Trade

[CSF77]

This is my take.

They tanked from 2012-14 because they were diverting funds to the rebuild.

Then they bought up property

Then they invested into a TV station.

Now they are going to tank because?

They have no revenue and loser teams with no fan base do this?

They are over tax and old as shit and have no talent?

How about none of the above.

They have talent.

They have a top 5 revenue.

Only suckers buy into the tank to win mentality.

Losing means losing.

Winning means winning.

Lowering payroll makes financial sense because the investment into that year failed to meet expectations. Thus you cut losses and reload.

 

[Snicker_Dickens]

Could the Cubs possibly trade for the international prospect SS Armando Cruz? People sat he is a weak hitter, but he seems like he'll be built like a tank once he matures. I know, we would have Ed Howard, Armando Cruz, and Cristin Hernandez as SS specs. Howard and Cruz could battle for SS. Hernandez can move to the outfield. Nico could move to 2nd. I feel our team would win alot

 

[Discus fish salesman]

I could see the cubs targeting Lance Lynn as a guy to flip at the deadline next year

 

[CSF77]

I could see the cubs targeting Lance Lynn as a guy to flip at the deadline next year

I could see both.

Cubs can spend. Sox can't. It is simple as that. Sox got burnt by Rondon and sure get a QO and go cheap. Lynn they are not going to invest here either.

Kopech and Crockett is exactly how they operate. Sale and Q ring a bell. Use at low cost and make someone else pay the dime.

The Cubs on the other hand need a fresh TOR. Kyle would be a great 2-3 SP. Rondon would be a risk but risk is part of the business.

I'm not against the Cubs dealing with the Sox but I would really lower expectations. Think Vaughn as the center piece. Add a few arms and move on.

This frees up Rizzo to be traded next. They have Wisdom under control. It stabilizes the corners and adds more depth to the pitching coming up.

But with the freed up resources the Cubs can sign Segar, Lynn and Rondon. If Marquez delays then give it to Mills. Keep the high leverage arms like Thomoson, Abbott and Steel in the pen providing stability.

This team can push out a 200M team every year. They have talent coming up now. Shoot Davis could open up as the CF opening day. I would rather have him part of a greater thing vs a train wreck and a bad joke. Asking top coin for a bottom line team is insulting.

 

[Bust]

Only suckers buy into the tank to win mentality.

The key this season is a lot of these guys are on the last year of their deals. There is no guarantee they re-sign with the cubs.

Wasn't it reported a few years back the Cubs offered a 210 million dollar extension to Bryant and he turned it down? Rizzo broke down extension talks this past offseason as well.

 

[Discus fish salesman]

I could see both.

Cubs can spend. Sox can't. It is simple as that. Sox got burnt by Rondon and sure get a QO and go cheap. Lynn they are not going to invest here either.

Kopech and Crockett is exactly how they operate. Sale and Q ring a bell. Use at low cost and make someone else pay the dime.

The Cubs on the other hand need a fresh TOR. Kyle would be a great 2-3 SP. Rondon would be a risk but risk is part of the business.

I'm not against the Cubs dealing with the Sox but I would really lower expectations. Think Vaughn as the center piece. Add a few arms and move on.

This frees up Rizzo to be traded next. They have Wisdom under control. It stabilizes the corners and adds more depth to the pitching coming up.

But with the freed up resources the Cubs can sign Segar, Lynn and Rondon. If Marquez delays then give it to Mills. Keep the high leverage arms like Thomoson, Abbott and Steel in the pen providing stability.

This team can push out a 200M team every year. They have talent coming up now. Shoot Davis could open up as the CF opening day. I would rather have him part of a greater thing vs a train wreck and a bad joke. Asking top coin for a bottom line team is insulting.

If Davis comes up next year it'll be after whatever date gives them an extra year of control, but I could see them pushing him into 2023 knowing that is likely the year they look at competing again

 

[CSF77]

If Davis comes up next year it'll be after whatever date gives them an extra year of control, but I could see them pushing him into 2023 knowing that is likely the year they look at competing again

I'm pretty sure that manipulation will be a CBA topic for the Union.

These are all you want this? Then give this up. My union does the same thing every contract.

 

[CSF77]

It is basically stealing time from the Union member.

Ownership most likely will counter with no super 2.

 

[Discus fish salesman]

I'm pretty sure that manipulation will be a CBA topic for the Union.

These are all you want this? Then give this up. My union does the same thing every contract.

MLB and NFL player unions are both terrible though. I would assume that manipulation is going to be the main bargaining point for the players, so surely they will get that addressed

 

[CSF77]

MLB and NFL player unions are both terrible though. I would assume that manipulation is going to be the main bargaining point for the players, so surely they will get that addressed

If I am ownership I'm looking at it as 6 vs 7 years of control. I would hold to Sept call up doesn't count as service time. I'm pretty sure the Union won't fight this. Extra bodies to rest the players is favorable. The Union will fight on wating a month to get 5 free months. Ownership would counter then the Union is stealing arbitration rights before a players 4th year of service. You want 6 years of control. We want 3 years of controlled costs.

