Luol Deng

[senrad]

You mean Dwight? I haven't heard anything about him becoming available.
Man you guys are cracking me up. "I would settle for Lebron". You think so doctor?

Take a minute and check Dengs stats from 2 years ago. (Im pulling these off the top of my head so they aren't 100% but they are close) 18+ ppg, 8+rbg, .500+ fg% and guess what...he's only 23 this year. When he plays out his contract he still won't be out of his prime. Don't toss him out just cause he is getting paid. I wish he could hit the 3 and didn't get hurt as much too but come on, he is solid for sure.

 

[dougthonus]

senrad wrote:

You mean Dwight? I haven't heard anything about him becoming available.
Man you guys are cracking me up. "I would settle for Lebron". You think so doctor?

Take a minute and check Dengs stats from 2 years ago. (Im pulling these off the top of my head so they aren't 100% but they are close) 18+ ppg, 8+rbg, .500+ fg% and guess what...he's only 23 this year. When he plays out his contract he still won't be out of his prime. Don't toss him out just cause he is getting paid. I wish he could hit the 3 and didn't get hurt as much too but come on, he is solid for sure.

That's the thing with Deng, if he comes back to 06/07 or even 07/08 then he's a great player for us (even if a bit overpaid). This year was shockingly bad though and represents a downward trend of 2 years in a row, plus both years had injury concerns.

Will Deng be healthy again? Will he fit into this offense? Those are the questions.

 

[senrad]

I have the same concerns but to give up on a kid who put up those numbers at the age of 20/21 would be a mistake to me. I think we can live with the contract especially when you have such a cost effective wing in Salmons. I love the 3 man rotation of Salmons, Deng, and Gordon on the wings. I don't see where Hinrich fits in. Can't pay our backup pg that much money. We need to
A) Trade hinrich for cap space
B) sign gordon
C) find a backup pg for around the MLE (Rafer makes 4.something million for example). Only needs to play 10-15 mins a game.

 

[dougthonus]

senrad wrote:

I have the same concerns but to give up on a kid who put up those numbers at the age of 20/21 would be a mistake to me. I think we can live with the contract especially when you have such a cost effective wing in Salmons. I love the 3 man rotation of Salmons, Deng, and Gordon on the wings. I don't see where Hinrich fits in. Can't pay our backup pg that much money. We need to
A) Trade hinrich for cap space
B) sign gordon
C) find a backup pg for around the MLE (Rafer makes 4.something million for example). Only needs to play 10-15 mins a game.

1) will be very difficult
2) is likely if you accomplish 1
3) won't really be an option if we need to stay under the luxury tax.

I think you could say Hinrich plays 10 minutes at backup pg and 20 at sg a night, with salmons playing 28 at sg and 10 at backup SF a night. That's also a nice rotation and it further helps you if Rose is hurt at all, because you still have a legit PG.

I'm still down with your plan though I think it will be difficult to execute the first step which is the most important one.

We really needed to move Hinrich at the deadline in order to make this plan go. Of course, we'd be really screwed right now had we moved Hinrich for expirings at the deadline and Deng out.

It's an interesting thing, but if we had moved Hinrich and lost Deng I think this team would have lost another 5 games this season, and we would have missed the playoffs, and the internals of the team would have degraded far more (whereas now they're improving).

You wonder about the carry over effect to the next season in those circumstances.

 

[dunkside.com]

senrad wrote:

You mean Dwight? I haven't heard anything about him becoming available.
Man you guys are cracking me up. "I would settle for Lebron". You think so doctor?

