Here Is To The NHL Dying

[Captain Iago]

Players have already been given the chance over the last few years to get paid more in KHL and they are still choosing to stay in the NHL. Ovechkin had an absolutely ridiculous contract offer from the KHL and he chose to stay in the NHL. I think Radulov is even making around $9mil a year over there (tax free) which is ridiculous.

I think you're right on the Rad number.

Does the KHL still have problems with the mafia extorting money from the league's players?

 

[HawkWriter]

I think it would sting the NHL. OV, while not the player he once was, is a juicy marketable player because he's a talented Russian playing in a big market.

I also think all it would take is a dollar figure to convince the Caps to not pursue a breach of contract lawsuit. They'd much rather have that than a lolly gagging, disgruntled OV (even more so than he's ever been accused of in the past) eating an enormous hole in the wallet.

Also, the IIHF could not interfere in his desire to play internationally (which has always been a huge issue for OV); they have no grounds to be involved.

I agree that losing Ovie would hurt. Even losing a Bryzgalov would hurt (he made similar comments to Ovie recently) but I don't think enough players will follow to the point that it crushes the NHL and makes the KHL the league. One of the best players of all time, Jagr, went over to the KHL and it didn't really hurt the NHL one bit.

 

[DewsSox79]

I agree that losing Ovie would hurt. Even losing a Bryzgalov would hurt (he made similar comments to Ovie recently) but I don't think enough players will follow to the point that it crushes the NHL and makes the KHL the league. One of the best players of all time, Jagr, went over to the KHL and it didn't really hurt the NHL one bit.

the nhl is in worse condition now than it was when jagr left and even in 2008 jagr was nowhere near the premier player as ovi. its not even close. the 94-95 season really doesnt count either when he played overseas. The canadien premier players wont leave, but if you start losing high end talent from overseas that will hurt the NHL.

you also have agents in the ears of these players as well.

http://insidepittsburghsports.com/story/nhl-jagrs-russian-agent-says-khl-and-nhl-are-equal/39757/

 

[HawkWriter]

the nhl is in worse condition now than it was when jagr left and even in 2008 jagr was nowhere near the premier player as ovi. its not even close. the 94-95 season really doesnt count either when he played overseas. The canadien premier players wont leave, but if you start losing high end talent from overseas that will hurt the NHL.

you also have agents in the ears of these players as well.

http://insidepittsburghsports.com/story/nhl-jagrs-russian-agent-says-khl-and-nhl-are-equal/39757/

How is the NHL in worse condition now? They have seen continuous revenue growth every year since the lockout. They have a new TV contract. They have a lot of things going for it, minus the obvious lockout.

Once again it is hard to believe anything an agent, player, GM, owner, etc says about anything. An agents job is to put the player in the best position possible, and money and options is a big part of that.

You also have players like Malkin who basically escaped from Russia to come over to the NHL. Some may go, but not enough to close a very large gap.

 

[DewsSox79]

I still think the players and their agents know that the NHL is a much better choice. The money has always been offered with the KHL...but there have been several players over there reporting that they are shorted on paychecks or that they don't come at all. The travel in the KHL is pretty ridiculous...both with distance and how those players travel compared to the NHL. I don't get how the NHL has "fallen hard"...the lockout obviously isn't a good thing and could hurt in the future. However, leading up to this lockout (from the previous one) the NHL has seen increases in revenue just about every single year...and some significant ones. EDIT: Just looked it up and the number I am seeing is an increase of 7.1% per year in revenue, all during a recession.

I just don't see this changing at all. There have obviously been players who were lured over there in the past (Radulov and Jagr are the big names) and I'm sure it will continue in the future. However, I just don't see a large exit and especially an exit that involves several stars/superstars.

Are you blind? the NHL has been one of the shittiest leagues in all of pro sports, they are finally now starting to recover from the previous lockout and now we get another lockout. this isnt rocket science, the league has been falling apart for a while now. 2 steps forward, 4 steps back.

 

[Captain Iago]

I agree that losing Ovie would hurt. Even losing a Bryzgalov would hurt (he made similar comments to Ovie recently) but I don't think enough players will follow to the point that it crushes the NHL and makes the KHL the league. One of the best players of all time, Jagr, went over to the KHL and it didn't really hurt the NHL one bit.

I'd much rather it be Datsyuk making those threats

Malkin is already the best Russian, but in terms of marketing, is no good unless he's traded. Kovy is in a smaller market...so what offensive Russian star can fit that role if OV defects?

