My round-by-round and overall Bears 2019 draft grades

[WindyCity]

No, he really didn't. He literally said:

"That said, trading up to get a RB not named Sanders or Henderson is a bit of a reach, and the Patriots ended up with Bama RB Damien Harris at #87, who very easily could be superior to Montgomery."

And yes, (rightly or wrongly), if Harris has similar production as Montgomery, it will be another Belichik narrative of winning because he would have gotten the same production from RB as CHI while also taking more draft picks from CHI while doing so. In that scenario, you can disagree all you want (scheme fit of Montgomery vs. Harris etc) but you can't really be surprised that it would become a narrative worthy of being addressed.

I think it is fair to judge Montgomery against Harris to a degree. Obviously they are going to different situations and there is no guarantee that he would have been there is the Bears had not traded up.

But if Montgomery flops and Harris is good, or even Singletary, then Pace made a bad evaluation.

 

[NCChiFan]

I do not have an issue with Pace's targeted approach, because it worked. There was a study done, trying to find it but I think it was by US Today, that had the Bears ranked 4th in draft success over the last 5 years.

I think in general, not even specific to Pace, you are more rewarded in going to get guys you believe in then you are leaving it up to the variables of the teams around you. We over value mid round picks and how easy they are to recoup.

The Trubisky trade is an obvious one where a trade up was not necessary. But I do not take issue with any of his other moves.

The quote I heard from a talking head at the Football Network was that since Pace became the Bear GM, he has drafted more ProBowl players than any other GM in the league. Now not sure if the talking head was including "alternates" who got into the ProBowl due to injury or playoff but that was the quote I heard the other night.

 

[WindyCity]

The quote I heard from a talking head at the Football Network was that since Pace became the Bear GM, he has drafted more ProBowl players than any other GM in the league. Now not sure if the talking head was including "alternates" who got into the ProBowl due to injury or playoff but that was the quote I heard the other night.

That was the article. Kap was talking about it on his show with Weiderer before the draft.

 

[Porkchop]

Watching all three films, Montgomery is much closer to Hunt than he is Howard.

Howard, in college and the pros, has shown little capability to make more than 1 legitimate cut on a run. He constantly leans into his runs and his ability run routes and catch out of the backfield are subpar at best. Howard could blow up holes like it's nobody's business, but he wasn't outrunning or eluding anybody past the LOS. From the snap he basically committed leaning forward for contact and that's good for getting to the next level of the defense, but it also threw him off balance a lot and would make him susceptible to a defender taking out his ankles.

Montgomery isn't the same freight train that Howard is, but he knows how to run better. He is more intuitive in selecting his routes, can do more on the edges and is INFINITELY superior as a receiver. He's also far better at making cuts and eluding would-be tacklers and maybe the most important factor, he runs with more consistent balance. Montgomery has the potential to be a very good all-around back, something Howard never showed to be.

Hunt is a very good all-around back, thus Montgomery's ceiling is just that.

 

[Hammer]

How about "smaller Matt Forte" as a comparison?

 

[KennyH]

So if the Pats had stayed put, and drafted Montgomery - who would those who say this is a miss, draft at our original position? Because if your giving it a C grade, then you must have A grades that you personally liked - would be interesting to hear who at that point, with the players left, others (who don't like the pick) would have taken.

For me, he seems to be a well liked pick by 'experts' on various media platforms, and most say they were surprised that he was still on the board in the third - was clearly. a position of need, and he fits the type of player Nagy likes. So I struggle too see a) how it's such a bad pick in the third, b) why it's only on Pace when Nagy clearly states that he loves the players skill set and intangibles and c) there were no superstars waiting just below to be scooped up that anyone is talking about.

The Trubisky/Mahomes analogies are clearly revisionist - I saw no boards that had Mahomes in the top three. Bit like saying we passed on Brady and how bad are we - when every team including the Pats passed.

So who did we miss that made Monty a C?? Not a criticism, just genuinely interested

 

[napo55]

Dude, you didn't even mention Ridley, who I might add had a 2nd round grade on him. I'm sure there is a logical explanation for why he fell to us in the 4th. We can definitely start talking about off loading A.Rob and Gabriel because Miller/Wims/Ridley are the future!

