The Nets example

[ChettheJet]

It's worse than anybody thinks the Bulls methods are. They have something like $117 million in payroll, Deron Williams, Paul Pierce, Kevin Garnett, Joe Johnson, Jason Terry, Andre Blatche along with a player's coach and they lose big to the Deng and Rose less Bulls. Putting together a roster isn't like fantasy BB. You've got to get players who compliment each other and are willing to play in a system, just getting big names and salaries doesn't make a team.

 

[Gustavus Adolphus]

Injuries have hurt them as well, but this is a correct thought. Something I wish a specific poster would have in mind.

 

[Scoot26]

It's worse than anybody thinks the Bulls methods are. They have something like $117 million in payroll, Deron Williams, Paul Pierce, Kevin Garnett, Joe Johnson, Jason Terry, Andre Blatche along with a player's coach and they lose big to the Deng and Rose less Bulls. Putting together a roster isn't like fantasy BB. You've got to get players who compliment each other and are willing to play in a system, just getting big names and salaries doesn't make a team.

The jailbird Blazers are another example of this. As are the 03-04 Lakers (Though they still made the Finals, they got mad at each other in the playoffs).

 

[BNB]

I agree with your point, but the Nets just have a ton of issues. On paper, this team could have done pretty well. But, Jason Kidd has wound up being a pretty shit coach so far. KG and PP are clearly washed up and it wouldn't be surprising if both of them retired at the end of the season. Also, they've had a lot of injuries here and there so far this season. I'd bet that if they had a good HC [like George Karl for example] and the KG and PP from 4 years ago, this would be a pretty damn good team. But when you have KG shooting 37%, PP shooting 39% and DWill missing 11 games so far [same with Brook], you can't really expect to win many games.

 

[Gustavus Adolphus]

Oddly enough, this team would be light years better with more input from Lawrence Frank.

 

[scottiepippen1994]

Injuries have hurt them as well, but this is a correct thought. Something I wish a specific poster would have in mind.

So this makes PaxGar the holy masters of Front Office managing?
Absolutely not.
The Nets traded off there pieces for 2 allstars that are close to 40.....Idiotic....
The Bulls do NOTHING....Idiotic....

So the Nets F.O being idiots doesnt make PaxGar non idiots.
It just means that PaxGar has new competion in the idiot contest...
Plus keep in mind that if not for injuries, the Nets are better than the Bulls.

Nice try.

P.s, i know im that "specific poster" you have in mind..

 

[Diddy1122]

The Nets example is exactly what NOT to do when trying to re-establish and rebrand your franchise. The Nets marketing department is infinitely better than their Front Office counterparts as they done an incredible job of rebranding and bringing in new hordes of fans. The FO went for the win now scenario not realizing that even with the pieces they traded for, they weren't going to win now regardless. Now they have a payroll nearly double the size of everyone else in the league, are paying an LT that is larger than 90% of the other NBA teams entire payrolls, and they don't have a 1st round pick for like 5 years or something.

I knew the second that this trade was made that it would likely end in a monumental failure. Once they made the moronic move to bring in Kidd as head coach, their fate was basically sealed. Hearing him in the "WIRED" segments on ESPN is brutal. He sounds just as dumb as he looks.

 

[Gustavus Adolphus]

So this makes PaxGar the holy masters of Front Office managing?
Absolutely not.
The Nets traded off there pieces for 2 allstars that are close to 40.....Idiotic....
The Bulls do NOTHING....Idiotic....

So the Nets F.O being idiots doesnt make PaxGar non idiots.
It just means that PaxGar has new competion in the idiot contest...
Plus keep in mind that if not for injuries, the Nets are better than the Bulls.

Nice try.

P.s, i know im that "specific poster" you have in mind..

Your inability to grasp larger context of situations is astounding.

 

[Bear Pride]

It's worse than anybody thinks the Bulls methods are. They have something like $117 million in payroll, Deron Williams, Paul Pierce, Kevin Garnett, Joe Johnson, Jason Terry, Andre Blatche along with a player's coach and they lose big to the Deng and Rose less Bulls. Putting together a roster isn't like fantasy BB. You've got to get players who compliment each other and are willing to play in a system, just getting big names and salaries doesn't make a team.

This is basically why the Bulls have not made a bunch of moves. The Bulls already have championship chemistry and character. Furthermore, they have championship quality defense as well. We all know they need a little more offensive talent to really compete for a ring.

The Bulls have this nucleus, but also are handcuffed by a couple salaries, not to mention losing their best player for two years. What do you get with this recipe? A lot of bitching about Paxgar!

2014 is the year that Paxgar have been targeting to shake it up. Expect the BIG moves THIS off season or be pissed. All of this has been hugely magnified by Rose going down for really THREE playoff runs. Had Rose not go down, we might be talking about that last perfect piece to put us over the top, rather a total tanking rebuild, imo!

