Most Overrated Team according to SI

[Packer Fan]

I was surprised that Jermichael Finley didn't make the team. Idk, maybe everyone is aware that he sucks.

 

[BearsFan51]

So Bear fans expected a world-beater out of Bushrod?

Well considering everyone's major argument FOR Jermon Bushrod has consisted of "he's been to two Pro Bowls" being one of the top four OTs in the NFL would seem to implicate "world-beater" status.

We can in circles on this all day, but Bushrod's play in the preseason up to this point has not indicated that he's a MAJOR upgrade over J'Marcus Webb if much of an upgrade at all. We essentially paid big money for what Webb has become in pass protection which is serviceable.

 

[Kekua Zombie]

How many times did Brees get knocked the fuck out in last couple of years?

 

[BearsFan51]

Oh my bad, ONLY 135 more snaps :andruw:

Again work out the percentages of both the players numb nuts.

 

[gpphat]

No actually it was only 135 more snaps in pass protection. Bushrod 45 QB hurries to Webb's 27, Bushrod 8 QB hits to Webb's 5 QB hits. Which is why when PFF calculated the pass protection percentage...Bushrod came in slightly worse than Webb did. Percentage= total number of QB disruptions (sacks, hits and pressures) to total number of snaps in pass protection.

Does the PFF stats factor in how many snaps the lineman is receiving help on (ie TE/RB assisting in the block)?

 

[gallagher]

Its like the author doesnt understand NO's offensive line scheme, which we are implementing. New Orleans' focus was on strong guards who could keep a clean pocket to let the QB step up, and have both tackles kick out to force rushers to go around outside. That normally leads to more blown blocks, because the interior linemen are kept in more so the QB can step up, but Brees' escaping is not a flaw in protection, it is part of the scheme.

To put it simply, Bushrod's job is to keep DLmen from attacking the interior by forcing them to speed rush around him. His stats dont thank him for that, but it makes for a more successful offense, and one that is harder to predict the protection.

[video=youtube;_W4c8LWm4bs]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_W4c8LWm4bs[/video], Here is a video of Brees highlights. I suggest muting youtube and loading up your own song while you watch. Pay particular attention to the plays that start at ~0:44, 1:01, 1:13, and others like that. It looks like Bushrod whiffs, but when you look at how their protection is designed, the only bad that comes from the "blown block" is that there is now a defender who ran too fast and is now behind the play. The interior line stays close together and lets Brees step up, or scramble.

Its not a perfect system, but it works well when you run mostly shotgun and 3 step drops.

 

[Willis1524]

Its not a perfect system, but it works well when you run mostly shotgun and 3 step drops.

And quick throws.

 

[Jailbreak]

Is there really anything to argue about before Bushrod has played a single regular season snap with the Bears? He's not great, but he knows the system and has been to two probowls.

 

[BearsFan51]

Oh and while we're going to argue which OT holds up better in pass protection perhaps Bears fans will also consider that the Saints went shot gun more than any other team in the NFL, while the Bears went shot gun fewer times than any other team in the NFL. Perhaps Bears fans will also consider the number of times over Webb's first two seasons that he was asked to protect for a seven step drop pass play, compared to the shot gun/five step drop that the Saints utilize.

There's been a number of factors that have put far more pressure on J'Marcus Webb to hold his block longer than Bushrod had to with the Saints and the lack of lining up Cutler in the shot gun and asking him to take seven step drops are some of them. Those aren't factors JUST on Webb but the ENTIRE offensive line.

If you're going to consider which OT received more help then you also have to consider which OT had less pressure when the Saints went shot gun and five step drops to more quickly get rid of the football.

 

[xer0h0ur]

Again work out the percentages of both the players numb nuts.

No thanks, I don't need to work out the percentages to know Webb got tons of help and Bushrod was put on an island a hell of a lot. No matter how you slice it I don't see Webb and Bushrod being equal given an equal amount of reps but you already knew that.

 

[nwfisch]

Well considering everyone's major argument FOR Jermon Bushrod has consisted of "he's been to two Pro Bowls" being one of the top four OTs in the NFL would seem to implicate "world-beater" status.

We can in circles on this all day, but Bushrod's play in the preseason up to this point has not indicated that he's a MAJOR upgrade over J'Marcus Webb if much of an upgrade at all. We essentially paid big money for what Webb has become in pass protection which is serviceable.

Good idea, lets use 2 preseason to dismiss what he's been the past 4 seasons, which is a lot better than Webb.

You want to ignore the help Webb got, fine. I'm still taking Bushrod at his price over Webb every time.

 

[xer0h0ur]

Oh and while we're going to argue which OT holds up better in pass protection perhaps Bears fans will also consider that the Saints went shot gun more than any other team in the NFL, while the Bears went shot gun fewer times than any other team in the NFL. Perhaps Bears fans will also consider the number of times over Webb's first two seasons that he was asked to protect for a seven step drop pass play, compared to the shot gun/five step drop that the Saints utilize.

