suck it up and pay the luxury tax. No one ever suggested getting rid of Derrick Rose to keep Ben Gordon.

"I think it is simply that Derrick Rose isn't that good. He's not a franchise player. Unfortunately the press / fans anointed Rose to the franchise player status, which led to some idiotic idea of building around Rose (rather than Rose just being a piece), which ended with us losing a star player."


look familiar? Nothing about Deng or Hinrich here...it is saying that in direct consequence to Rose's ascension to franchise player status, a "star" was ushered out of town...I beg to differ.

 

[pinkizdead]

rose isnt the franchise player yet... he's as much the franchise player as ben wallace was. we marketed the blank out of ben wallace, but we never really had a franchise player.

he will probably be a good player, but he's not there yet.

 

[??? ??????]

houheffna wrote:

Like Ben Gordon

Exactly...pointing this young player's faults and then saying "we let a star player go for him" is just erroneous thinking. Rose's upside is much higher than Gordon's or anyone else on the team. And no player on this team over the last decade was a star. And that is what a team depends on when he has not reached his full potential.

No one ever made this a Rose vs. BG thing though. I think that everyone who wanted to keep Ben Gordon wanted to keep Rose too. The people who wanted to keep Gordon wanted to get rid of Hinrich, or Deng to do it....or you know, have Jerry Reinsdorf just suck it up and pay the luxury tax. No one ever suggested getting rid of Derrick Rose to keep Ben Gordon.

"I think it is simply that Derrick Rose isn't that good. He's not a franchise player. Unfortunately the press / fans anointed Rose to the franchise player status, which led to some idiotic idea of building around Rose (rather than Rose just being a piece), which ended with us losing a star player."


look familiar? Nothing about Deng or Hinrich here...it is saying that in direct consequence to Rose's ascension to franchise player status, a "star" was ushered out of town...I beg to differ.

If Rose had only a solid rookie year. Say averaged 11 points 5 assists, while Michael Beasley won the ROY (as expected) coming into last year it's hard to not see the Bulls making a strong push to sign Ben Gordon.

But Jerry Reinsdorf never liked Ben Gordon all that much for whatever reason, and because of Rose's quick start to his career, was able to get away with little negative reaction from the fan base as a whole with getting rid of the Bulls best player.

 

[Hendu0520]

Ok name a championship team where the best player was a point guard. '04 Detroit, '90 Detroit, '69 Knicks.

Rose is fine, he IS a superstar. Who is going to be better in 5 years? Jennings, Westbrook maybe Paul and Williams but they will be on the downside. Rose is the biggest young PG in the league, just as explosive as anyone, I can garuntee (if I knew how to spell) that DRose will be a top 5 PG in this league if he isn't already. He is obviously injured as well.

This being said I agree that we probably have to get a guy just as good or better than him to win a Chip but Rose is just fine, lets not panic.

 

[jsain360]

Hendu0520 wrote:

Ok name a championship team where the best player was a point guard. '04 Detroit, '90 Detroit, '69 Knicks.

Rose is fine, he IS a superstar. Who is going to be better in 5 years? Jennings, Westbrook maybe Paul and Williams but they will be on the downside. Rose is the biggest young PG in the league, just as explosive as anyone, I can garuntee (if I knew how to spell) that DRose will be a top 5 PG in this league if he isn't already. He is obviously injured as well.

This being said I agree that we probably have to get a guy just as good or better than him to win a Chip but Rose is just fine, lets not panic.

I know, people are in complete panic, he hasn't played any preseason and he is still playing hurt, once again we're 6-4, we're ahead of the game at this point