I say wee look to this off season to really judge Paxgar. I really believe we will be excited going into next season, but if not, I'll also be calling for a new GM.

 

[clonetrooper264]

This is basically why the Bulls have not made a bunch of moves. The Bulls already have championship chemistry and character. Furthermore, they have championship quality defense as well. We all know they need a little more offensive talent to really compete for a ring.

The Bulls have this nucleus, but also are handcuffed by a couple salaries, not to mention losing their best player for two years. What do you get with this recipe? A lot of bitching about Paxgar!

2014 is the year that Paxgar have been targeting to shake it up. Expect the BIG moves THIS off season or be pissed. All of this has been hugely magnified by Rose going down for really THREE playoff runs. Had Rose not go down, we might be talking about that last perfect piece to put us over the top, rather a total tanking rebuild, imo!

I say wee look to this off season to really judge Paxgar. I really believe we will be excited going into next season, but if not, I'll also be calling for a new GM.

What kind of big move are you thinking of this offseason? Trade or FA? Serious question.

I ask because I don't see any free agent that we can get that is any better than Luol Deng assuming we go into the offseason with the roster as is. Furthermore, I'm not seeing any trade scenarios getting us that 2nd star/missing piece that everyone wants.

 

[Bear Pride]

What kind of big move are you thinking of this offseason? Trade or FA? Serious question.

I ask because I don't see any free agent that we can get that is any better than Luol Deng assuming we go into the offseason with the roster as is. Furthermore, I'm not seeing any trade scenarios getting us that 2nd star/missing piece that everyone wants.

Well, this is tough for me as I am a fact guy for the most part. Not knowing where we pick can make a difference. But I have lots of ideas. (Below) are the salaries:

-----------------------

Player	2013/2014	2014/2015	2015/2016	2016/2017	2017/2018
Derrick Rose at	17,632,743	18,862,934	20,093,126	21,323,317	UFA
Carlos Boozer at	15,300,000	16,800,000	UFA	-	-
Luol Deng at	14,275,000	UFA	-	-	-
Joakim Noah at	11,100,000	12,200,000	13,400,000	UFA	-
Taj Gibson at	7,550,000	8,000,000	8,500,000	8,950,000	UFA
Kirk Hinrich at	4,059,000	UFA	-	-	-
Mike Dunleavy at	3,183,000	3,326,235	UFA	-	-
Tony Snell at	1,409,040	1,472,400	1,535,880	2,368,327	3,393,813
Jimmy Butler at	1,112,880	2,008,748	3,013,123	-	-
Marquis Teague at	1,074,720	1,120,920	RFA	3,034,891	-
Nazr Mohammed at	884,293	UFA	-	-	-
D.J. Augustin at	761,502	UFA	-	-	-
Erik Murphy at	490,180	816,482	1,020,603	-	-
Total salary	78,832,358	64,607,719	47,562,732	35,676,535

----------------------

First, I'd consider maybe trading Kirk and maybe someone else (undecided), before the deadline, in an attempt to get some value and clear cap.

I'd love to re sign Deng at about $10 mil/year. Then I would love for him to be our 6th man of the year and general utility man. Sounds crazy, but Deng coming off the bench would mean we have other bigs.

To me, it looks like we are gonna have two mid round picks. I wonder if we could use those two picks and package Boozer to a rebuilding team. They would get two picks in a deep draft and a big expiring contract for the next year. We would get to move up in the draft and hopefully land a star type of player.

This would clear up a lot of money. Certainly I have identified a team at this time. We'd be able to retain our nucleolus of our team, but hopefully add 1 draft pick that can play, hopefully sign 1 FA that can play, and add Mirotic.

For me, once I know how everyone is slotted in the draft, I'll be able to look at it closer and start to plug in players. We'll also know all the FA's available. But to me, finding a trade partner for Booz would be key for me. Deng, of course, will probably be like priority one to know the money.

It's a tough question right now for me. Right now I'm looking forward to the trade deadline activity. That'll give some direction how teams are feeling.

 

[DJMoore_is_fat]

The Nets FO has destroyed the organization for at least a decade. They've given up every first round pick they have until 2018. They gave a max deal to Fat Deron, who hasn't done anything since he got signed except acquire diabetes. Joe Johnson has the worst contract in NBA history. Brook Lopez is the worst rebounding center the league has ever seen. And both KG and Paul Pierce are corpses.