Not a very good idea to plan to "off load" the team's best receiver (by far!) Seems like there is always someone advocating cutting the best players.

 

[Hawkeye.]

Not a very good idea to plan to "off load" the team's best receiver (by far!) Seems like there is always someone advocating cutting the best players.

 

[TL1961]

No, he really didn't. He literally said:

"That said, trading up to get a RB not named Sanders or Henderson is a bit of a reach, and the Patriots ended up with Bama RB Damien Harris at #87, who very easily could be superior to Montgomery."

And yes, (rightly or wrongly), if Harris has similar production as Montgomery, it will be another Belichik narrative of winning because he would have gotten the same production from RB as CHI while also taking more draft picks from CHI while doing so. In that scenario, you can disagree all you want (scheme fit of Montgomery vs. Harris etc) but you can't really be surprised that it would become a narrative worthy of being addressed.

What are you, his attorney?

 

[TL1961]

No, he really didn't. He literally said:

"That said, trading up to get a RB not named Sanders or Henderson is a bit of a reach, and the Patriots ended up with Bama RB Damien Harris at #87, who very easily could be superior to Montgomery."

And yes, (rightly or wrongly), if Harris has similar production as Montgomery, it will be another Belichik narrative of winning because he would have gotten the same production from RB as CHI while also taking more draft picks from CHI while doing so. In that scenario, you can disagree all you want (scheme fit of Montgomery vs. Harris etc) but you can't really be surprised that it would become a narrative worthy of being addressed.

So, you're whole premise is that some guy could be better than a guy drafted earlier? No kidding!! That's true at every spot in the draft.

But to say Belichik played someone or schooled someone or whatever is saying you already know that is the case, which is not at all true.

 

[pseudonym]

Saw a few places today that Montgomery is the 2nd best RB drafted this year.

 

[rawdawg]

No, I could be 100% wrong on Montgomery. I've been wrong on guys before.

I thought the RB class was kind of "meh" in general, and I didn't think Mongtomery warranted 'trading up', much less trading up with the Patriots...who then took a RB at #87. The whole situation is kind of set up as "Belichick outsmarted an NFL GM again", but who knows. I would have felt better about the Montgomery pick if Pace would have stood pat at #87, if that makes sense considering the Bills took a RB, too.

I had Montgomery as my #2 or 1B RB in this class. I'm a big fan, but your opinion is very viable. This wasn't a good class. Montgomery isn't the typical RB you trade up for, because he doesn't have dynamic traits. That being said, I think the dropoff in this class was huge. The top 4, were way ahead for me, especially for the Bears who "needed" a potential #1 back. I thought Singletary was too small, and his lack of size and speed was a huge red flag to me. Harris, the Patriots pick, to me was a perfect picture of mediocrity, but he was really the only back outside of the top 4, IMO that had a preferable size/speed/versatility combination. So, waiting for a RB never appealed to me at all.

As for the whole, Belichick thing.....I think his recent drafting is vastly overrated. He's obviously a genius X and O coach, and an amazing talent evaluator overall, but he only got 1 contributor in 2018 in Michel (though Wynn and Bentley should start this year). He got Wise, but nothing else out of 4 picks in 2017. 3 starters drafted combined in the last 3 drafts. There will probably be 2-4 more in 2019, so maybe 6-7 in 4 years. As a comparison, Pace has pulled 3 starters in EACH of his last 3 drafts. Granted, he's needed to do so more than Belichick, but Pace is no slouch to be "outsmarted" on draft day.

 

[rawdawg]

How about "smaller Matt Forte" as a comparison?

Forte was about 4" taller, and more of a glider that never ran thru tackles, while Montgomery is a low center of gravity guy, who broke the FBS record for broken tackles.

 

[remydat]

My grades GoT style.

