It was stupid to release Leno then…

[mattb78]

The last 5 years from 2020 to 2016 his score was 74.6, 58.6, 75.5, 78.7 and 70.1. Nothing to write home about, but also not the worst.

If Jenkins or a backup plays substantially worse than Leno, at that point we can consider cutting him a bad move. There was also a locker room aspect to cutting the guy who was giving the least effort on the field and would have a number of low effort plays every game.

I agree cutting Leno came with some risk, but if the Bears don't have a good season it certainly won't be because Leno isn't on the team.

 

[Pegger]

Why would you invest heavily in another LT when you're paying one to be a starter? That's not really how that works. They paid him to be their starter, he was their starter, and his play proved that he should no longer be the starter anymore, so they cut him. I don't see a problem there.

Beyond that, especially being in the Bears' position, you can't have starting caliber players 2 or 3 deep at every position. Every single team has their spots that aren't as solid and you're banking on a rookie stepping right in or a previous bench player stepping into the starting spot. The Bears are no different.

Your eyes tell you that Leno and Massie have been average at best since 2016 when they were named the starting tackles. From 2016 to 2020 they have had 33 draft picks. Of all those picks they took a total of one tackle in the 7th round (Arlington Hambright - 2020).

So the fact they don't have depth at tackle was almost by design. Now, they have compounded that lack of depth by going all in on Jenkins. He's the already named rookie starter with really nothing behind him.

I'm hoping he works out, but with having little options and already missing camp he's being asked to seamlessly transition from college to the pros as a blindside protector. If he works great. If he doesn't or god forbid an OL gets hurt playing football they are fucked, by design.

 

[Anytime23]

All teams miss in the draft and go to free agency. In theory you draft and develop well at all positions to replace your vets, but in all fairness it just never works out that way.

I'm seeing Pace taking his inability to draft a tackle and then doubling down on it. Adding in that there's no real depth at this time he's all in.

I hate these types of comments. I never said teams don't miss. I said you have to draft well regularly. There is a big difference.

Pace has to have more than one good draft every 5 years and his best picks not be these "late round gems" who are one year wonders, just guys, or players at less important positions.

 

[Pegger]

If Jenkins or a backup plays substantially worse than Leno, at that point we can consider cutting him a bad move. There was also a locker room aspect to cutting the guy who was giving the least effort on the field and would have a number of low effort plays every game.

I agree cutting Leno came with some risk, but if the Bears don't have a good season it certainly won't be because Leno isn't on the team.

I'm not trying to make an argument that Leno was good and shouldn't have been replaced. I'm making the argument that it's extremely risky to go from a starter to a rookie without any competition/depth.

Just to put those PFF numbers into context:

Leno 2020-2016 = 74.6, 58.6, 75.5, 78.7 and 70.1
Massie 2020-2016 = 72.6, 63.2, 71.8, 65.0 and 66.8

Ifedi 2020-2016 = 65 (guard), 56.2, 56.5, 51.7 and 51.3.

I've said this before, but you guys weren't happy with Leno and Massie. There's a real possibility that a rookie Jenkins and Ifedi are worse AND there's really nothing in terms of depth to help.

 

[Pegger]

I hate these types of comments. I never said teams don't miss. I said you have to draft well regularly. There is a big difference.

Pace has to have more than one good draft every 5 years and his best picks not be these "late round gems" who are one year wonders, just guys, or players at less important positions.

Patriots really don't draft that well. Granted they are typically drafting late in the round because they are a good team, but overall they miss a lot.

 

[Visionman]

Hasn’t even missed a handful of practices yet and this board is going full Chicken Little…

 

[Anytime23]

Patriots really don't draft that well. Granted they are typically drafting late in the round because they are a good team, but overall they miss a lot.

ok

 

[HearshotKDS]

I thought it was stupid to cut Leno without a solid vet replacement waiting in the wings when they did it. Leno was bad at $8M a season, and his contract was structured in a way that you couldnt really get that number down without extending him out to 4-5 years which is probably worse than what they did. But there is a middle ground between keeping Leno and relying on Wilkinson as your backup LT (hes never played a snap there in his pro career) that the Bears should have done a better job in exploring. I'm sure Jenkins will do just fine for every game at LT because the Bears really only have a UDFA and a bunch of OGs who if you squint could be below average RTs as plan B there.

 

[mattb78]

I'm not trying to make an argument that Leno was good and shouldn't have been replaced. I'm making the argument that it's extremely risky to go from a starter to a rookie without any competition/depth.

Agreed. I would have been happier with a veteran swing tackle on the roster in case of injury or to handle LT and put Jenkins at RT if necessary.

The 2021 cap being about 20 million lower than expected gave alot of teams tough decisions.

Finally, I think culture played into the decision. We need to get stronger at OL. We have done that. Our pass protection likely took a hit letting both tackles go but there should be some gain in the running game and I think the entire staff was tired of the lack of running game push of the OL. I means sometimes on 3rd and 1 you just need to run it for a first down and the Bears have struggled at that for several years now.

