Offseason rumors/discussion thread

[beckdawg]

Correct me if I'm wrong but the only good position player that missed a significant amount of playing time due to injuries was Bryant, so saying their low offensive production was due to being unhealthy is silly to me

Russell missed a fair amount of time and was playing hurt for a fair amount of time before that. Also, I'd argue Davish being hurt mattered just as much. Then it sort of goes to your definition of "significant" time. Heyward was out ~30 games. Schwarber had that back injury late in the year. Rizzo was hurt for the first month....etc.

 

[Castor76]

Correct me if I'm wrong but the only good position player that missed a significant amount of playing time due to injuries was Bryant, so saying their low offensive production was due to being unhealthy is silly to me

Rizzo had understandably bad mental health the first month, but mostly I was talking about the pitching staff as far as the health goes. The offense tanked most notably when the Cubs had all those games smashed in together.

 

[CSF77]

I see the biggest issues-
1. Back up catcher. Right now Davis and Cartini are on the 40. I actually like Davis more. Nick Huntley just signed a minor league deal with the A's but he ended up poor in framing last year. This impacts the innings logged on Wilson. Having a catcher that is plus at framing could be the right call.

2. Health in general and quality back ups.

Injury happens and this is counted by the system depth. Hitting is more of a concern to me here. They have Steele and Alozay on the cusp so a key injury is just opportunity. Hitting not so much as the key hitting talent is lower in the system.

3. Performance and trusting the coaching changes to impact the player. This one is tricky to digest. Seeing how they went after previous employee's vs outsourcing meant that they were most likely going after a prior history approach and working relationship vs going through the motions for a few months while developing trust.

 

[SilenceS]

Even if someone wanted to say just Bryant was "injured", you are talking an MVP and top 5 player in baseball out the majority of the season. His power was also zapped when he came back. Thats a huge loss.

 

[anotheridiot]

Its hard to see backups as an issue. If Bote makes the team, there are three guys that can log multiple starts together and not wear down. Happ and Almora are considered co starters, just like Zobrist and Heyward sadly enough for right field. Having Stella last year did not give you a guy you wanted to play back to back, let alone a DL stint week or three of games as a replacement for a starter. Now the entire bench really has no trouble doing that. The biggest problem is if Javy gets hurt early, before Addison comes back, and what condition will addision be when he does come back. I can see them going Decalso with Bote getting every third or fourth game at short, unless he heats up. I dont know how much work Addison can be doing with the team while suspended, so will he actually get a rehab assignment?

If they wanted to upgrade Carrot top, they would have already. They got Arcia, but his framing is probably well below your standards as well.

 

[CSF77]

Its hard to see backups as an issue. If Bote makes the team, there are three guys that can log multiple starts together and not wear down. Happ and Almora are considered co starters, just like Zobrist and Heyward sadly enough for right field. Having Stella last year did not give you a guy you wanted to play back to back, let alone a DL stint week or three of games as a replacement for a starter. Now the entire bench really has no trouble doing that. The biggest problem is if Javy gets hurt early, before Addison comes back, and what condition will addision be when he does come back. I can see them going Decalso with Bote getting every third or fourth game at short, unless he heats up. I dont know how much work Addison can be doing with the team while suspended, so will he actually get a rehab assignment?

If they wanted to upgrade Carrot top, they would have already. They got Arcia, but his framing is probably well below your standards as well.

Back ups allow for more frequent rest to the starter. Contreras fell from Grace in the 2nd 1/2.

To not understand this concept is ignorant.

 

[CSF77]

Even if someone wanted to say just Bryant was "injured", you are talking an MVP and top 5 player in baseball out the majority of the season. His power was also zapped when he came back. Thats a huge loss.

Baez went from a 3 to a 5 WAR player. Zo posted a 3.5 WAR after a injury plagued year. That covered Bryant's loss.

The true factor was Davis leveling their swing path to lower strike outs. It ended up increasing ground ball rates and got him fired. The new hire is a champion of loft swing paths. That matters and he was their hitting coach in system so the work relationship is already established.

Bryant was a factor but I think too much blame is labeled that direction. It is a excuse to cover a poor game plan.

 

[SilenceS]

Baez went from a 3 to a 5 WAR player. Zo posted a 3.5 WAR after a injury plagued year. That covered Bryant's loss.

The true factor was Davis leveling their swing path to lower strike outs. It ended up increasing ground ball rates and got him fired. The new hire is a champion of loft swing paths. That matters and he was their hitting coach in system so the work relationship is already established.

Bryant was a factor but I think too much blame is labeled that direction. It is a excuse to cover a poor game plan.

It doesn’t cover it. They didn’t succeed because he went out. They did that in their own. One has no barring on the other. Bryant was a huge loss. You don’t lose a guy of that caliber and nothing happens.


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[chibears55]

Back ups allow for more frequent rest to the starter. Contreras fell from Grace in the 2nd 1/2.

To not understand this concept is ignorant.

Why signing Maldonado would be huge

 

[Castor76]

It doesn’t cover it. They didn’t succeed because he went out. They did that in their own. One has no barring on the other. Bryant was a huge loss. You don’t lose a guy of that caliber and nothing happens.


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Let's just look at it from CSF77's pov. Baez and Zobrist had increases in WAR that "made up" for the loss of Bryant. It still doesn't mean that Bryant nor being what we wanted hurt the team. In 17 the Cubs won 92 games while winning 3 more on 18. I think the better point would be that Baez and Zobrist saw almost no increase in playing time so their increase in WAR, while off setting the loss of Bryant's, wasn't due to Bryant being out.

 

[anotheridiot]

Back ups allow for more frequent rest to the starter. Contreras fell from Grace in the 2nd 1/2.

To not understand this concept is ignorant.

