$108,000 city pension for a $40,000 job

[Pez68]

Very true, but it's pretty unbelievable that the money these guys are collecting, was paid for by taxes... If I lived in Chicago, and my taxes went to them, I'd be burning that mother ****** to the ground right about now.

 

[MassHavoc]

Sorry, I didn't click on to every link in your thread. Regardless, when a CEO gets a $100,000,000 parachute, after driving a company into the ground, this still pales in comparison, but I've said enough, using an argument you don't like, and obviously, I've highjacked your thread, so I'll refrain from posting in it, from here on out.

You didn't have to click any articles, I clearly bolded it in the second story I posted.



It's not that I don't like the argument, it's that it doesn't apply. This thread is about the massive corruption of the Chicago Unions. It's about widespread illegal activity across many Unions that as a direct result is forcing the pension fund that taxpayers pay for, into default and putting many of those same union workers at risk of losing their jobs, as well as creating a massive derth of actual shit getting done in this town because there is no money. But we shouldn't care because some CEOs are even more outrageously taken care of in a fully legal way that harms the company itself first and foremost.

 

[Pez68]

I don't think he's saying we shouldn't care.

 

[MassHavoc]

I don't think he's saying we shouldn't care.

I know he's not saying we shouldn't care, I oversimplified, but by avoiding the question and steering everything back away from the unions, the corruption, and onto CEOs, that's the impression it gives. That Union's aren't all that bad because corporations are worse.



I'm afraid of what this thread is going to look like when all the normal Union/Non-Union players get in here. HAh.

 

[mikita's helmet]

I was referring to the links at post #8. anyway, should have read the thread more closely.



...slowly sllnks away.

 

[MassHavoc]

No worries, I'm interested in hearing what you have to say on the topic as it relates to unions since your position seems to be more Pro-Union. Is there any justification or pieces of this story I'm not understanding as it relates to Chicago Unions and how they work?

 

[mikita's helmet]

No worries, I'm interested in hearing what you have to say on the topic as it relates to unions since your position seems to be more Pro-Union. Is there any justification or pieces of this story I'm not understanding as it relates to Chicago Unions and how they work?

I haven't lived in the Chicago metro area since 1974 and Illinois since 2005, so I'm out of the loop. However, I'm sure there are corrupt unions (or at least union leaders) in Chicago and other cities. Without unions, however, we wouldn't have - in the current political climate much of this is being whittled away at or eliminated - healthcare, sick leave, national holidays off, paid vacation, child labor laws, 40-hour work-weeks, etc. I'd mention being a loyal worker to an employer and being rewarded for that by receiving a pension, but most companies have completely eliminated those. No wonder most folks hate, not dislike, their jobs nowadays and customer service completely sucks. You work at the whim of your boss and he can fire you "at will" which is legally what most workers are, "at will" employees.



You think hockey players would abandon NHLPA, play without a contract, and expect the owners to look out for their best interest?

 

[MassHavoc]

When did the unions force institutionalization of all those things? Hasn't' it been years if not decades by now?

 

[mikita's helmet]

When did the unions force institutionalization of all those things? Hasn't' it been years if not decades by now?

It's been a while, but things are slipping back.



If unions are so bad, why do those who are powerful, athletes, actors, federal administrative law judges, etc., continue to insist on having unions and collective bargaining agreements? To protect themselves from owners and managment, who have a different agenda and priorites then workers do. It's also why regular folks organize. To protect themselves from the whims and caprices of owners and management. Strength in numbers.

 

[MassHavoc]

I was under the impression that a lot of times the workers in those arenas are forced to join the unions whether they like to or not. They monopolize the industry's and control the opportunities. There is no way around them.

 

[mikita's helmet]

I was under the impression that a lot of times the workers in those arenas are forced to join the unions whether they like to or not. They monopolize the industry's and control the opportunities. There is no way around them.

My wife is a teacher in Washington state, and union member as are most teachers she works with, but it's not mandatory to join the union, though those teachers that opt out share in any benefits obtained in collective bargaining without paying any dues.

 

[MassHavoc]

My wife is a teacher in Washington state, and union member as are most teachers she works with, but it's not mandatory to join the union, though those teachers that opt out share in any benefits obtained in collective bargaining without paying any dues.

And in that case, I don't find that fair at all. But it's a catch 22, if they opt out they shouldn't be allowed the benefits, but if there is no other way then they are forced to join.



Why aren't there competing unions? Like 2 or three choices for your wife to join, which ever one she feels most conformable representing her?

 

[mikita's helmet]

And in that case, I don't find that fair at all. But it's a catch 22, if they opt out they shouldn't be allowed the benefits, but if there is no other way then they are forced to join.



Why aren't there competing unions? Like 2 or three choices for your wife to join, which ever one she feels most conformable representing her?

It's hard enough for 1 union group and 1 managment group to reach consensus, much less 3 or 4, on difficult bargaining issues.

 

[klemmer]

IMO, the stock market is destroying this country just as much as apathy or entitlement is.

I couldn't agree more. Wall Street has become nothing more than a casino, and woe be the company that doesn't hit its (madeup) numbers.

 

[Pez68]

I couldn't agree more. Wall Street has become nothing more than a casino, and woe be the company that doesn't hit its (madeup) numbers.

Bingo.