dbldrew
Well-known member
- Joined:
- Aug 24, 2012
- Posts:
- 6,220
- Liked Posts:
- 2,606
cant see what @PrideisBears said I have him on ignore.. was it stupid? Pretty sure it was stupid right?
- Joined:
- Jun 20, 2010
- Posts:
- 40,303
- Liked Posts:
- 29,936
- Location:
- In the mod forum planning your ban
Ahh the pussy route.
- Joined:
- Jun 20, 2010
- Posts:
- 40,303
- Liked Posts:
- 29,936
- Location:
- In the mod forum planning your ban
@msadows all he’ll do is put you on ignore if you counter his easy arguments
dbldrew
Well-known member
- Joined:
- Aug 24, 2012
- Posts:
- 6,220
- Liked Posts:
- 2,606
yes when @MDB111™ said that I thought "Trevor Siemnean is the answer." That would be a strawman argument. I never said that I thought that he was the answer, in fact I actually said the opposite.
You see @MDB111™ isnt the sharpest knife in the drawer, so his only way to debate anything is just stick to insults or strawman arguments.
- Joined:
- Aug 21, 2012
- Posts:
- 13,922
- Liked Posts:
- 20,283
- Location:
- Charlotte, NC
My favorite teams
Imagine thinking 1 game proves all this shit he thinks it proves. 1 fucking game. Lol.
Zvbxrpl
Well-known member
- Joined:
- Oct 3, 2014
- Posts:
- 2,632
- Liked Posts:
- 2,771
LOL bears' Pressure rate is 50% (dead last in NFL per the Athletic), with a bottom 3 unit where they are not nice about Jones' or Borom's ability to pass block (called them both bottom 10). They give up on average 3.5 sacks a game (tied with Indy for dead last in the league from Team Rankings/same site dbl guy pulled Simian's 7% sack rate like it's a beacon that a bad offensive line isn't.)
Anybody who looks at the entire picture, not a snipped of minimal information, laughs at dbl's contention that Simian is a bad QB but the OL is better because his sack % is lower than Justin's while conveniently ignoring that Trevor Simian is and has been since he's been in the league, a 'get rid of the ball quick'/dink and dunk guy who you don't want throwing long because he throws a lot of ducks that a few of his guys this past weekend bailed him out on in terms of contested catches. He can't throw long, because if he could, he wouldn't be a back up on a team poised to be picking #2 overall next spring. You'd think he'd be a starter on a good team, but he's been around long enough to know when to get rid of the ball quick--which we saw a lot of this past Sunday.
Anybody who looks at the entire picture, not a snipped of minimal information, laughs at dbl's contention that Simian is a bad QB but the OL is better because his sack % is lower than Justin's while conveniently ignoring that Trevor Simian is and has been since he's been in the league, a 'get rid of the ball quick'/dink and dunk guy who you don't want throwing long because he throws a lot of ducks that a few of his guys this past weekend bailed him out on in terms of contested catches. He can't throw long, because if he could, he wouldn't be a back up on a team poised to be picking #2 overall next spring. You'd think he'd be a starter on a good team, but he's been around long enough to know when to get rid of the ball quick--which we saw a lot of this past Sunday.
- Joined:
- Apr 4, 2011
- Posts:
- 18,761
- Liked Posts:
- 27,294
- Location:
- Volusia County, FL
My favorite teams
It wasn't even a whole game. It was about a quarter and a half.
Myk
85in25
- Joined:
- Sep 27, 2010
- Posts:
- 12,856
- Liked Posts:
- 5,342
I posted this in another thread but figured @MDB111™ might like some actual numbers to back it up..
Yes Fields makes the OL look much worse.. here are the facts for 2022..
Fields gets pressured 28.9% of the time
Trevor got pressured 20.7% of the time
The Jets average pressures are 24.7%
So not only did Trevor improve over what Fields did, Our OL held one of the best pressure D to under what they average.
What about sacks this year?
Fields gets sacked 14.9% of his drop backs
Trevor got sacked 7.1% of his drop backs
The Jets average a sack 10% of the pass attempts
So not only did Trevor cut the sacks in half over Fields our OL also held a great D to under what they average as well.
And before you morons start talking about 10 points.. yeah Trevor is not a good QB. I'm talking about the OL not the backup QB.
Justin Fields Stats, Height, Weight, Position, Draft, College | Pro-Football-Reference.com
Checkout the latest stats for Justin Fields. Get info about his position, age, height, weight, college, draft, and more on Pro-football-reference.com.www.pro-football-reference.com
Trevor Siemian Stats, Height, Weight, Position, Draft, College | Pro-Football-Reference.com
Checkout the latest stats for Trevor Siemian. Get info about his position, age, height, weight, college, draft, and more on Pro-football-reference.com.
2022 NFL Opposition & Defensive Statistics | Pro-Football-Reference.com
Check out the 2022 NFL Opposition & Defensive Statistics including AFC and NFC results and standings on Pro-football-reference.com
Your sample size is small. Your information is incomplete. Your conclusions are impulsive.
