Offseason Thread!

Boobaby1

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So, this guy had a really good write up on another site. His name is 12uff and I like reading his stuff most of the time. he took a good bit of time of writing this up and I appreciate the hell of it. Good baseball discussion guy. What are your thought on Cubs baseball?

https://skydrive.live.com/view.aspx?resid=F00EC371C52B73A7!267&app=Word

Good post, but I would doubt very seriously that the Cubs would take a chance on a guy convicted of doping, and the fact that Cruz stats without the drugs might be equal to or less than what Soriano provided, and there was not much potent it that offense. Therefore, back to the same ol, same ol.

Now McCann, Chavez and Morse could provide some punch however, and Morse and Chavez would not be tied to a long contract and/or block anyone. Add in Santana and some bull pen help, and the Cubs are still in the 110-115ish million in payroll.

Dejesus CF
Castro SS
Rizzo 1B
McCann C
Morse LF
Schierholz RF
Chavez 3B
Lake 2B
 

cubsneedmiracle

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Good post, but I would doubt very seriously that the Cubs would take a chance on a guy convicted of doping, and the fact that Cruz stats without the drugs might be equal to or less than what Soriano provided, and there was not much potent it that offense. Therefore, back to the same ol, same ol.

Now McCann, Chavez and Morse could provide some punch however, and Morse and Chavez would not be tied to a long contract and/or block anyone. Add in Santana and some bull pen help, and the Cubs are still in the 110-115ish million in payroll.

Dejesus CF
Castro SS
Rizzo 1B
McCann C
Morse LF
Schierholz RF
Chavez 3B
Lake 2B

Yeaaahhh nope..

That's not happening.
 

Flacco4Prez

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Good post, but I would doubt very seriously that the Cubs would take a chance on a guy convicted of doping, and the fact that Cruz stats without the drugs might be equal to or less than what Soriano provided, and there was not much potent it that offense. Therefore, back to the same ol, same ol.

Now McCann, Chavez and Morse could provide some punch however, and Morse and Chavez would not be tied to a long contract and/or block anyone. Add in Santana and some bull pen help, and the Cubs are still in the 110-115ish million in payroll.

Dejesus CF
Castro SS
Rizzo 1B
McCann C
Morse LF
Schierholz RF
Chavez 3B
Lake 2B

Only big names I could see the Cubs landing would be McCann or Ellsbury. Epstein has the tie to Ellsbury already, not that it will give him any advantage as far as negotiations go but it is something. No way the Cubs get a 3B with Baez, Olt, and Bryant all potentially available at some point in 2014. Lake moving to 2B would be nice depending on how Baez adjusts to 2B. They are reportedly gonna try Baez out at 2B to end this season or start next season. Then if Olt, Baez, and Bryant do come up next year we would have(barring no FA signings):

1B: Rizzo
2B: Baez
SS: Castro
3B: Olt
LF: Bryant
CF: Lake/DeJesus
RF: Schierholtz/Lake/Soler?
C: Castillo

Obviously that's assuming those guys get called up according to their current ETA. Obviously a lot could change that: injury, trade, FA signing
 

Boobaby1

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Only big names I could see the Cubs landing would be McCann or Ellsbury. Epstein has the tie to Ellsbury already, not that it will give him any advantage as far as negotiations go but it is something. No way the Cubs get a 3B with Baez, Olt, and Bryant all potentially available at some point in 2014. Lake moving to 2B would be nice depending on how Baez adjusts to 2B. They are reportedly gonna try Baez out at 2B to end this season or start next season. Then if Olt, Baez, and Bryant do come up next year we would have(barring no FA signings):

1B: Rizzo
2B: Baez
SS: Castro
3B: Olt
LF: Bryant
CF: Lake/DeJesus
RF: Schierholtz/Lake/Soler?
C: Castillo

Obviously that's assuming those guys get called up according to their current ETA. Obviously a lot could change that: injury, trade, FA signing

Bryant aint happening for a while, and Chavez regardless of age or the stints to the disabled list is still better than Olt, and in no way, would Chavez block even Baez because if Baez is on the major league team next year, it will be towards the end of the season and the Cubs will once again be out of it.

Chavez is a short, short acquisition. Morse could be an inexpensive short term player too. The guys moving the team forward past that could be Santana and McCann.

It's just a crapshoot, and a rather cheap one at that if you ask me.