Take a minute and check Dengs stats from 2 years ago. (Im pulling these off the top of my head so they aren't 100% but they are close) 18+ ppg, 8+rbg, .500+ fg% and guess what...he's only 23 this year. When he plays out his contract he still won't be out of his prime. Don't toss him out just cause he is getting paid. I wish he could hit the 3 and didn't get hurt as much too but come on, he is solid for sure.

the problem with his numbers and his age was that fans would look at the numbers, look at his age and automatically think he'll continue improving at a quick pace till he's 27 or 28. the truth is deng has reached his ceiling. so did hinrich. i've been saying it for years. the question is: can you (the rest of the bulls fans and, most importantly, paxson) handle the truth ?

i remember saying it on realgm about 3 seasons ago that the bulls should look into trading luol while (approximate quote) he still has the "potential" tag stapled to his forehead. boy, was that unpopular. i got so much flak for it that it drove me nuts, especially since i felt like i was the only one seeing that the emperor had no clothes on.

it reminds me there were some bulls fans who said they wouldn't trade deng for kobe or even lebron. also based on his numbers and age. it's insane how bulls fans overrate the bulls players at times.

deng is one of the easiest to replace players on the team. he's a role player, and role playing SF are a dime a dozen. the only player type that is more ubiquitous is undersized SG.

 

[cool007]

I would personally trade Deng and keep this same team - even if we had to pay lux tax for 1 year by keeping Gordon.

Aren't we making the playoffs? Didn't Jerry say, he has no problem paying if we win??? I understand not paying tax if we were losing but we are winning and only going up - especially with a solid team/core Rose/Gordon/Salmons/Tyrus/Noah and bunch of expiring contracts.

Why not pay tax for 1 freaking year - wouldn't Jerry be making money since we are going to the playoffs???

Also, we have a chance at bringing in a superstar or a great star player either in the summer or in 2010 free agency. Then why not??? By keeping Gordon now, it will pay dividends later as we will be a playoff team again and have a star in the making Rose, it's easier to lure a star player if you have a playoff team and can pay that star player - on top of that Chicago is 3rd biggest city in the USA as well.

 

[senrad]

I'm not saying we shouldn't move Deng, I just feel like people are underrating him. I don't like the idea of selling low on him like we would be doing this summer. Even if he hit his ceiling 2 years ago (at age 20/21 I have my doubts about that) that is a solid player. I would rather give him an opportunity to get healthy then trade him when his value is higher or keep him.

 

[mlewinth]

Personally, I could care less if Deng comes back this season or not. There is absolutly no doubt in my mind if he comes back it is as a bench player, as Salmons has outplayed Deng at Deng's best!

Paul DiddyDiddyfromtheCity made a great point on Bullseye yesterday. Why is it that Deng can get off all season, saying he can not adjust to Del Negro's new offense and how he has struggled creating shots in this new office; and Salmons gets traded here, doesnt know his teammates or the system at all and after 3 games was producing lights out.

Deng is a putz and we will look pretty dumb next year if we don't have Gordon but have Deng riding the pine...AGAIN

 

[Dpauley23]

Here's the thing with Deng though if he works on his threes next year then you probably want him. It's not his fault Bulls organization told him to work on his crap post up game instead of 3 pointers

 

[dunkside.com]

Dpauley23 wrote:

Here's the thing with Deng though if he works on his threes next year then you probably want him. It's not his fault Bulls organization told him to work on his crap post up game instead of 3 pointers

at how much money he makes, you don't want him unless he shoots those 3s like rashard lewis
he's just not worth it and if you can find someone to take him off your hands you should be happy.

 

[dougthonus]

mlewinth wrote:

Personally, I could care less if Deng comes back this season or not. There is absolutly no doubt in my mind if he comes back it is as a bench player, as Salmons has outplayed Deng at Deng's best!

Having another good bench player would be very helpful, especially on a night like tonight where Salmons is out.

Paul DiddyDiddyfromtheCity made a great point on Bullseye yesterday. Why is it that Deng can get off all season, saying he can not adjust to Del Negro's new offense and how he has struggled creating shots in this new office; and Salmons gets traded here, doesnt know his teammates or the system at all and after 3 games was producing lights out.

Salmons is first and foremost an isolation player offensively. So it's not surprising that he has excelled in an offense which emphasizes isolation play above anything else.

