Jerry Krause for the Hall of Fame?

[houheffna]

Players deserve by far the most credit when it comes to winning championships. And the coaching staff always deserves a ton more credit than the front office.

That is irrelevant to the subject. GMs get credit all the time. Nobody is comparing Krause to players or coaches, he is being compared to other general managers. If GMs get fired when things go wrong, they should get some credit when things go right.

What happened in Cleveland and why did Lebron leave? Bad personnel decisions...
Why will Howard leave Orlando? Bad personnel decisions...
Why did Duncan stay in San Antonio? Good personnel decisions...

Somebody has to get the players...Krause did a damn good job of that in the 1990's...

 

[Crystallas]

Riensdorf had veto power over the picks and signings made before his official takeover. This I am sure of. That's not exactly final say, but it's shared between him and his informants and Thorn. Hunt was allover the place, like a true entrepreneur, so Thorn was left to do more than most execs did today(and he handled it pretty damn well, I would say.) I liked Thorn a lot, but he was as reserved as could be when it came to picking firepower over stopping power. He was a defensive leaning GM for sure. That's why I always doubt that Thorn was sold on Jordan. Jordan's defense was okay at the time of the draft, but not like the guard from Arkansas (forgot his name) that was passed up.

Man, you guys are making me relive the crappy pre-Krause Bulls era of the 80s. Seriously, Krause should be in the Hall, as far as executives are concerned.

 

[RamiTheBullsFan]

That is irrelevant to the subject. GMs get credit all the time. Nobody is comparing Krause to players or coaches, he is being compared to other general managers. If GMs get fired when things go wrong, they should get some credit when things go right.

What happened in Cleveland and why did Lebron leave? Bad personnel decisions...
Why will Howard leave Orlando? Bad personnel decisions...
Why did Duncan stay in San Antonio? Good personnel decisions...

Somebody has to get the players...Krause did a damn good job of that in the 1990's...

The point is that there are plenty of players and coaches that deserve to be in the Hall of Fame more than Krause. I just don't buy putting the people who make decisions through a business-minded spectrum like owners and GMs into the Basketball Hall of Fame. What about the guys like Dick Motta, Dennis Johnson, and Bernard King? Even Don Nelson deserves it more.

 

[Crystallas]

It's not about who deserves it more. It's about deserving period. I never said Krause should get in, just for the sake of it. He still has a lot of competition before he gets the votes. But eventually, Krause has as much of a case, as any GM that is currently NOT in the HOF based purely on his executive decisions. Player+coach+execs naturally have advantages to gaining votes, and that's why I wont hold my breath on the matter.

 

[RamiTheBullsFan]

It's not about who deserves it more. It's about deserving period. I never said Krause should get in, just for the sake of it. He still has a lot of competition before he gets the votes. But eventually, Krause has as much of a case, as any GM that is currently NOT in the HOF based purely on his executive decisions. Player+coach+execs naturally have advantages to gaining votes, and that's why I wont hold my breath on the matter.

If Tex Winter had to wait until age 89 to get in, I won't feel a bit sorry for Krause if he doesn't get in for many generations into the future. I don't really believe guys in his position should even be elgible for the Basketball Hall of Fame.

 

[houheffna]

The point is that there are plenty of players and coaches that deserve to be in the Hall of Fame more than Krause. I just don't buy putting the people who make decisions through a business-minded spectrum like owners and GMs into the Basketball Hall of Fame. What about the guys like Dick Motta, Dennis Johnson, and Bernard King? Even Don Nelson deserves it more.

Jerry Buss just went in last year...so they do let executives in the hall of fame. As they do in baseball and football's hall of fames...

 

[RamiTheBullsFan]

Jerry Buss just went in last year...so they do let executives in the hall of fame. As they do in baseball and football's hall of fames...

Buss has been the owner of the Lakers through the building of 3 Championship reigns (5 in the 80's under Magic, Kareem, and Worthy; 3 in the early 00's under Shaq and Kobe; and 2 more in the late 00's under Kobe and Gasol).

If it was me, personally, I would not have voted for him. But he definitely deserves it at least as much as a guy like Krause.

 

[Crystallas]

If Tex Winter had to wait until age 89 to get in, I won't feel a bit sorry for Krause if he doesn't get in for many generations into the future. I don't really believe guys in his position should even be elgible for the Basketball Hall of Fame.

If you are truly a basketball fan, please consider another angle here.

If you're a player, you can: Enjoy the game. Make money. Make all-star games. Make or break records. Win games. Win championships. ect ect...

It's a hunger that drives you to improve. It's incentive. Professionals make money, and that's can impair judgement on motives, but the motives do not exist the same way without the recognition.

For an executive, what? Money alone? Sure, they are businessmen, but they are competing with a ton of other execs. Many of which ONLY aim to make the franchise a lot of money. They can give a shit about the fans, they can careless about wining a title. Those guys say all of the right things, but never make good on their word.
Hall of Fame eligibility for executives is such a great incentive. Businessmen might not be athletes, but they are competitive. This is one of many achievements that helps the sport. Without GMs being able to get into the Hall, that's one less motivational factor for someone to build a winner. It's not like the criteria is easy for executives to jump right onto the ballot. We wont see an exec make in in every year, or every other year. We could go 4-5 years with straight players. If Krause makes it in, the bar is not lowered at all.

 

[RamiTheBullsFan]

If you are truly a basketball fan, please consider another angle here.

If you're a player, you can: Enjoy the game. Make money. Make all-star games. Make or break records. Win games. Win championships. ect ect...

It's a hunger that drives you to improve. It's incentive. Professionals make money, and that's can impair judgement on motives, but the motives do not exist the same way without the recognition.

For an executive, what? Money alone? Sure, they are businessmen, but they are competing with a ton of other execs. Many of which ONLY aim to make the franchise a lot of money. They can give a shit about the fans, they can careless about wining a title. Those guys say all of the right things, but never make good on their word.
Hall of Fame eligibility for executives is such a great incentive. Businessmen might not be athletes, but they are competitive. This is one of many achievements that helps the sport. Without GMs being able to get into the Hall, that's one less motivational factor for someone to build a winner. It's not like the criteria is easy for executives to jump right onto the ballot. We wont see an exec make in in every year, or every other year. We could go 4-5 years with straight players. If Krause makes it in, the bar is not lowered at all.

Generally, making money for a franchise relates directly with winning games. Some teams sell losing (like the Cubs and Clippers) but yeah... there is always a lot to gain when it comes to making good decisions to help the team to win. Krause had a nightmarish off-season in 1998 and that alone should probably be enough to take him out of consideration for the Hall of Fame. I won't lose sleep either way though.