As for the roster you have laid out if I am reading this correctly, their sure is a lot of Cubs farm members making it to the dance. I hope it happens and they perform well, but that would be a very tall order.

That would also be one cheap, cheap line-up. :popcorn:
 

SilenceS

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Bryant aint happening for a while, and Chavez regardless of age or the stints to the disabled list is still better than Olt, and in no way, would Chavez block even Baez because if Baez is on the major league team next year, it will be towards the end of the season and the Cubs will once again be out of it.

Chavez is a short, short acquisition. Morse could be an inexpensive short term player too. The guys moving the team forward past that could be Santana and McCann.

It's just a crapshoot, and a rather cheap one at that if you ask me.

As for the roster you have laid out if I am reading this correctly, their sure is a lot of Cubs farm members making it to the dance. I hope it happens and they perform well, but that would be a very tall order.

That would also be one cheap, cheap line-up. :popcorn:

Bryant is going to get moved up in the next week or that is the assumption right now. He could start at AA next year and see time aroung August unless he just mashes.
 

Boobaby1

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Bryant is going to get moved up in the next week or that is the assumption right now. He could start at AA next year and see time aroung August unless he just mashes.

Could be. We better wait and see how he handles 3B coming up through the ranks first.
 

chibears55

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Bryant is going to get moved up in the next week or that is the assumption right now. He could start at AA next year and see time aroung August unless he just mashes.

their talking that he may skip Low A KC and jump to High A..so yes if he ends up hitting in High A to finish out the yr. , he could very easily start 2014 in AA..
 

SilenceS

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their talking that he may skip Low A KC and jump to High A..so yes if he ends up hitting in High A to finish out the yr. , he could very easily start 2014 in AA..

Daytona rains out to much this time of year. They always had a plan to move Baez and Soler before the rains hit. I don't see them putting him into Daytona. Kane would be more games usually. Daytona Cubs have rained out a ton lately.
 

SilenceS

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Could be. We better wait and see how he handles 3B coming up through the ranks first.

I honestly believe he never plays third for the big league club but just my opinion.
 

CSF77

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Off season: I could see them holding the deck right now to be honest. Not a exciting response but a realistic one. SP Jake Arretta should give Carlos a run at the 5. Rusin is looking like a solid 2nd LH option. Shark and Wood they attempt to lock up long term. Jackson sits as a 3. He seems to have built up some value after a crap start. Lineup: I see The same LF/CF situation. Szczur would be in AAA so at that point I could see Dejesus moved to open up playing time to Matt. LF I see Lake as their long term answer. I see him moved down in the order later season after A.A. And Matt take over the 1-2 in the line up. Baez I'm predicting starting in AAA. This might/should force a trade of Castro to open up SS. I see him hitting #3 on the team. Rizzo knocked down to #4 after Baez is promoted. Now this is the time that we hope Bryant is ready also. Baez/Rizzo/Bryant has mucho potential. Some speed in Szczur/A.A. At the top. Lake, Castillo and Schierholtz rounding it out makes a potentially quality line up. So I see some retention going on. Nothing major as the Ricketts will start using profits towards reconstruction. In 3 years I could see some spending after the construction hit settles and the prospects are sifted through some.
 

beckdawg

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I think Choo will be cheaper than Cruz in FA because he's not a power type and he's not an elite speed type. He's just good at a lot of things and great at none. And in terms of contracts it's hard to put him over a guy who hits 30 hr's or steals 40 bases. And even if Choo isn't cheap, why exactly would Cruz want to take a Cub friendly deal? If he were to do it anywhere it would be with a contender. He's 33 right now so you would think with 3-4 years left he'd want to have a real shot to win a WS over those 3-4 where as the cubs are probably looking at 2 years before they really are contenders at best.

Choo is also a much more friendly metric type. Choo is currently 7th in the league for CF WAR with 3.2. Cruz is 15th in WAR for RF at 1.3. Jacoby Ellsbury is 4th in CF with 4.3 but I can't imagine why the red sox would let him walk. If they do, he might be someone they consider. The Reds might have trouble affording Choo. Latos has a deal coming up in 2 years. Bailey as well. Arroyo is a FA this off season. Leake has 2 more arbitration years left.