Have you considered the other team doesn't have to pressure a bad QB as much as they have to pressure a good QB?
- Joined:
- Oct 7, 2011
- Posts:
- 22,060
- Liked Posts:
- 15,509
- Location:
- Dongbears is thee worst!
My favorite teams
Like I said, straw man was 2014. Sounds like you just heard the term last weekend.
Please google steelman argument. Thanks.
- Joined:
- Nov 29, 2014
- Posts:
- 17,135
- Liked Posts:
- 17,636
- Location:
- Texas
Cool story. No one is debating fault of sacks being on Fields at times, it's probably close to 60% OL/Coverage and 40% Fields., although Fields has gotten a lot better over the past 6 weeks working the pocket. So your stats don't mean much. Your stats are account for a drop back passing game up until week 5. I would like to see those numbers post-Offense change and I bet they line up close to what we saw ... I don't even want to go on, I know what I see with my eyes and on all 22 the offensive line sucks, especially up the middle.I posted this in another thread but figured @MDB111™ might like some actual numbers to back it up..
Yes Fields makes the OL look much worse.. here are the facts for 2022..
Fields gets pressured 28.9% of the time
Trevor got pressured 20.7% of the time
The Jets average pressures are 24.7%
So not only did Trevor improve over what Fields did, Our OL held one of the best pressure D to under what they average.
What about sacks this year?
Fields gets sacked 14.9% of his drop backs
Trevor got sacked 7.1% of his drop backs
The Jets average a sack 10% of the pass attempts
So not only did Trevor cut the sacks in half over Fields our OL also held a great D to under what they average as well.
And before you morons start talking about 10 points.. yeah Trevor is not a good QB. I'm talking about the OL not the backup QB.
Justin Fields Stats, Height, Weight, Position, Draft, College | Pro-Football-Reference.com
Checkout the latest stats for Justin Fields. Get info about his position, age, height, weight, college, draft, and more on Pro-football-reference.com.
Trevor Siemian Stats, Height, Weight, Position, Draft, College | Pro-Football-Reference.com
Checkout the latest stats for Trevor Siemian. Get info about his position, age, height, weight, college, draft, and more on Pro-football-reference.com.
2022 NFL Opposition & Defensive Statistics | Pro-Football-Reference.com
Check out the 2022 NFL Opposition & Defensive Statistics including AFC and NFC results and standings on Pro-football-reference.com
Trevor is a decent quarterback, he's certainly not "horrible" as you said he is sufficient enough to plug in for injuriies and probably carry a .500 record on a competent team, which the bears do not have.
I would also expect a quarterback who has 6 years of experience to get the ball out quicker than a guy going on his second year, that's common sense.
cameronkrazie86
Well-known member
- Joined:
- May 1, 2021
- Posts:
- 5,999
- Liked Posts:
- 9,152
- Location:
- Vegas
My favorite teams
I believe you are quite mistaken, @MDB111™ only deals with 'steelman' arguments, not 'strawman' arguments. He's even letting you 'steal, man' his 'steelman' argument.
dbldrew
Well-known member
- Joined:
- Aug 24, 2012
- Posts:
- 6,220
- Liked Posts:
- 2,606
yes the sample size is small but that actually makes it look worse for Fields not better, because Fields stats had the advantage of playing bad Ds through the year while 100% of Trevors played a top pressuring D, but yes the counter to that is maybe the jets just had an off game, thats true and possible, and I also said in another thread to take it with a grain of salt because of the small sample size. But right now thats all we have to debate.
As far as teams dont need to pressure a bad QB. The only problem with that is the Jets are the 2nd lowest blitz team this year. So them not blitzing is actually normal for them, they get there without the blitz. So unless you are suggesting that the DL is just taking the game off?
dbldrew
Well-known member
- Joined:
- Aug 24, 2012
- Posts:
- 6,220
- Liked Posts:
- 2,606
I'm not sure what your talking about with only week 5 stats, thats not true the stats include all of Fields games, and Trevors as well.
As far as Trevor being bad.. only in the context of wanting him to be the starting QB to build around. As a backup QB? yeah he is fine, as a starting QB you are trying to build around? Nope..
bearsfan1977
Well-known member
- Joined:
- Mar 23, 2016
- Posts:
- 3,874
- Liked Posts:
- 4,198
How some don’t see how Fields’ insane escapability doesn’t make this OL better is beyond me. Simply just watching the games shows how awful their pass pro is.
dbldrew
Well-known member
- Joined:
- Aug 24, 2012
- Posts:
- 6,220
- Liked Posts:
- 2,606
yes the pressure rate is bad... when Fields plays, thats the point. When our "worst OL in the league" played against one of the best pressure D in the league and things got better.. a lot better, the only conclusion you can have is either the jets had a bad game or the QB has been causing a lot of the problems
Hard to say I'm "conveniently ignoring" all that about Trevor when I have said the exact same thing. Glad we agree