Sculpt
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The guy who wrote the article thinks it's a 2nd plus a conditional 3rd or 4th.
Bearly
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And you in comprehension? On a side note, I'm always fixing my accoutant's fuckups.:facepalm:
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What is the unanimous part?
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what? the purpose of a tear down is to get to the SB. Such declarative statements.
RacerX
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fify
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I'd honestly take that.
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What Qb would we have taken in the draft of we hadn't traded for Cutler? Tebow? Claussen? We wouldn't have gotten Bradford or Stafford the year before and both those were weak Qb classes... Not saying the trade was great, but JA thought it was worth the gamble and without hindsight I would probably do it too. But I'm just an armchair GM
Bearly
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You can use best case as you have or worst case like Tebow. The average truth lies somewhere in the middle but favors me if you look at what actually happens in drafts and what was available at our spots. Yes it cost us 2 picks but they weren't for nothing, regardless of how you feel about Jay. It got us an average QB. Next couple years, we could have had Josh Freeman, Pat White, Tim Tebow or Jimmy Clausen in the 1st 2 rounds and like Denver, we were looking. Add a year and it's Kaepernick and Dalton. I don't think we'd be waiting for Wilson and/or take him in one or 2. Maybe taken Weeden or Osweiler instead if we did wait or decided we needed to try again(2 picks). Wilson wasn't there for us in 3. How many of those guys that went after our picks in 1 and 2 are better than Jay and what's Orton been doing?
Jay isn't the answer but he's not really a big issue in terms of team success either. We're actually better off with him than without until we can find a premier QB.
Bearly
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I take it as well, he's not going to be part of team when it crawls out of this hole anyway.....but not if I have to watch Clausen for the rest of the year. Let Fales take over at some point.
Toast88
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Hahaha, thanks---I needed a good laugh.
You know damn well the regime would have fucked up those picks anyway.
Hey, I'm not saying it wasn't a shitty trade---it was. But the Bears aren't still suffering negative effects from that trade, other than being saddled with an expensive, below-average quarterback.
I mean, that's a big one. But they're not missing those picks or Orton. Someone mentioned elsewhere one of those picks ended up being Demariyus Thomas. I reject that because it's likely that's not who the Bears would have selected.
Toast88
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This is a really good point. For all the hand-wringing over the trade, if the Bears had never done it and instead tried to draft a QB in that or successive years, it's almost certain they would've chosen a QB much worse than Cutler.
Sculpt
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Dont get me wrong, i agreed the Jay-trade didnt kill the Bears, it was the lack of good OL picks. Jay wins with lots of time; thats something. I'm just saying Jay cost us two 1sts & Orton, not a first and a third beyond what the Bears would have used trying to find a new QB. Just my opinion.
Don't Care
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Orton was worth a first we could have won with him and 2 more first round hits on defense. Did you not see him play in Buffalo last year? He's not a world beater but he also isn't that far off from Cutler in production.
Don't Care
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On offense you'd have Orton, Forte, and Olson. Get one more TE or big-bodied WR. Let Urlacher, Briggs, Peppers, and Tillman along with V. Davis (2009) and Pierre-Paul (2010) run the defense. Hester and Gould special teams. Tell me that's not a team that could win a SB.
mecha
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Cutler trade, back in 2009, actually made sense then. he was young, alternate or not came off a Pro Bowl, and certainly could have been more explosive than Orton. having Ron Turner and Pep Hamilton etc. began the stunting, then he had a couple decent years with Martz, then he gets stuck with clueless Tice. then completely falls off the deep end in the Trestman years.
I think if there was competent coaching consistency on offense we wouldn't even be arguing about this today. even if he was middle of the road and seemingly didn't cost the team games (he hasn't in the last 3 years at least) people wouldn't be going off about how they need to unload him.
I personally thought Orton was decent. the team by time he was starter had missed on a couple drafts and the offensive line was getting a little bad. the receivers were a joke until Marshall was brought in, which was during a new array of issues on offense.
realistically there was always some crucial piece missing, 2013 season excluded where Josh McCown looked like a world beater. the team is sad, guys.
I think if there was competent coaching consistency on offense we wouldn't even be arguing about this today. even if he was middle of the road and seemingly didn't cost the team games (he hasn't in the last 3 years at least) people wouldn't be going off about how they need to unload him.
I personally thought Orton was decent. the team by time he was starter had missed on a couple drafts and the offensive line was getting a little bad. the receivers were a joke until Marshall was brought in, which was during a new array of issues on offense.
realistically there was always some crucial piece missing, 2013 season excluded where Josh McCown looked like a world beater. the team is sad, guys.
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And he may still be the coach when they are good again.
But his value is in the fact that he is going to make the next couple of years respectable and the team will grow.
Fox knew he was coming here to over see a tear down. But you need an experienced guy to handle the locker room and media, you need a guy who can get good coaches to work with young players.
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That's not a team that can win the SB.
