Cubs claim Adrian Cardenas

[Captain Obvious]

Bad defense, but plays multiple positions and can hit... nice.

Playing multiple positions doesn't mean anything when you play bad defense.

Ya I couldnt believe when the Phillys traded him for Joe Blanton Beane won the deal at the time. But the Phillys won the WS so it was good for both sides.

He is a good person as much as he is a good ball player he plays really hard all the time and has a really focused personality. I though he would turn into a LH Ian Kinsler with less power I am still really high on him. But I doubt he comes close to what I originally though he could be. But I could see him being a good player for us over the next few years. I could see him starting over Barney at 2B. Or being in the Mark Dersoa role and playing all over.

With no MLB experience? I doubt it. Barney has proven that he's an average 2B. That's great for this team, given his salary. Barney pisses me off just as much as the next guy with his lack of patience, but he's a league average 2B making nothing. Hard to go against that.

You are also forgetting Barney doesn't fit Theo's mold offensively of going deep into counts and being patient. Cardenas is a Theo type player at the plate he is very patient and takes walks he fits Theo more than you think just maybe not defensively and his defense isnt as bad as it is made out to be. At 3B he is awful at 2B or LF he is average.

So you're saying he's bad at 3rd but average at 2nd and Left.... Hmmm...

actually at just 2B they are equal defenders IMO. Cardenas is just awful at 3B and LF and SS.

Now you're saying he's awful at Left... interesting. And you're basing him being average at 2nd off of?...

Cardenas has a .976 fielding % at 2B and Barney a .978 (and .971 in the minors).

Fielding Percentage. Ex-fucking-lent. Derek Jeter has a .976 FP, I guess that means he's average too, huh?

If he plays like he did in the minors which is likely because he has raked at every level and in every different league.

Raked? I'm not sure I'd call a .736 OPS at AAA raking.... Especially in a hitters league.

Obviously Beane knew Weeks is the future at 2B and you cant really DH a guy who doesn't hit for power as well as average. They just had no room anywhere for the guy. Cardenas has no business playing any spot besides 2B if you want your defense to be good. In short stints we can handle having him play 3B and LF but I wouldn't do it often.

The A's INF pretty much sucks. They don't really have any good back ups either. I'm not entirely sure why Beane released him, but it seems that if he had any thought that he could play at the MLB level, he'd get the chance. It's a nice signing by the Cubs, but I really don't think he's going to be as good as you think.

 

[bleacherbum54]

Defense is one area where I defer to the scouts because defense stats that are available to most of us suck, and just about every word I have read has said that Barney is a much better defender period. I think if there weren't questions about Cardenas's ability to handle a middle infield spot defenisvely than the Cubs wouldn't have been able to get him after 14 other teams passed.

His range is really bad so I can see why scouts say that but he can hit. I am just happy we have him even if he is just a utility player

 

[dabynsky]

His range is really bad so I can see why scouts say that but he can hit. I am just happy we have him even if he is just a utility player

Please don't mistake that I am happy to get a guy that can hit from the left side for (likely) a decent average and good approach at the plate. I just have a hard time believing a 24 year old with his bat making nothing gets DFAed and passed over by 14 teams if teams felt like he could handle a middle infield spot full time.

 

[Rice Cube]

Yup, seems like if he were that good someone would've snatched him up first. Since he is going to cost very little it was a low-risk move so I like it for that.

 

[bleacherbum54]

Please don't mistake that I am happy to get a guy that can hit from the left side for (likely) a decent average and good approach at the plate. I just have a hard time believing a 24 year old with his bat making nothing gets DFAed and passed over by 14 teams if teams felt like he could handle a middle infield spot full time.

Gary Mathews Jr we lost around 10 years ago the same way from time to time teams make mistakes.

 

[FirstTimer]

Nice pickup. Versatile player. Former top spect. Good move.

Defensivly. Whatever. Unless he's Soriano bad you won't really notice. Barney isn't that great, neither was DeWitt IMO. Average defenders.