Ignorance is understanding that the primary backups are not one trick ponies. You dont have a backup on the bench that can just play a corner outfield spot like most teams, You have Happ who plays CF, LF, RF, 2B, 3B. You have Zobrist that plays, 2B, RF, LF, most probably 1B, Caratini plays C, 1B, can cover 3B, in 2017 played outfield. Decalso all infield positions. The ONLY guy on this team that play only 1 position is Rizzo, and Schwarber (due to stupidity and hard headedness even with two terrible catchers with pitch framing) Most teams have 0ne guy that can do this, the entire cubs position player roster other than Rizzo can.

 

[CSF77]

Ignorance is understanding that the primary backups are not one trick ponies. You dont have a backup on the bench that can just play a corner outfield spot like most teams, You have Happ who plays CF, LF, RF, 2B, 3B. You have Zobrist that plays, 2B, RF, LF, most probably 1B, Caratini plays C, 1B, can cover 3B, in 2017 played outfield. Decalso all infield positions. The ONLY guy on this team that play only 1 position is Rizzo, and Schwarber (due to stupidity and hard headedness even with two terrible catchers with pitch framing) Most teams have 0ne guy that can do this, the entire cubs position player roster other than Rizzo can.

You can't ball a back up catcher in your theory. If that was so any monkey could do it.

Catcher is not a 1B. You need a skillset that meets the demands of the position. Schwarber did not meet those demands and gave up and focused on becoming a plus LF defender.

 

[CSF77]

It doesn’t cover it. They didn’t succeed because he went out. They did that in their own. One has no barring on the other. Bryant was a huge loss. You don’t lose a guy of that caliber and nothing happens.


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wRC+ 2018/2017
Bryant 125/146
Rizzo 125/134
Baez 131/98
Zobrist 123/82

I'm pretty sure they offset each other. The improvements of Zo and Baez actually were greater than the loss to Bryzzo.

The actual loss came from elsewhere:

Contreras: 100->122. Ties to idiots logic. over play and you lose 22 wRC+ from fatigue.
Schwarber offset this: 115->103 Not completely.

Then you have to look at the next tier:

Heyward 99-88
Almora 89-103
Russell 80-85
Happ: 103-114

over all a loss of production. Only Heyward improved.

Then the useless back up catcher position:
Caratini: 65
2017:
Avila 125
Montero 75
Rivera: 92

2017 they could give Contreras a day off with out losing much. Caratini was pushed to MLB duty and tanked. 200 PA's producing a .239/.293/.304.

over all it was hitting into more GB's that was the biggest issue looking it over. That change blew up in their faces. but it lies in the secondary hitters not the 4 core hitters that caused the main issues.

 

[beckdawg]

There was a minor mention in a fangraphs prospect week story i found interesting. The short version is teams are now focusing on juco schools in the draft more because of stuff like trackman being installed in big college programs. The thing i found interesting is they said that apparently MLB teams can pay for installation of that into juco programs and keep the data to themselves. The D1 data is something everyone apparently has access to.

They didn't say for certain who the teams doing this were but the only two programs they know of with juco trackman are Central Arizona and Chipola JC in Florida. The cubs drafted Peyton Remy and David Petrino out of central az in 2017 and 2014 respectively and Edmond Americaan and Rey Rivera in 18/16. So, I suspect that they may be a team that has done this.

 

[CSF77]

Why signing Maldonado would be huge

The outfield is weaker than the IF. Add to it 2 of their top 3 hitters are RH already.

Harper makes more sense if they went that direction. There is enough contract coming off in 2020 to absorb the hit. Tom IMO worries about budget over winning.

 

[chibears55]

The outfield is weaker than the IF. Add to it 2 of their top 3 hitters are RH already.

Harper makes more sense if they went that direction. There is enough contract coming off in 2020 to absorb the hit. Tom IMO worries about budget over winning.

What that have to do with signing Maldonado as a backup catcher

 

[anotheridiot]

You can't ball a back up catcher in your theory. If that was so any monkey could do it.

Catcher is not a 1B. You need a skillset that meets the demands of the position. Schwarber did not meet those demands and gave up and focused on becoming a plus LF defender.

In this case, you are claiming you have some inside information. Schwarber, give up? Did you read his recent article how he is going to fight being a DH and be a full time left fielder? Schwarber was going to get Jason Hammel in the rotation his first full season before Dexter Fowler ran to left field and took him out. What does this guy have to do to prove he has more desire than 99% of major leaguers? He is not deserving of all this hate. Hate him if he is dealt across town.

I dont know where the C to 1B came from, that was Carrot top, I am pretty sure Schwarber is smart enough to see he wont get playing time behind Rizzo.

 

[CSF77]

What that have to do with signing Maldonado as a backup catcher

Martín Benjamín Maldonado Valdés? Is that who you are talking about? If so I didn't know that based off you using a single name for a minor free agent

 

[CSF77]

In this case, you are claiming you have some inside information. Schwarber, give up? Did you read his recent article how he is going to fight being a DH and be a full time left fielder? Schwarber was going to get Jason Hammel in the rotation his first full season before Dexter Fowler ran to left field and took him out. What does this guy have to do to prove he has more desire than 99% of major leaguers? He is not deserving of all this hate. Hate him if he is dealt across town.

I dont know where the C to 1B came from, that was Carrot top, I am pretty sure Schwarber is smart enough to see he wont get playing time behind Rizzo.

You really out did your self this time. I think you need your meds refilled.

 

[chibears55]

Martín Benjamín Maldonado Valdés? Is that who you are talking about? If so I didn't know that based off you using a single name for a minor free agent

Considering you were talking about
Backup Catcher and Martin Maldonado is one of the best defensive FA catcher available now..

He a veteran and wouldn't cost much