So, if they plan to spend money on OF I suspect Choo would be a target for them. At 31 he's unlikely to get a 6-7 year deal. And a 4 or 5 year deal would would work in time with the cubs OF prospects giving them insurance against someone not progressing. I would expect Choo to get something like the 4 year $56,000,000 deal Swisher got as a 32 year old last off season. If so it would also be in line with their not breaking the bank approach to FA last off season. Choo can play CF or RF and as such next year when Dejesus becomes a FA he could replace him if Soler, Lake or some other prospect is ready to play full time in the OF.

The more interesting question is probably pitching and what they plan to do there. Shark, Jackson, and Wood are a pretty decent 2-4. Baker, Vizcaino, Arrieta, and Villanueva could all be candidates for a rotation spot. Baker if they bring him back might also be a much higher rotation spot if healthy. Think he was a #2 or #3 for Minny. Do they then go after a top of the rotation starter as well? Does someone like the 29 year old Josh Johnson who's had a terrible year get Anibal Sanchez's(29 at the time) 5 year $80,000,000 or Edwin Jackson's(29 also) 4 year $52,000,000. If he's closer to Jackson's price he's probably worth considering as a buy low candidate.

If you got say Johnson and Choo for less than $30 mil a year they would be pretty good upgrades assuming Johnson ever stays healthy. Johnson obviously would be a gamble but he's shown the ability to be an ace before he was hurt in Miami. And if you can get that type of potential at the price of a #2 or #3 starter it could be a very big deal. And at that price, he's probably worth the gamble but I wouldn't go more than that.
 

CSF77

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I do not see them adding Choo or any other bat. If they did trade Dejesus then that would have led me down that path. Taking a step back and then seeing that construction is starting this year and the fact they subtracted 6 mil off of payroll from Sori and did not spend to retain Garza leads to a non logical opinion of them spending on Choo. It doesn't add up. Not based off of what they have been doing and what new bills that they will be acquiring via rebuild. Again at least have a logical opinion about it.
 

beckdawg

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I do not see them adding Choo or any other bat. If they did trade Dejesus then that would have led me down that path. Taking a step back and then seeing that construction is starting this year and the fact they subtracted 6 mil off of payroll from Sori and did not spend to retain Garza leads to a non logical opinion of them spending on Choo. It doesn't add up. Not based off of what they have been doing and what new bills that they will be acquiring via rebuild. Again at least have a logical opinion about it.

Well I did say "if" they decide to spend money on an OF. But given their lack of offense, and given that They would currently be starting Lake, Scherholtz and Dejesus it seems likely they need to add an OF of some form.
 

CSF77

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na. They could have Szczur and A.A. next summer. Look at Lake. Barley got any AB's last year and got bumped up due to production.

The fact they held onto Schierholtz and Dejesus leads to the conclusion that they are place holding for Szczur and Soler. Soler basically lost a year and I'd give him AA next year and AAA by Summer. Maybe a S/T RF option after Schierholtz goes to F/A.
 

KBisBack!

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I have said for the last couple weeks that the team and 'progress' needs to be judged by the team after the Garza and Soriano trades.

They are 5-9 since Soriano was traded. That would make the team a 104 loss team over 162 games.

This team needs A LOT of work done during the offseason. A LOT.

They need to add at least one quality, healthy, major league starting pitcher. They need to add a quality major league OF, 3B and 2B as well.

For the SP, no injury rehab or underperforming player who you hope can turn it around. A guy the team can count on for 3-4 years. Starting the season out with Wood, Shark and Jackson as the top three is not good at all. Tim Hudson, Ervin Santana, Bronson Arroyo, or on shorter deals Hiroki Kuroda or Ricky Nolasco.

They need a quality OF who can hit the ball over the wall. If Nate Scheirholtz leads the Cubs OF in HR's and RBI's next year, it will be a bad year. Beltran, Choo, Granderson, Hart if his knee checks out, Morse or Pence as much as I hate him and don't want to have to watch him throw like a girl all year.

They need to bring someone in to play 3B. Chavez was mentioned or hell, even Mark Reynolds who was just placed on waivers by Cle. Someone to hold the spot down until someone in the system FORCES their way into the lineup. Just handing the spot to Olt is a loser mentality. Olt is having less success at Iowa than Ian Stewart did. Enough said. Real major league teams make their prospects earn a major league job. Loser teams hand major league spots to undeserving prospects. The Cubs will certainly have enough money to find a real major league player for a season or two. Chavez, Reynolds, Youkilis, or Young.