Deng is a putz and we will look pretty dumb next year if we don't have Gordon but have Deng riding the pine...AGAIN

Deng will look dumb next year? If I signed you to a 71 million dollar contract who looks dumb you or me?

 

[collisrost]

One of the problems is it's so hard to tell how much of Deng's play has been affected by injuries and how much is just because he's not an elite player. I suspect that niggling injuries have more to do with his poor play this year than we know. He's gotta stop playing for Great Britain in the summer and heal up!

 

[senrad]

Heal up and get some work in. He still has room to develop IMO.

 

[dougthonus]

collisrost wrote:

One of the problems is it's so hard to tell how much of Deng's play has been affected by injuries and how much is just because he's not an elite player. I suspect that niggling injuries have more to do with his poor play this year than we know. He's gotta stop playing for Great Britain in the summer and heal up!

I really wish he would look at how beat up his body was this year and take a year off from GB, but I doubt he will. Expanding on that, I understand his decision, and while I hate it as a Bulls fan, I can't argue with it.

You have to realize that GB as a country literally saved the life of himself and his family when he was a child. I can't being in his situation as a child and having someone save my family and then turning up my nose at them later. No way.

Also, the Bulls knew this going into it. Hell, Deng set the deadline of his contract negotiations based around playing for GB, so we had to know this was going to be a problem for the rest of his deal.

I've read somewhere the Bulls may be able to deny Deng the ability to play for GB while he's uninsured, and I read somewhere else that he can only be denied if he can't find alternate insurance, so I'm not sure. If the Bulls did have the power to deny him and did so it would really burn bridges in the relationship though, so they'd have to really consider that.

 

[Dpauley23]

You can only deny him if he doesn't have insurance, which im sure he'll get

 

[reignman]

Salmons is showing us what a SF with a 3pt stroke can do on this team. I hope Luol commits himself to extending his range in the offseason. Would be great to have him scoring in the 20s and using his length to grab rebounds as he did at times. I still see the potential.

 

[dougthonus]

Dpauley23 wrote:

You can only deny him if he doesn't have insurance, which im sure he'll get

http://www.basketball247.co.uk/news/archives/00000171.shtml

After two crazy weeks of lobbying and tireless work negotiating with insurance companies, BB have come up with the premium - understood to be around £250,000 - that allows Luol Deng to play in this summer's European Championship qualifiers.

The Chicago Bulls ace was on a Transatlantic flight late Thursday, heading to London, although time will not allow him to join up with the GB squad on their current visit to Turkey.

Deng will complete some formalities over his paperwork and the Bulls still have to officially put pen to paper to give their approval to the plan.

The minute Deng, 23, was left off the NBA's group insurance policy, the agreement between the NBA and FIBA that requires all international players to be released to play for their countries went out of the window.

At least this site says that it's not just insurance, but the FIBA/NBA agreement is specifically dependent on the league's group insurance policy and that the team has to sign off otherwise even if other insurance is found.

 

[dougthonus]

reignman wrote:

Salmons is showing us what a SF with a 3pt stroke can do on this team. I hope Luol commits himself to extending his range in the offseason. Would be great to have him scoring in the 20s and using his length to grab rebounds as he did at times. I still see the potential.

This is a good point, and it's worth noting that the Bulls have asked Luol to work on his post game more so than his three point shot. I'd suspect that changes this off season.

 

[Dpauley23]

I would like to ask Thorpe what him and Deng did during the offseason

 

[dougthonus]

Dpauley23 wrote:

I would like to ask Thorpe what him and Deng did during the offseason

Thorpe only worked out with Deng for a week this summer. I'll probably see him at the Orlando summer league if I go again, last time I was there I sat next to him for one of the days, and talked to him for most of the day, so if he works out with Thorpe again I'll see what David has to say about it.

Thorpe's one of the nicest guys I've met. Very down to Earth, very generous with his time. He gave me a lot of details on Tyrus's workouts and what they did last year, so I'm sure if I get to see him that I can find out what he does with Deng if the two work out together.