Is the league bigger than any one player? Sure, diehards will easily and quickly say no, but with how the NHL marketing machine functions, or rather malfunctions, I wonder if casual fan share the same opinion.

 

[HawkWriter]

Are you blind? the NHL has been one of the shittiest leagues in all of pro sports, they are finally now starting to recover from the previous lockout and now we get another lockout. this isnt rocket science, the league has been falling apart for a while now. 2 steps forward, 4 steps back.

I am not blind because I was able to read that the NHL's revenue has grown 7% per year since the lockout. Toss in a nice new TV contract and the NHL has been going forward nicely up to this lockout. What comes of this lockout is anyone's guess.

 

[DewsSox79]

I am not blind because I was able to read that the NHL's revenue has grown 7% per year since the lockout. Toss in a nice new TV contract and the NHL has been going forward nicely up to this lockout. What comes of this lockout is anyone's guess.

on a full scale a 7% growth is really bad for a professional league. You can keep defending the NHL being this great league when in simple terms its pretty bad overall. They will never sniff the NFL,NBA, and MLB....never will come close. They are also a horribly ran league overall. The only thing that keeps the league close to being respectable as a league (which it is not and hasnt been for a while) are a few of the franchises in big markets being relevant, and the premier marketable players which the NHL has leaned on as a way to try to get back to being relevant.

 

[Diehardfan]

The management of this league is stocked with nothing but complete fools. NBC/Comcast has actually given the NHL an opening to jump up and be a primetime player in the world of professional sports. I believe that NBC/Comcast is trying to build a viable alternative to ESPN with the NHL being on the ground floor....if they actually succeed it could mean more competitive bidding for NFL, MLB etc. You would think a league who has been cast as a second class citizen for so long would be primed to make this work. Nope. Instead they decide that they'd much rather go thru another CBA hassle and shut down the league.

This league just isn't dying.....it's commiting suicide.

Something that Bettman & company richly deserve.

 

[Jntg4]

on a full scale a 7% growth is really bad for a professional league. You can keep defending the NHL being this great league when in simple terms its pretty bad overall. They will never sniff the NFL,NBA, and MLB....never will come close. They are also a horribly ran league overall. The only thing that keeps the league close to being respectable as a league (which it is not and hasnt been for a while) are a few of the franchises in big markets being relevant, and the premier marketable players which the NHL has leaned on as a way to try to get back to being relevant.

By the looks of it, the NHL rate of growth is at a higher percentage than any of the other major leagues (MLS isn't on there, but as a percentage it has probably grown more since it has increased rapidly each year).
http://www.wrhambrecht.com/pdf/SportsMarketReport_2012.pdf
On page 22

That said, our TV contract is closer to MLS than the level of the other leagues'.

 

[HawkWriter]

on a full scale a 7% growth is really bad for a professional league. You can keep defending the NHL being this great league when in simple terms its pretty bad overall. They will never sniff the NFL,NBA, and MLB....never will come close. They are also a horribly ran league overall. The only thing that keeps the league close to being respectable as a league (which it is not and hasnt been for a while) are a few of the franchises in big markets being relevant, and the premier marketable players which the NHL has leaned on as a way to try to get back to being relevant.

Saying that they have a 7% growth annually and that they are "dieing hard" (or whatever has been said) just don't go hand and hand. Clearly they are bringing in more revenue and things are heading in the right direction for the NHL (minus the lockout of course).

In the last couple of years we have also seen the NFL go to lockout (no games missed) and the NBA go to lockout (half a season missed).

If you read a few posts ago, I flat out said that the NHL will never touch the other major sports in the States. If the NHL is trying to pass up the NFL, which I don't think they are, then they are missing out on other chances to cash in. In the States, the NHL might as well be considered a niche market for a lot of purposes.

In every league they rely heavily on the premier/big city teams.

The lockout sucks and I have no idea how or when the NHL is going to come out of it. The NHL ended up coming out of the last lockout and started to increase revenue since then. Hell, a big reason there is a lockout right now is because of the increase in revenue since the last lockout and the players wanting a bigger slice of the pie that they feel they made.

 

[Diehardfan]

Stories today on NHL.com....


The Dominator hangs em up, I love the 90s and the Coyote ice girls take a break.


Real riveting reading.