They need a real major league 2B. I don't care how good defensively Barney is, you simply can't have a guy with a .584 OPS playing everyday. His defensive isn't anywhere near good enough to save more runs than his terrible hitting cost the Cubs. Fucking anybody really.

The Cubs are looking at roughly $75M in salaries committed for next year and that is including picking up DeJesus' option and estimating arbitration costs. They have PLENTY of money to spend.

And no matter what else happens, Rizzo and Castro simply have to perform much, much, much better period. I don't care about their potential, blah blah blah. This season they are below average, period.

They probably will escape 100 losses this season, but not by as much as people were thinking a few weeks ago. If they maintain the pace they have played on since trading Soriano and Garza, they will lose 95 games this year. Yes that would be a small improvement over last year, but again improvement that was largely due to players no longer on the team. The team that remains is not better than the team they had last year that lost 100 games.

Unless significant additions are made this offseason, we will again be looking at another wasted season, one of the worst teams in all of baseball and a real shot at losing 100 games again.
 
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CSF77

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The Cubs are looking at roughly $75M in salaries committed for next year and that is including picking up DeJesus' option and estimating arbitration costs. They have PLENTY of money to spend.

Again I believe it when I see it.

This alone will not make your wishes so:

http://espn.go.com/chicago/mlb/stor...pproves-500-million-wrigley-field-renovations

CHICAGO -- The Chicago City Council on Wednesday approved a $500 million renovation plan for the 99-year-old Wrigley Field, including a massive left-field LED scoreboard and a large neon right-field sign.

While the deal was finally approved, ending a process that began in 2010 soon after the Ricketts family bought the Cubs, there is the threat of a lawsuit from rooftop owners.

The Cubs won't put a shovel into the ground -- and won't celebrate the City Council's approval -- until they know there will be no litigation from that group.

"We look forward to beginning construction on our $500 million plan, but before we do, we must resolve once and for all the threat of litigation and the enforcement of existing rooftop ordinances and long-term certainty over control of our outfield," Cubs owner Tom Ricketts said in a statement.

Rooftop owners spokesman Ryan McLaughlin said he had no comment after the meeting in a brief email reply.

The Cubs expect some kind of signal on potential litigation by next week.

Rooftop club owners have passionately fought against two major components of the Cubs' plan to modernize and monetize the landmark-protected baseball park.

The rooftop club owners, many of whom also own other buildings and popular bars in the neighborhood, signed a 20-year deal in 2004 that gives 17 percent of gross revenues to the Cubs. They have specifically fought the plan to put up a 5,700-square-foot video board in left field and a 650-square-foot sign in right field because they believe it would alter the views of several rooftops, hurting their businesses.

The Cubs have said their plans would not significantly alter the views and that both signs would be put on new additions to the outfield walls that are pushed back on Waveland and Sheffield avenues to help protect the views.

The landmark commission approved the boards earlier this month -- "the generally uninterrupted sweep and contour of the grandstand and bleachers" is protected under a 2004 landmark provision -- and the planning and zoning boards approved them last week and Tuesday, respectively. The City Council signed off on the entirety of the Cubs' plan during Wednesday's meeting.

The fight over the outfield signage is key. The Cubs need to have the guaranteed advertising revenue from the video board and right-field sign to help pay for the estimated $300 million renovation of Wrigley, along with the additional $200 million for the other parts of the development, which include a 175-room "boutique hotel," an office building with a clock tower, an open-air plaza and a large video advertising board.

The entire building process is expected to take five years and should provide the Cubs with plenty of revenue streams, thanks in part to an approved 35,000 square feet of signage inside and outside the park, most of which will be for advertising.

The video board is probably two years away from being up at Wrigley Field, based on Cubs research, which includes a 15-18 month request for proposal timeline for video-board bidders, a design process and the hiring and training of people to run the board, according to a Cubs source.

If the Cubs can begin construction this fall, the first order of business will be to improve the player facilities, which include expanding the home clubhouse and adding batting cages and workout facilities, along with other amenities common at other stadiums.

The Cubs also will expand the visitors clubhouse as part of an expansion on Sheffield and Addison that will include a new restaurant.