 

[Pegger]

Agreed. I would have been happier with a veteran swing tackle on the roster in case of injury or to handle LT and put Jenkins at RT if necessary.

The 2021 cap being about 20 million lower than expected gave alot of teams tough decisions.

Finally, I think culture played into the decision. We need to get stronger at OL. We have done that. Our pass protection likely took a hit letting both tackles go but there should be some gain in the running game and I think the entire staff was tired of the lack of running game push of the OL. I means sometimes on 3rd and 1 you just need to run it for a first down and the Bears have struggled at that for several years now.

Just to mention, I'd say the Bears have a pretty long culture of underinvesting along the OL that predates Pace. They typically live with the problem, then make a couple 'splurge' type moves. Their previous splurge was Massie/Leno. Their current one is using draft capital in Jenkins and going cheap on the RT spot, hence no depth.

 

[Black Rainbow]

Just to mention, I'd say the Bears have a pretty long culture of underinvesting along the OL that predates Pace. They typically live with the problem, then make a couple 'splurge' type moves. Their previous splurge was Massie/Leno. Their current one is using draft capital in Jenkins and going cheap on the RT spot, hence no depth.

It's hard for me because I remember when it wasn't that way. The o-line was great from about '82 to 2002...overall anyway.

 

[SlickWilly]

And Jenkins has back tightness. He wants to play, the team is holding him back. Not a big deal until it's a big deal.

Unless you're a moron, like the OP clearly is.

 

[WestCoastBearsFan]

Unless you're a moron, like the OP clearly is.

what happened to your every rep matters approach? or does that only work with Fields?

and i’m the idiot

 

[SlickWilly]

what happened to your every rep matters approach? or does that only work with Fields?

and i’m the idiot

You certainly are. You may be finally getting it.

 

[Starion]

Leno was a monster liability. His shit play = no holes for D Monty and among the shortest time before contact for Bears' QBs to throw.

Moving Leno was absolutely addition by subtraction. Admittedly, they need better depth behind Jenkins, but questioning saving that cap $$ and shipping Leno is football dumbassery. Dumping "72 offsuit" was 2 years too late as it was.

 

[Bearly]

Cutting Leno without an adequate replacement was dumb.

Leno got a ~$2M deal in the market. Between the $9M created in cap space and what he signed there was a middle ground to negotiate something.

I'd add, offering him that original contract was also dumb.

Pace double or triple dumbed this one. His hands were all over that transaction and the only debate is if he failed 2 or 3 times.

It's $4m but at a position the many teams would be happy to pay out the nose to improve. He's the 25th valued LT for a reason.

 

[Bearly]

I thought it was stupid to cut Leno without a solid vet replacement waiting in the wings when they did it. Leno was bad at $8M a season, and his contract was structured in a way that you couldnt really get that number down without extending him out to 4-5 years which is probably worse than what they did. But there is a middle ground between keeping Leno and relying on Wilkinson as your backup LT (hes never played a snap there in his pro career) that the Bears should have done a better job in exploring. I'm sure Jenkins will do just fine for every game at LT because the Bears really only have a UDFA and a bunch of OGs who if you squint could be below average RTs as plan B there.

$9m is what we saved. He was making $12.3m

 

[playthrough2001]

and it is still stupid now. Pace shot himself in the foot, yet again.

to think he lost kyle fuller because of his poor cap management in the same offseason… that’s pretty bad.

Without Covid, Fuller is still a Bear. Pace should have known a worldwide pandemic was coming and the cap would be impacted which would lead to tough decisions. What an idiot!

 

[pinkfloydster]

I'm not trying to make an argument that Leno was good and shouldn't have been replaced. I'm making the argument that it's extremely risky to go from a starter to a rookie without any competition/depth.

Just to put those PFF numbers into context:

Leno 2020-2016 = 74.6, 58.6, 75.5, 78.7 and 70.1
Massie 2020-2016 = 72.6, 63.2, 71.8, 65.0 and 66.8

Ifedi 2020-2016 = 65 (guard), 56.2, 56.5, 51.7 and 51.3.

I've said this before, but you guys weren't happy with Leno and Massie. There's a real possibility that a rookie Jenkins and Ifedi are worse AND there's really nothing in terms of depth to help.

Ifedi's numbers were affected by uncertainty at the center position. He played better than that number.

 

[iueyedoc]

I still can't understand how people can think Leno was hot garbage while simultaneously complain that Pace let him go.

Yeah kinda funny how some CCS members have the ability to talk out of both sides of their mouth, acting like a pompous know it all with no sense of their own hypocrisy.

and it is still stupid now. Pace shot himself in the foot, yet again.

to think he lost kyle fuller because of his poor cap management in the same offseason… that’s pretty bad.

Is it possible to cut only Leno and then extend AR? I think somehow that’s the best option. Take a LT in the first and then draft a developmental guy to replace Massie.

He should have just #calledit the above. And shut the fuck up.

That’s fair. Leno has been fucking atrocious.

Why did Cody have to get covid and not Leno’s useless ass?

Leno is so bad