 

[Jntg4]

BTW. KHL teams abilities to sign players for big time money has been overstated

"The salary cap changed from a soft cap to a hard cap, set at 1.1 billion rubles (approx. US$36.5 million), but each club can waive the cap for one player transferred directly from the NHL, if he is eligible to play for the Russian national team."

They made the NHL rule for the lockout, but after this season, players can't just take huge deals, and their cap is only like 60% of ours.

 

[LonghornBob]

I still think that some of the European players are going to go over there and find a way to stay. lockout ending contract termination provision or not. This is going to end up hurting the depth of the league.

 

[DewsSox79]

I still think that some of the European players are going to go over there and find a way to stay. lockout ending contract termination provision or not. This is going to end up hurting the depth of the league.

exactly. those who think it wont are in pure denial.

 

[HawkWriter]

I still think that some of the European players are going to go over there and find a way to stay. lockout ending contract termination provision or not. This is going to end up hurting the depth of the league.

Why will this happen though? Players have had the opportunity/choice to go over there forever and they continue to pick the NHL. Why didn't everyone stay overseas after the last lockout? Some might stay, hell a star might even, but this isn't anything new or anything really triggered by the lockout. Jagr, Radulov, Zubov, and others have gone over in the past. I'm sure I'm missing a couple notables as well. The KHL and NHL have an agreement in place for a reason...because this has/is an issue and will continue to be a minor one. Making it a huge issue because of the lockout just doesn't make much sense.

 

[HawkWriter]

BTW. KHL teams abilities to sign players for big time money has been overstated

"The salary cap changed from a soft cap to a hard cap, set at 1.1 billion rubles (approx. US$36.5 million), but each club can waive the cap for one player transferred directly from the NHL, if he is eligible to play for the Russian national team."

They made the NHL rule for the lockout, but after this season, players can't just take huge deals, and their cap is only like 60% of ours.

It hasn't been overstated. The big time offers were there well before the lockout. Radulov is getting something like $9mil a year and it has nothing to do with this lockout stipulation. The KHL has tried to lure Kovy/Ovie in the past with huge contracts. Most players don't get paid well in the KHL, so they have plenty of room to try and snag a big name for ridiculous money.

 

[nwfisch]

Why will this happen though? Players have had the opportunity/choice to go over there forever and they continue to pick the NHL. Why didn't everyone stay overseas after the last lockout? Some might stay, hell a star might even, but this isn't anything new or anything really triggered by the lockout. Jagr, Radulov, Zubov, and others have gone over in the past. I'm sure I'm missing a couple notables as well.

Because they won't be making money in the NHL for part of this season anyways, and at this rate the whole season. If the players have to re-negotiate their CBA every 5 years or so, I'm not sure why they'd want to stay in the NHL if there is more security in the KHL. Obviously there have been problems with the KHL as well, so it isn't the perfect fix nor the only one.

I agree the NHL will probably still go on, there will still be stars etc. The damage is unknown at this point, but a lockout isn't beneficial for the league and certainly not the players. The league is shooting themselves in the foot when they had a chance to continue to make a dent in MLB's and NBA's ratings/shares etc.

 

[Jntg4]

Hurting the depth is true. But look at the thread title, according to the thread starter, the league will completely "die", all I'm saying is that that is a very major exaggeration.

 

[HawkWriter]

Because they won't be making money in the NHL for part of this season anyways, and at this rate the whole season. If the players have to re-negotiate their CBA every 5 years or so, I'm not sure why they'd want to stay in the NHL if there is more security in the KHL. Obviously there have been problems with the KHL as well, so it isn't the perfect fix nor the only one.

I agree the NHL will probably still go on, there will still be stars etc. The damage is unknown at this point, but a lockout isn't beneficial for the league and certainly not the players. The league is shooting themselves in the foot when they had a chance to continue to make a dent in MLB's and NBA's ratings/shares etc.

Of course that is why they are playing in other leagues RIGHT NOW. To keep making money and to keep in shape. I never said differently.

Even with the lockout, the NHL has a ridiculous more amount of job security (and in general) than the KHL. Once this ends, it will continue. It isn't going to last forever.

The lost wages and revenue suck, but the players and owners are doing this to get a bigger piece of the pie. Long term it could benefit one side, which is why there is the lockout.

The NHL should not be concerned with the MLB, NFL, or really any other league. There is no worthwhile dent to be made.

People just love to overreact about the lockout...just hope we don't all die because of it.