The final sticking points in the deal between the team and 44th Ward alderman Tom Tunney were a pedestrian bridge connecting Wrigley and the hotel, which would sit on the McDonald's lot at Clark and Addison, several specifics about the hotel, including its entrance and an outdoor patio, and a 10-year moratorium on new outfield signage.

The moratorium has been approved, and the other details have been indefinitely deferred. But the Cubs are amenable to dropping the idea of a bridge, which would host an advertising sign, in exchange for an arch over Clark Street that would say "Welcome to Wrigley Field sponsored by Pepsi or something like that," according to a Cubs source.

As part of that alternative plan, the Cubs would create a patio deck overhang on Sheffield that would push back the right-field wall another eight feet and could connect the park to the Addison train stop through a new walkway.

"The patio allows you to also move the [650-square-foot] sign back so now it doesn't obstruct any rooftop views," the Cubs source said.

The patio also would take out the existing sidewalk, requiring the parking lane on Sheffield to be turned into a new sidewalk. That could be controversial since it involves the Cubs taking more public land.

These decisions will have to come through an agreement with Tunney and the city.

Tunney, who has been considered an unpopular obstructionist to this plan in some circles, gave an impassioned speech on the floor of the council Wednesday, defending himself as the protector of the Lakeview neighborhood that makes up his ward.

In Chicago, aldermen typically get leeway from the mayor to run their ward, but Mayor Rahm Emanuel worked closely with Tunney to get this deal done during the past few months, and especially the past few weeks.

Tunney, a small-business owner in the area, excoriated the Cubs' previous owner, the Tribune Company, for not investing in Wrigley Field and the area in the 1980s, when many business owners in the area did.

"We are not naive. We are not afraid of change," Tunney said during his speech. "We really aren't, but we want to be respected. When you all didn't invest, we did, and now you want to come in with big bucks in a small confined space in the community. So you know what my challenges have been to represent the community, to make sure that the small businesses that invested over the last 30 years when the Tribune didn't, we have to respect them too."

Tunney reminded the council of the Tribune's broken promises from the 2004 bleacher expansion, mostly regarding parking, and said he will work harder to force the Cubs to keep the promises made in this deal.

Emanuel praised Tunney, noting that 44 items were included in the final deal because of the alderman.

The mayor stressed that "there is not one single tax dollar going to back this up. That was an essential goal. We said it upfront."

In Ricketts' original proposal in 2010, the Cubs would partially finance the renovations with a percentage of the amusement tax that is tacked on to every ticket. After a long break in negotiations with the mayor, the Cubs eventually announced they would pay for the deal. A framework was announced in mid-April, and the negotiations between the Cubs and Tunney have largely played out in public while backroom deals were cut.

Despite Emanuel's promise, there is some public subsidy involved with this plan, however minor the Cubs feel it is. The Cubs want "air rights" to expand the Wrigley Field footprint over public property for free and are applying for federal and local tax credits for "restoring" Wrigley Field to 1938 aesthetics.

The federal income tax credit is for 20 percent, and the Cubs also want a Class L property tax incentive from Cook County. The Cubs can get their assessment values reduced during a 12-year plan: 10 percent for the first 10 years, 15 percent in Year 11 and 20 percent in Year 12.

The Cubs feel their investment, which will create permanent and temporary jobs and add tax revenue, more than offsets those benefits.

"If anyone suggests that is a public handout, it's a bit of a stretch," a Cubs source said.

Semantics aside, the Cubs are almost done with this deal. All they need now is a 1-2-3 ninth inning, which for this team is often easier said than done.


Again right now it has more to do with turning profit to fund this project vs funding a winner. They have subtracted from payroll and above is the reason why. Deferral towards the renovation.
 

beckdawg

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na. They could have Szczur and A.A. next summer. Look at Lake. Barley got any AB's last year and got bumped up due to production.

The fact they held onto Schierholtz and Dejesus leads to the conclusion that they are place holding for Szczur and Soler. Soler basically lost a year and I'd give him AA next year and AAA by Summer. Maybe a S/T RF option after Schierholtz goes to F/A.

I'm not sure you can assume these players will progress to the major league level in a 3 year time frame. If not choo they will definitely need to add someone. Maybe another guy like Schierholtz who's cheap and if those guys do become ready you trade him or Dejesus later in the season as I doubt they will be contending for the playoffs. But, simply put you can't assume that the OF in 2 years will be Almora, Soler and Lake(or sub in any various prospect here). Brett Jackson is the perfect example of this. 3 years ago everyone would have said he'd be in the majors now and making a big impact.