There's been a number of factors that have put far more pressure on J'Marcus Webb to hold his block longer than Bushrod had to with the Saints and the lack of lining up Cutler in the shot gun and asking him to take seven step drops are some of them. Those aren't factors JUST on Webb but the ENTIRE offensive line.

If you're going to consider which OT received more help then you also have to consider which OT had less pressure when the Saints went shot gun and five step drops to more quickly get rid of the football.

You finally bring up something worth noting. That is certainly a "chew on this" thought.

 

[BearsFan51]

Its like the author doesnt understand NO's offensive line scheme, which we are implementing. New Orleans' focus was on strong guards who could keep a clean pocket to let the QB step up, and have both tackles kick out to force rushers to go around outside. That normally leads to more blown blocks, because the interior linemen are kept in more so the QB can step up, but Brees' escaping is not a flaw in protection, it is part of the scheme.

To put it simply, Bushrod's job is to keep DLmen from attacking the interior by forcing them to speed rush around him. His stats dont thank him for that, but it makes for a more successful offense, and one that is harder to predict the protection.

[video=youtube;_W4c8LWm4bs]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_W4c8LWm4bs[/video], Here is a video of Brees highlights. I suggest muting youtube and loading up your own song while you watch. Pay particular attention to the plays that start at ~0:44, 1:01, 1:13, and others like that. It looks like Bushrod whiffs, but when you look at how their protection is designed, the only bad that comes from the "blown block" is that there is now a defender who ran too fast and is now behind the play. The interior line stays close together and lets Brees step up, or scramble.

Its not a perfect system, but it works well when you run mostly shotgun and 3 step drops.

Excellent video to show Drew Brees' calmness in the pocket under pressure. Cutler has already demonstrated just how quickly he panics when the pocket starts to implode like that around him. Witness the third play of the Chargers game, Bushrod gets beat, recovers and throws the guy to the ground for the pancake block....but Cutler panics anyway and does down for the sack.

You rarely step up in the pocket with that level of confidence even when he does have ample protection.

 

[Jailbreak]

Oh and while we're going to argue which OT holds up better in pass protection perhaps Bears fans will also consider that the Saints went shot gun more than any other team in the NFL, while the Bears went shot gun fewer times than any other team in the NFL. Perhaps Bears fans will also consider the number of times over Webb's first two seasons that he was asked to protect for a seven step drop pass play, compared to the shot gun/five step drop that the Saints utilize.

There's been a number of factors that have put far more pressure on J'Marcus Webb to hold his block longer than Bushrod had to with the Saints and the lack of lining up Cutler in the shot gun and asking him to take seven step drops are some of them. Those aren't factors JUST on Webb but the ENTIRE offensive line.

The Bears are implementing the line scheme of NO, but will not be a primarily shotgun team. It's about zone blocking, but the Bears will push the ends outside in pass pro. You will see the same Forte in this scheme.

 

[Xplosive]

I don't give a damn if they think Bushrod is overrated, he is a professional and carries himself like a grown man that is serious about his job. Webb is like a goofy teenager just happy to have a job. If you plan on running a high powered offense you need a mature strong minded player protecting your QB's blindside and until J'Marcus grows up or changes his attitude, he should be the back up.

 

[gpphat]

Excellent video to show Drew Brees' calmness in the pocket under pressure. Cutler has already demonstrated just how quickly he panics when the pocket starts to implode like that around him. Witness the third play of the Chargers game, Bushrod gets beat, recovers and throws the guy to the ground for the pancake block....but Cutler panics anyway and does down for the sack.

You rarely step up in the pocket with that level of confidence even when he does have ample protection.

Take a guess who was a big contributor in that confidence being shot

 

[BearsFan51]

Good idea, lets use 2 preseason to dismiss what he's been the past 4 seasons, which is a lot better than Webb.

You want to ignore the help Webb got, fine. I'm still taking Bushrod at his price over Webb every time.

Why not the Bears went play-action pass seven step drop and James Brown gave a pressure and Webb gave up a sack and the Bears media and fans went completely NUCLEAR.

At least my sample size is two games and not one play.

 

[Jailbreak]

Marc Trestman is not Sean Payton. He will probably only use shotgun on third down. Noone should want shotgun on first down anyway.

 

[BearsFan51]

The Bears are implementing the line scheme of NO, but will not be a primarily shotgun team. It's about zone blocking, but the Bears will push the ends outside in pass pro. You will see the same Forte in this scheme.

If you're going to run your mouth at me about pass protection and then combine it with a run blocking scheme, just please PLEASE don't bother. Zone blocking has absolutely nothing to do with pass protection. Go away before you embarrass yourself further.

 

[xer0h0ur]

Why not the Bears went play-action pass seven step drop and James Brown gave a pressure and Webb gave up a sack and the Bears media and fans went completely NUCLEAR.

At least my sample size is two games and not one play.

Didn't Webb get a worse grade for playing LT against the Chargers' 2nd and 3rd stringers than Bushrod did against starters?