Other options besides Nylander?

[Diehardfan]

His speed was definitely his best attribute, and he also had size. I can't tell who has the better hands between Stalberg and Nylander -- maybe Stalberg, but the difference is negligible. I used to love how Foley would rip on Stalberg every single change he got, was always good for a laugh.

That was the one thing about him that drove me crazy. Stalberg had the size, speed and fortitude to get where he needed to be but his passing, shooting and puckhandling was sporatic at best. I remember telling my buddy, when I played I spent hours in our basement practicing handling the puck and shooting it against a wall. You don't even need ice to do it. How can you play as much hockey as he did and have such lame puck skills? By just being lazy, that's how.....and I think Foley realized that.

 

[puckjim]

I really don't mind him.

The trade was an abomination, but he's a young, raw player that at worst is 4th line player that can score on occasion.

They really don't have anyone better for that role right now so why not play him to death.

Highmore drawing in for Nylander was a fucking joke.

 

[anotheridiot]

I really don't mind him.

The trade was an abomination, but he's a young, raw player that at worst is 4th line player that can score on occasion.

They really don't have anyone better for that role right now so why not play him to death.

Highmore drawing in for Nylander was a fucking joke.

Just cant win with you. Highmore plays dirty minutes behind the net, chasing pucks, getting to the front of the net.

You must be fixated on girly men.

 

[LordKOTL]

We discussed this in another thread and while it's hard not to buy into that run they had.....we were all dumb enough to think that maybe, just maybe our eyes are deceiving us and this team is better than we thought. They are not....and to blatantly steal from Dennis Green...."they are what we thought are". Mediocre.....which is in itself a curse. You play just outside of the parameters of being good or being terrible. The worst place you can be as franchise.

So......for the love of God.....please don't let Bowman try to salvage a season that was basically over before it started. Trade off what you can, pick up some expiring contracts in exchange for some youngsters or picks and just let this season die.

...or it could mean that talent indeed means nothing if not brought to bear. Honestly since the all-star break there the bulk of the lineup needs a heart transplant in my opinion. Calling them "Passengers" is too good, more like excess baggage.

Nylander is a microcosm of that. He has talent but doesn't bring it, which makes him fake-tits-on-a-zombie-level of useless. We could say the same for Debrincat as well.

 

[Diehardfan]

...or it could mean that talent indeed means nothing if not brought to bear. Honestly since the all-star break there the bulk of the lineup needs a heart transplant in my opinion. Calling them "Passengers" is too good, more like excess baggage.

Nylander is a microcosm of that. He has talent but doesn't bring it, which makes him fake-tits-on-a-zombie-level of useless. We could say the same for Debrincat as well.

Sure it could. The difference being Debrincat has always been pretty consistent wherever he played....this is strike two on Nylander. If the talent is truly there, then you look at your coach which is another possibility. I don't know, it's pretty much common knowledge that this team is slow and while I'm no fan of JC, you can't blame him for everything considering what Bowman has given him. The league is speed based these days along with bigger players.....the Hawks are lacking on both counts.

 

[puckjim]

Just cant win with you. Highmore plays dirty minutes behind the net, chasing pucks, getting to the front of the net.

You must be fixated on girly men.

Perhaps. But I'm not some dope that gets his rocks off watching two men wrestle and punch each other.

"Playing dirty minutes" must be another one of those eye-test terms for a player that has nothing to offer.

 

[LordKOTL]

Sure it could. The difference being Debrincat has always been pretty consistent wherever he played....this is strike two on Nylander. If the talent is truly there, then you look at your coach which is another possibility. I don't know, it's pretty much common knowledge that this team is slow and while I'm no fan of JC, you can't blame him for everything considering what Bowman has given him. The league is speed based these days along with bigger players.....the Hawks are lacking on both counts.

JC & Stan definitely get a chunk of blame, but so do the players. IMHO the blame is fairly evenly spread. In a lot of cases players just simply aren't executing--players that know better. In other cases JC and his crew simply aren't doing their job to get the most out of the players as they are and coming up with a game plan that fits them as they are (to note--as they are means as they are, not as they did back when they were good enough to win the cup), and then of course Stan and his "acquisitions to better the team" is also in play.

 

[Jack Lantern]

JC & Stan definitely get a chunk of blame, but so do the players.

Yep. No one predicted Cat who only earned his contract after a 41 goal / 76 point season would fall off the cliff. It's mid February already and he has 13 goals and 36 points on the year. Minus 7 to boot, one of the worst on the team, when he's on the ice the pucks are going in for the opponents. If he had these numbers last year, no chance he signs for a 6.5 cap hit.

Gustafson is another guy who took a step back. He was counted on to be their offensive defeseman after putting up 60 points and 17 goals of which for a D man is huge. Strome after the trade last year put up almost 20 goals and nearly 60 points in a Hawk sweater and he took a giant step back in production numbers.

Then there is Toews with his massive 10.5 cap hit who hasn't even produced 50 points on the year...

But yea, keep focusing the blame and or count on secondary role players like Nylander, Highmore, Gilbert and Seeler to carry the Hawks to the promise land, lol

 

[LordKOTL]

Yep. No one predicted Cat who only earned his contract after a 41 goal / 76 point season would fall off the cliff. It's mid February already and he has 13 goals and 36 points on the year. Minus 7 to boot, one of the worst on the team, when he's on the ice the pucks are going in for the opponents. If he had these numbers last year, no chance he signs for a 6.5 cap hit.

Gustafson is another guy who took a step back. He was counted on to be their offensive defeseman after putting up 60 points and 17 goals of which for a D man is huge. Strome after the trade last year put up almost 20 goals and nearly 60 points in a Hawk sweater and he took a giant step back in production numbers.