The reason I think someone like Choo works is simple. At his age you can probably sign him to a 4 year deal. If those prospects aren't ready in then you will need him. If they are and he plays will you can move him If they are ready and he isn't playing well then you have a decision to make in how to move him or perhaps just keep him around as extra outfielder albeit an expensive one. Also, he's unlikely to break the bank. Next year he will be expensive since they are also eating Soriano's deal but after that he's likely to have a contract considerably less.

Also, it's pretty unlikely Almora see's the field until he's 100% ready because of super 2 status. Soler doesn't have that concern so he probably will be up sooner. But all the other prospects will as well. In fact, it's questionable whether or not Lake stays up. I would say yes because they need the player and he's not likely to kill you in arbitration anyways. But, it still remains a concern.

And the thing is if they are operating at a payroll level around $100 million this year they will have the money. They may not have the money to go nuts on a 7 year 140 million type deal but adding $13 million a season isn't that big of a deal. I'd argue they can add upwards of $30 mil/season and still be within the owner's budget.
 

KBisBack!

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Also, it's pretty unlikely Almora see's the field until he's 100% ready because of super 2 status. Soler doesn't have that concern so he probably will be up sooner. But all the other prospects will as well. In fact, it's questionable whether or not Lake stays up. I would say yes because they need the player and he's not likely to kill you in arbitration anyways. But, it still remains a concern.

A mega market team with the resources the Cubs have should never worry about super 2 status.

The only teams that should be worried about super 2 status are teams with a loser mentality or the smallest market teams. Even then, small market teams like Tampa and Kansas City have signed players like Longoria, Moore, Escobar, Perez, Gordon and Butler to long term deals before they hit arbitration. The Royals also called up Eric Hosmer a couple seasons ago likely less than 10 days before he would have probably missed out on super 2 status because he had nothing left to prove in the minors and it was time for him to play on the big stage. That decision likely will end up costing the Royals millions of dollars, but if the Royals can do that, the Cubs certainly can.

So that leaves mainly teams with a loser mentality to worry about super 2 status.

Last year when Rizzo was rotting at AAA instead of being challenged and potentially developing at the major league level, people kept pointing to the super 2 status.

I correctly pointed out that super 2 should never be a factor.

If the player comes up and performs well, the team can easily sign them to a long term contract buying out the arbitration years and ideally even a year or two of free agency.

If the player comes up and performs poorly, well then you won't get killed in arbitration anyways and that player probably should no longer be looked at as a long term solution.

Rizzo didn't even perform all that well and still got the long term deal, making all the worrying about his arbitration or potential super 2 status a complete waste, exactly like I had been pointing out all along.
 

chibears55

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off season moves..

C. i think they will resign navarro and keep catchers the same castillo and navarro..

1B Rizzo

2B. system player or someone like Ben Zobrist if Rays dont pick up option.. they will try and trade barney or just not offer ARB and let go..

SS. castro

3B. Olt, murphy, or Lake

OF..
i think they buyout dejesus, offer schierholtz Arb... i think they go after ellsbury to man CF for a couple seasons until Almora is ready.
LF will be someone from their system

LF. system player
CF. ellsbury
RF. schierholtz

SP... samardzija , wood, and jackson are locked in..
unless i overlooked someone, but i think tim lincecum may be the only FA they take a shot on for long term

Arrieta, Rusin, and others from the system will get a crack at rotation, or if they get someone in trade..

Rel. i dont see them going after anyone VIA FA... Russell , strop, gurrier (resign ), and parker should all return ..
last spot and closer will be from what they already have in system, wouldnt surprise me if they brought back Gregg


looking at payroll it stands at 49.7 MIL for 2014 and drops to 29 MIL in 2015, so they can pretty much try and get whoever they want..
BUT looking over the FA list of this offseason and next for potential long term signings robinson cano, jacoby ellsbury, shin choo and tim lincicum would be the only ones this year and Homer bailey, Yovani Gallardo, Clayton Kershaw, Johnny Cueto for next year if still available..
so, theres not much going to be available VIA FAs for long term solutions the next two off seasons..
probably a good thing they chose to stock up the farm system and develop their own players, the last two yrs.
 

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