There will be other issues to address like tax cap etc. But that will be a noise maker.

Now as a shop steward I deal with management all of the time. In this situation I would view it as fair and strait forward. Both sides are using loopholes to take advantage of the other side. It is better for the relationship of the two parties to close them.

 

[Diehardfan]

That 35 yo pitcher has a 1.99 ERA IN THE AL

That oft injured lefty is not now.

It goes both ways. You point towards to get a cheaper offer.

But the point was: the Cubs are not as far away as people think.

They dump Bryant, Rizzo, Baez, Jake, Happ and Willams.

Peeps then think break it apart and start from scratch..
Wtf would a 500M revenue team do this?

Fucking stupid logic.

Didn't work. Fine reload and attack in 2022.

LOL, another one of your hair brained schemes. Since you are a batting 1.000 at being wrong and to my knowledge the Cubs have never done anything you suggested.....wait, wait, wait. I apologize....there was one, I think. I believe you were one of the many amatuer GM's who was all for the Cubs trading for Quintana because you percieved that the Cubs were "not that far away". Hey, maybe you could strike gold again....sign a 35 yr old FA and a guy who has been injured every freaking year he's been in the majors. Why? Because the Cubs are "not that far away".

You are a Kenny Williams wannabe. Give it up. The longer they wait to do what's needed, the harder it's gonna be.

 

[CSF77]

LOL, another one of your hair brained schemes. Since you are a batting 1.000 at being wrong and to my knowledge the Cubs have never done anything you suggested.....wait, wait, wait. I apologize....there was one, I think. I believe you were one of the many amatuer GM's who was all for the Cubs trading for Quintana because you percieved that the Cubs were "not that far away". Hey, maybe you could strike gold again....sign a 35 yr old FA and a guy who has been injured every freaking year he's been in the majors. Why? Because the Cubs are "not that far away".

You are a Kenny Williams wannabe. Give it up. The longer they wait to do what's needed, the harder it's gonna be.

Uhm no. I was pissed off on that trade.
I was pissed off that they traded Darvish.
I applauded that Theo targeted Darvish and let Jake walk.
I was upset that Theo took Alamora vs Fried in the draft.

To be honest I've been more right than wrong in my couch GM job. Not that I am counting.

 

[CSF77]

Actually the athletic is now saying push Thompson and Steel to the rotation. You can necro my posts about that. You have my permission. I didn't copywrite it.

 

[CSF77]

But I will make this a simple a possible for you.

The Cubs make big dollars.
More than your whole family will make in their life times.

In one year.

If they do not spend then that big money gets smaller because beer cup trains are only fun when you are winning.

Losing makes fans unhappy.

Unhappy fans find no enjoyment in beer cup trains.

So save the beer cup train and invest.

 

[Diehardfan]

You are a mailman that thinks he's a baseball expert. You are not. Is that simple enough for you? I'm not gonna go back and look at your old posts....I don't have to. See if you can find one person in here that thinks you get more things right than wrong. I read some of the crap you write and I laugh at it and I'm not the only one. You throw a lot of shit against the wall hoping something sticks.

Perfect example is in this very thread.....Cub fans dislike losing followed by some beer cup jibberish. I'm assumming you think losing will effect the income. Does it stop them from paying big money to go to a game? Not in the least.....from 2010 through 2014, they were one of the worst teams if not THEE worst team. One of those years they lost 100 games and still drew just under 3 million fans for 10th in all of MLB. So don't feed us this bullshit about losing fan support because of losing. "The Cubs make big dollars" Really? Gosh, I don't think anyone here would've known that. We all thank you for the heads up.....

I read what Hoyer said....if he's set on doing this yearly patchwork crap, he and his bad trades should be launched right along with the garbage players he keeps bringing in.

So, they will be contending in 2022....lmao. Are you referring to our current timeline or is this in an alternate universe? If they are buyers and not sellers at the 2022 deadline and are still in contention , I will publicly apologize to you. There is no way in hell that is gonna happen.

 

[JP Hochbaum]

Let's face it the problem is not payroll. The problem was building a team that was built to be dependant on a HR.

That was the issue.

This. I 100% agree the team was built to be too one dimensional. I think Theo didn't plan on pitching evolving so much. Had we taken this same team and transplanted them to 2004-2011 we could have won 5 world series and mashed the ball. But pitching velocity increased way too much and made batting averages tank.

 

[Probie2429]

Cubs just need to bite the bullet and start another rebuild. They have already waited 2-3 years too long as it is. Everyone could see that the Core got complacent and started seeing their big contract on the horizon. The good news is that Epstein built up the infrastructure that the franchise lacked for decades that allows them to build through the draft and develop prospects now. If they are smart, they can get back into contention in 3-4 years.