 

[Axl Rose]

i dont want paxgar to make moves for the sake of making moves....like trading 10 years of picks for players that in are their late 30's

i just want them to make the right decisions and make logical moves instead of standing around doing nothing and grabbing players out of the trash heap

i mean they have denied getting a 2nd ballhandler/scorer for 5 years...they signed a washed up Rip Hamilton over Jamal Crawford,.....they signed a washed up Kirk Hinrich to a 2/8m deal.....they let Nate and Marco go to sign MDJ....these moves aren't as crippling as what nets did but they are still bad moves

pax is a good gm(not great)...hes kept the team in good shape in his tenure...but he lacks vision and creativity i think

 

[CODE_BLUE56]

Well, this is tough for me as I am a fact guy for the most part. Not knowing where we pick can make a difference. But I have lots of ideas. (Below) are the salaries:

-----------------------

Player	2013/2014	2014/2015	2015/2016	2016/2017	2017/2018
Derrick Rose at	17,632,743	18,862,934	20,093,126	21,323,317	UFA
Carlos Boozer at	15,300,000	16,800,000	UFA	-	-
Luol Deng at	14,275,000	UFA	-	-	-
Joakim Noah at	11,100,000	12,200,000	13,400,000	UFA	-
Taj Gibson at	7,550,000	8,000,000	8,500,000	8,950,000	UFA
Kirk Hinrich at	4,059,000	UFA	-	-	-
Mike Dunleavy at	3,183,000	3,326,235	UFA	-	-
Tony Snell at	1,409,040	1,472,400	1,535,880	2,368,327	3,393,813
Jimmy Butler at	1,112,880	2,008,748	3,013,123	-	-
Marquis Teague at	1,074,720	1,120,920	RFA	3,034,891	-
Nazr Mohammed at	884,293	UFA	-	-	-
D.J. Augustin at	761,502	UFA	-	-	-
Erik Murphy at	490,180	816,482	1,020,603	-	-
Total salary	78,832,358	64,607,719	47,562,732	35,676,535

----------------------

First, I'd consider maybe trading Kirk and maybe someone else (undecided), before the deadline, in an attempt to get some value and clear cap.

I'd love to re sign Deng at about $10 mil/year. Then I would love for him to be our 6th man of the year and general utility man. Sounds crazy, but Deng coming off the bench would mean we have other bigs.

To me, it looks like we are gonna have two mid round picks. I wonder if we could use those two picks and package Boozer to a rebuilding team. They would get two picks in a deep draft and a big expiring contract for the next year. We would get to move up in the draft and hopefully land a star type of player.

This would clear up a lot of money. Certainly I have identified a team at this time. We'd be able to retain our nucleolus of our team, but hopefully add 1 draft pick that can play, hopefully sign 1 FA that can play, and add Mirotic.

For me, once I know how everyone is slotted in the draft, I'll be able to look at it closer and start to plug in players. We'll also know all the FA's available. But to me, finding a trade partner for Booz would be key for me. Deng, of course, will probably be like priority one to know the money.

It's a tough question right now for me. Right now I'm looking forward to the trade deadline activity. That'll give some direction how teams are feeling.

And I'd love to spoon with Brooklyn Decker and Kate Upton....

 

[clonetrooper264]

i dont want paxgar to make moves for the sake of making moves....like trading 10 years of picks for players that in are their late 30's

i just want them to make the right decisions and make logical moves instead of standing around doing nothing and grabbing players out of the trash heap

i mean they have denied getting a 2nd ballhandler/scorer for 5 years...they signed a washed up Rip Hamilton over Jamal Crawford,.....they signed a washed up Kirk Hinrich to a 2/8m deal.....they let Nate and Marco go to sign MDJ....these moves aren't as crippling as what nets did but they are still bad moves

pax is a good gm(not great)...hes kept the team in good shape in his tenure...but he lacks vision and creativity i think

Rip Hamilton when he was healthy actually a pretty good fit. Problem was he was never healthy. Could that have been predicted? Maybe, but I think it could've worked out. Agree that Jamal Crawford would've been a better pick though. Definitely wanted him over Rip, but again, Rip could've worked out pretty well if he was healthy.

Hinrich gets a lot of crap because he doesn't shoot particularly well. I've said this before, but his 3pt shooting finds a way to the 38% mark and that's really what we care about. Perhaps 4M is a little much for him, but it's not like he's a garbage player. DJ Augustine plays a more aggressive score first style so people seem to like that better which magnifies Hinrich's pass first style which people don't like as much. To each their own, but Hinrich isn't our biggest problem.

The MDJ signing hasn't been that bad. Sure he doesn't create offense like Belinelli or Nate, but he's played pretty well so far imo. He doesn't solve the shot creation problem, but he does shoot the 3 well, which if Rose was healthy would be a big asset.

They also didn't sign any of those players long term. Hinrich could be gone after this year, Dunleavy's contract is very movable, Hamilton was only 2 years. At the time of signing none of these moves were moves you looked at and complained about except maybe Hinrich at 4M instead of the MMLE.