Frank Thomas And The Hall Of Fame

[JosMin]

This year's ballot is going to be very interesting -- Maddux, Glavine, Thomas (all locks, in my eyes) plus fringe guys who'd be worthy of a fun discussion like Mike Mussina and Jeff Kent. Plus you've got Biggio has a holdover, who I think gets in this year, plus Mike Piazza (a no-brainer), Jeff Bagwell (should get in), Tim Raines (juicy numbers, should be in), Curt Schilling (I'll be the first to admit I vastly underrate how good his peak was), Lee Smith (nope) and the steroid bunch of McGwire, Palmerio, Bonds, Clemens, and Sosa.

That's a lot to go over.

 

[FirstTimer]

My ballot(You're allowed 10 names max) this December would look like this:

(No particular order)

Craig Biggio
Jeff Bagwell
Mike Piazza
Tim Raines
Curt Schilling
Larry Walker
Edgar Martinez
Greg Maddux
Tom Glavine
Frank Thomas


Just missed:
Jack Morris

 

[JosMin]

Tim Raines and Lee Smith don't pass the eye test for me. Both were durable and productive, but I don't think either of them were "great". I think Bagwell has steroid whispers attached to his name...should be interesting to see where the voters stand. His numbers definitely put him in Cooperstown, but...


My Ballot:

Biggio (!)
Thomas
Maddux
Glavine
Piazza

I think the argument gets interesting with Raines -- his Expos years were phenomenal, as were his first 3 years with the White Sox. .294/.385/.425 with over 2600 career hits, 800+ steals (putting him 5th all-time), 1500+ runs, 7-time All-Star. I think the two things that hurt him were the fact that he was never considered an elite defender at any point of his career despite his ridiculous speed, and he had zero postseason influence during his entire career, even though he snuck in that World Series championship with the Yankees in '96 at the twilight of his career.

 

[JosMin]

Just for shits, here's my ballot for this year, starting with most deserving first:

Greg Maddux (so incredibly good it sometimes feels like he's a character from a movie, easily one of the three greatest pitchers I remember watching)
Tom Glavine (vastly underrated because of his association with Maddux)
Frank Thomas (we've been over this, probably the best all-around hitter of the 90s)
Mike Piazza (greatest offensive catcher ever, also an underrated ambassador for baseball in New York)
Jeff Bagwell (steroid cloud isn't cloudy enough for me to leave him out -- he deserves to be in)
Craig Biggio (he's like the David Eckstein of the Hall of Fame)
Edgar Martinez (electric with the bat, too bad he'll only keep the 'greatest DH ever' title until David Ortiz retires)
Curt Schilling (his numbers doing blow your face off, but he's on of the greatest postseason pitchers ever, won three WS, and passes "the eye test")
Barry Bonds (steroid shit aside, the guy was a Hall of Famer before all the controversy surfaced)

Apologizes to:

Tim Raines (just can't do it yet....)
Jeff Kent (one of the best offensive 2B ever, I think he'll eventually get in)
Lee Smith (not as dominant as his numbers may suggest)
Roger Clemens (he'll eventually get in)
Larry Walker (horrifically underrated, but not quite great enough for my taste)

 

[JosMin]

I wouldn't say his first 3 years with the White Sox were "phenomenal". I would say they were unexpectedly good, because people thought Raines was washed-up due to his last years in Montreal. Raines' best attributes were his ability to hit singles and doubles, get on base, and score runs. But he led the league in BA only once, OBP once, 2Bs once, and runs twice. His career numbers in these categories are nice, but nothing outstanding IMO. I just don't see what type of objective measurement can be used to say that Raines is a HOFer.

Which is why I ultimately believe he's in the Hall of Very, Very Good