Montgomery - Not particularly fast or explosive but somehow gets people to miss tackles similar to how Samwell Tarley is not particularly fast or explosive but somehow keeps surviving attacks from the undead. My biggest beef with this pick is Pace dumping Howard for a 6th only to replace him with someone that required a 3rd and some additional draft capital. All for a guy that may not even reach Howard's numbers because he will be splitting time with Cohe and Davis. C+

Ridley - A guy who has the pedigree and lineage to be so much but somehow always ends up disappointing. In that regard, reminds me of Jamie Lannister. Not to mention his production at WR in college mirrors what one would expect from a guy with one hand rather than Calvin Ridley's younger brother. C

Shelly - Undersized CB who may only ever be a slot, the obvious comp here is Tyrion Lannister. Hopefully he posses Tyrion's smarts but I really don't get this pick at all. D

Whyte - Pick with decent upside but with Davis/Mont/Cohen/Patterson at RB with the latter two also on return duties then not sure what role he will have in the offense. Similar to Rickon Stark, it appears he will be the odd man out and the most likely of the 3 core RBs to meet an untimely demise in Chicago much like Rickon. He gets a slight bump for potential and the hope that he can turn into more of Bran than Rickon. C

Denmark - Seems to have a bit of looks like Tarzan, plays like Jane in him but his physical traits are off the charts. As a 7th round pick, this is exactly the kind of gamble one should take. My GoT comp is Oberon as like Oberon he has all the physical traits to succeed but thus far based on his college tape he disappointed in the end much like Oberon who had all the ability in the world to be the Mountain but was felled by his own hubris. B-

 

[Chicago Staleys]

Yes I came into your thread and read what you had to say then I realized this....

 

[Outlaw Josey Cutler]

I do not have an issue with Pace's targeted approach, because it worked. There was a study done, trying to find it but I think it was by US Today, that had the Bears ranked 4th in draft success over the last 5 years.

I think in general, not even specific to Pace, you are more rewarded in going to get guys you believe in then you are leaving it up to the variables of the teams around you. We over value mid round picks and how easy they are to recoup.

The Trubisky trade is an obvious one where a trade up was not necessary. But I do not take issue with any of his other moves.

I'd be very interested in that study or article or whatever, thanks.

 

[Outlaw Josey Cutler]

What are you, his attorney?

Nope, just a fellow CCS poster that gets tired of other posters trying to create a debate where none exists.

 

[Outlaw Josey Cutler]

So, you're whole premise is that some guy could be better than a guy drafted earlier? No kidding!! That's true at every spot in the draft.

But to say Belichik played someone or schooled someone or whatever is saying you already know that is the case, which is not at all true.

Your attention span seems low. Rory's "whole premise" is that if HARRIS turns out better than MONTGOMERY than it is a case of Pace looking very foolish for taking a less productive RB than NE and paying more TO the Patriots to do so.

Also, please quote anyone actually claiming that "Belichik played" or "schooled" Pace. In my recollection of this thread, the possibility of that turning out to be the case was discussed, but the claim was never made that it has already happened. But I could possibly be mistaken there.

 

[TL1961]

Your attention span seems low. Rory's "whole premise" is that if HARRIS turns out better than MONTGOMERY than it is a case of Pace looking very foolish for taking a less productive RB than NE and paying more TO the Patriots to do so.

Also, please quote anyone actually claiming that "Belichik played" or "schooled" Pace. In my recollection of this thread, the possibility of that turning out to be the case was discussed, but the claim was never made that it has already happened. But I could possibly be mistaken there.

My point, which you seem determined to ignore, is that people are already reaching the conclusion that Belichik outsmarted Pace, based solely on the fact that he drafted a RB at 87.

Ignoring the differences in the backs, the team needs, and that NE has a starter alreafy and is less in need at that position (making a trade down more appealing to them).

 

[Outlaw Josey Cutler]

My point, which you seem determined to ignore, is that people are already reaching the conclusion that Belichik outsmarted Pace, based solely on the fact that he drafted a RB at 87.

Ignoring the differences in the backs, the team needs, and that NE has a starter alreafy and is less in need at that position (making a trade down more appealing to them).

My question, which you seem determined to ignore, is who already reached the conclusion that Belichik outsmarted Pace? I know rory didn't in his OP, so I don't know who you are referring to.