Then there is Toews with his massive 10.5 cap hit who hasn't even produced 50 points on the year...

But yea, keep focusing the blame and or count on secondary role players like Nylander, Highmore, Gilbert and Seeler to carry the Hawks to the promise land, lol

Maybe if you read the 2nd sentence of my post you'd realise I'm doing the exact opposite of what you're accusing me of doing.

 

[Jack Lantern]

lol it was obvious I wasn't pinpointing you, i'll try to make it clearer next time

 

[Tater]

lol it was obvious I wasn't pinpointing you, i'll try to make it clearer next time

Well, you did quote him.

 

[LordKOTL]

lol it was obvious I wasn't pinpointing you, i'll try to make it clearer next time

No worries ?

 

[Granada]

But yea, keep focusing the blame and or count on secondary role players like Nylander, Highmore, Gilbert and Seeler to carry the Hawks to the promise land, lol

What does this even mean? It's quite reasonable for anyone to expect "secondary role players" -- whoever they may be -- to play well. It's also quite reasonable to expect the same from your core players. You need both in order to "make it to the promise land" (if by "promise land" you mean the Stanley Cup) -- you can't solely rely on your core. It's all about depth.

 

[hawkinmontreal]

Yup, what else is new.

Nylander is nothing but a Stalberg Part 2.

You could through a Rundblad in there as well. Bowman never learns.

 

[Jack Lantern]

What does this even mean? It's quite reasonable for anyone to expect "secondary role players" -- whoever they may be -- to play well. It's also quite reasonable to expect the same from your core players. You need both in order to "make it to the promise land" (if by "promise land" you mean the Stanley Cup) -- you can't solely rely on your core. It's all about depth.

It's a salary cap league bruh. Jonathan Toews 3 more years, no more cups til that elephant contract is off the books. And the Hawks front office have made numerous personnel decisions to get Toews line going. Eventually they'll learn it's JT himself that is holding the line back.

Eddie O. even took a shot at Toews a couple broadcasts ago without him even realizing it.. Eddie O. "Todays NHL comes down to high salary cap guys need to produce, that's just how it is"

Remember preseason rankings, Toe's not even listed in the top 20 centers. Ouch, talk about disrespect.

3 more years, 31.5 million more owed to Jonny

 

[anotheridiot]

We have 30 million in 5 d men and a goalie, 20 million with kane and toews.

Its easy to say its all Johnny. You gotta remember, they thought the norm for the top forwards on every team would be 10 million 3 years ago and Kane and Toews would not even be at the top of the dollar lists. That has taken longer to develop, while the maple leafs have 3 forwards over at or over 11 per.

The deals with Toews, Kane and Seabroke were completely one sided deals spewed out by bowman, never seemed like any negotiations were needed on the players behalf.

Now Bowman deals away players he does not think he can afford. Accept a bridge or pack your bags.

 

[Jack Lantern]

If JT would wave his NMC and Stan shopped him. The return would be pennies on the dollar. In fact the only way that trade happens if Stan takes on a bad contract the respective team is looking to unload.

Back in the day the Canadiens thought they had themselves a world class goalie in Carey Price. They had 3, 100 point seasons with Price in net. The team success followed by Price's impending free agency triggered the Canadiens to sign him to a then record 84 million dollar, 10 year extension. Team decline followed soon after as they had back to back no playoff seasons, This year will be no different they'll be sitting home again. Price will be 39 when his contract ends. Canadiens are screwed.

 

[Jack Lantern]

while the maple leafs have 3 forwards over at or over 11 per.

Auston Matthews is just 22 years old. He has 43 goals to lead the team with a 11.5 million cap hit. On the flip side Toews has 16 goals, lol.

which leads us back to Eddie O's quote "Todays NHL, guys with big cap hits need to produce, simple as that..."

 

[Granada]

It's a salary cap league bruh. Jonathan Toews 3 more years, no more cups til that elephant contract is off the books. And the Hawks front office have made numerous personnel decisions to get Toews line going. Eventually they'll learn it's JT himself that is holding the line back.

Eddie O. even took a shot at Toews a couple broadcasts ago without him even realizing it.. Eddie O. "Todays NHL comes down to high salary cap guys need to produce, that's just how it is"

Remember preseason rankings, Toe's not even listed in the top 20 centers. Ouch, talk about disrespect.

3 more years, 31.5 million more owed to Jonny

I know, bruh. The point still stands, and the issue is way bigger than just Toews.

Salary cap has nothing to do with deciding to tie up 11 million dollars in two goalies, or give shit players like Richard Panik close to 3 million dollars for 3-4 years.

This team is where it is more so because Bowman has absolutely zero idea how to draft quality players, because he overpays secondary role players who aren't worth their commensurate salaries, and because he makes moves like trading Panarin for Saad.

Bowman had plenty cap space last off-season. He blew it on a 5 million dollar goalie, and shit players.

 

[Missing Chiclets]

It's also too overly simplistic to just compare the Cap Hits of the two players. Fans get to "wrapped around the axle" about this.
Matthews is actually making 15.9 million dollars this season and next. Toews is making 9.8 million this season and then 7 million for the next three years.

Auston Matthews agreed to a very oddly configured contract where he gets paid over 40 million in the first three years of his deal (all but 2.1 mil of which is signing bonuses) and then the salary gets cut in half for the next two years in order to keep the cap number reasonable.
He will be 26 years old when this "bridge deal" expires and he signs a massive long term deal with a cap hit in the 16 mil a year range.
Toews was 26 when he signed his 10.5 mil a year deal.

You got to make sure you are comparing apples to apples and oranges to oranges when you make sweeping generalizations.