 

[Captain Obvious]

Nice pickup. Versatile player. Former top spect. Good move.

Defensivly. Whatever. Unless he's Soriano bad you won't really notice. Barney isn't that great, neither was DeWitt IMO. Average defenders.

Based off of your opinion?

 

[Rice Cube]

Based off of your opinion?

Based off the fact that he's a backup infielder on any other team.

 

[FirstTimer]

Based off of your opinion?

No. Based off the fact that he's a pretty average and unremarkable second baseman.

I like the guy as a player but he's nothing special. Barney is now what he pretty much always will be. Which is fine. But it's nothing to write home about.

He's "a guy".

 

[Captain Obvious]

Based off the fact that he's a backup infielder on any other team.

That doesn't mean shit about his defense. Use your brain. Tony Campana is a backup outfielder, by your logic that means that he is just average at defense too.

No. Based off the fact that he's a pretty average and unremarkable second baseman.

I like the guy as a player but he's nothing special. Barney is now what he pretty much always will be. Which is fine. But it's nothing to write home about.

He's "a guy".

I agree he is just a guy. But I think that what makes him just a guy is his defense, as that is basically all he has. He can't hit, we know this. If he wasn't good on defense, what good would he be? That's my point. His defense is really good. It's his defense that allows him to be "a guy" and not "a guy... in AAA."

 

[FirstTimer]

I agree he is just a guy.

Then what the **** is your issue with me saying "he isn't that great?"

Are you off your meds?

Barney's defense isn't anything to write home about. He's not a gold glover. He's not Soriano. He's a guy in pretty much every way. He's a below average hitter, maybe an above average fielder. Dude's a marginal second basemen on a bad team.

No one claimed he was a shitty defender.

Take the bug out yo ass.

 

[Captain Obvious]

Then what the **** is your issue with me saying "he isn't that great?"

Are you off your meds?

Barney's defense isn't anything to write home about. He's not a gold glover. He's not Soriano. He's a guy in pretty much every way. He's a below average hitter, maybe an above average fielder. Dude's a marginal second basemen on a bad team.

No one claimed he was a shitty defender.

Take the bug out yo ass.

You're the one that is freaking out about this. Not me. I was merely making a point that I thought that Barney was better than average at defense. I'm not freaking out about it. You are.

 

[FirstTimer]

You're the one that is freaking out about this. Not me. I was merely making a point that I thought that Barney was better than average at defense. I'm not freaking out about it. You are.

LOL.

No. I'm actually not.

You're the one that came in here like a scorned 5th grade girl.

Barney "not that great on defense" Pff. Like based on what?!

Go away clown.

Best part is I never even said Barney was "average". I said "he wasn't that great".

ZOMG white knight for Barney!

 

[CODE_BLUE56]

You're the one that is freaking out about this. Not me. I was merely making a point that I thought that Barney was better than average at defense. I'm not freaking out about it. You are.

not really...who started the pointless argument in the first place?

 

[nwfisch]

not really...who started the pointless argument in the first place?

CO

 

[Rice Cube]

That doesn't mean shit about his defense. Use your brain. Tony Campana is a backup outfielder, by your logic that means that he is just average at defense too.

I found this amusing

The argument, as you bolded it, was based on FT saying that Barney "wasn't great". That is not an inaccurate statement. We didn't cherrypick defense. We're merely saying that Barney isn't that good as an overall player. You have changed the parameters of the argument after getting butthurt. You need to stop doing that.

Ah, I re-read it and see what happened. All he said was that Darwin Barney was an average fielder, which is true even by advanced defensive metrics. His below-average offense and average-ish defense don't make him awesome, but considering the rest of the team, it makes him the best defensive middle infielder by default on the Cubs

 

[Captain Obvious]

LOL.

No. I'm actually not.

You're the one that came in here like a scorned 5th grade girl.

Barney "not that great on defense" Pff. Like based on what?!

Go away clown.

Best part is I never even said Barney was "average". I said "he wasn't that great".

ZOMG white knight for Barney!

I asked for clarification on why Barney wasn't that great defensively, according to you. You never said he was average? Really?

Barney isn't that great, neither was DeWitt IMO. Average defenders.

he's a pretty average and unremarkable second baseman

not really...who started the pointless argument in the first place?

I didn't start any arguments. I'm just trying to have a debate about baseball.

I found this amusing

The argument, as you bolded it, was based on FT saying that Barney "wasn't great". That is not an inaccurate statement. We didn't cherrypick defense. We're merely saying that Barney isn't that good as an overall player. You have changed the parameters of the argument after getting butthurt. You need to stop doing that.

Ah, I re-read it and see what happened. All he said was that Darwin Barney was an average fielder, which is true even by advanced defensive metrics. His below-average offense and average-ish defense don't make him awesome, but considering the rest of the team, it makes him the best defensive middle infielder by default on the Cubs

He didn't cherry pick defense?

Defensivly. Whatever. Unless he's Soriano bad you won't really notice. Barney isn't that great, neither was DeWitt IMO. Average defenders.

I agree that overall Barney isn't that good. I was merely responding on defense. If that is changing parameters, then I'm sorry. But he pretty clearly highlighted defense.

 

[FirstTimer]

I asked for clarification on why Barney wasn't that great defensively, according to you. You never said he was average? Really?

"Not that great" =/= average.

LOL at you still white knighting for Barney. I love how the metrics you love to use all teh time to defend clowns like Soriano don't even support you on this. seems to me you're just in love with another marginal player of the Cubs. You love barney but hate Campana because he acts black.

Awesome.

I'm sure Campana has some high WiAR(Wiggers above replacement) rating that makes you hate him.

I didn't start any arguments. I'm just trying to have a debate about baseball.

Bull shit.

You aren't even "debating" anything. I called Barney "not that great" alluded to him as being average or so and you come in here like a scorned 5th grade girl.

"Based on what exactly?"

You haven't countered him being an average defender, or not that great, etc. You've saidnothing to actually debate the issue you've just been asking asinine questions and not really doing much else.

If you'd like to have an actual baseball discussion I'm sure we'd all love to see it, however your posting history here suggests you wouldn't be able to handle it.

He didn't cherry pick defense?

I was responding to someone on defense as the previous posts by everyoen were talkign about his defense being "bad" or whatever. What else is there to discuss with Barney? His offense is meh, likely below average. His defense is the only thing worth discussing and even then there isn't much there to talk about. Like I mentioned in my second post(which you somehow didn't even quote or notice) his defense is maybe above average. Quit being a woman.

LOL at you being in love with darwin Barney. At least I rep great players like Armando Allen and Michael Floyd. You're busy defending schlubs like Darwin freaking Barney.

 

[Captain Obvious]

"Not that great" =/= average.

LOL at you still white knighting for Barney. I love how the metrics you love to use all teh time to defend clowns like Soriano don't even support you on this. seems to me you're just in love with another marginal player of the Cubs. You love barney but hate Campana because he acts black.

Awesome.

I'm sure Campana has some high WiAR(Wiggers above replacement) rating that makes you hate him.

Metrics don't back Barney up? Really? Are you dumb? BR has him in his career at a +5 defender. FG has him as a +10 defender.

I don't love Barney. I have stated several times that I hate Barney. Are you fucking Special person? Can you read? Despite my hatred for him, I understand that he is a valuable player, much like Campana. When they're making league minimum, it's not a big deal that they are on the team.

 

[FirstTimer]

Metrics don't back Barney up? Really? Are you dumb? BR has him in his career at a +5 defender. FG has him as a +10 defender.

dWAR FTW!

Does not support Barney.

LOL at +5 and +10 support Barney as being good based on one fucking season when any metrc says you need at least 3 seaons worth of data to make a deterimantion.

Sabre fail FTW

I don't love Barney. I have stated several times that I hate Barney.

Where have you stated you hate Barney at?

LOL at you.

You and Barney turtle doving at night.