What is your 2017 QB depth chart?

[WindyCity]

Exactly, which is why I'm fine with taking another pass rusher or an elite secondary player in the top 5. With Houston getting cut and McPhee minimized to snap count, pass rusher will again be a need even if Floyd balls out the rest of the season. QB can be picked in the 2nd, or could trade up back into the 1st. I wouldn't mind seeing Pace double dip on the position

I agree that they do need to pick a QB to improve.

But to truly compete you do need a fairly elite QB. Outside of Flacco the same 5 QBs have won literally the last 10 Super Bowls. Now part of that is good teams, but it is also the fact that they are the best players at the most important position.

The problem with the wait till the 2nd, or trade back into the 1st plan, is that you are more likely to find a difference making pass rusher after round 1 than you are a QB.

 

[Treehorn]

So most of the board will piss and moan about our greatest problem(shitty QB play for the past 30 years) yet want to see what QB falls to us in the 2nd or 3rd round after not using a top 3 pick on a QB. Seems legit.

 

[Treehorn]

Eli Manning is not an elite QB. 2016 Peyton Manning was terrible. Wilson and Brady were mid-round picks. Brees was a 2nd round pick on his 2nd team. Rodgers was drafted at the end of the 1st round. Only Roethlisberger fulfills the "top pick/elite QB" criteria, and even he was taken outside the top 10.

I am no fan of Eli but during both those Superbowl runs Eli played at an elite level. He may not be elite but he has elite talent and it showed during those runs.

 

[Treehorn]

That proves my point, no? Eli is miles better than Cutler (who isn't?), but he's not elite. The Bears need a QB who doesn't turn the ball over twice a game. That's not "elite", and I would say that doesn't even fall under Windy's "fairly elite" categorization.

IMO, when you draft QB's 1 or 2 you get physical traits that are uncommon, or elite. Now they do not always show and Eli may or may not be elite but during those playoff runs when they won the superbowl he was elite. I would rather draft a QB with the chance of being elite vs. hoping you strike gold in the 2nd or 3rd. The Bears absolutely need to draft a QB with their 1st round pick this year because it is almost guaranteed to be a top 3 pick.

 

[didshereallysaythat]

I see very little "uncommon" physical traits among the QBs of the last 10 SB winners. Peyton Manning was literally crippled. Tom Brady is old and unathletic. Roethlisberger is chubby. Rodgers is somewhat athletic but has an average arm. Flacco is big. Eli Manning isn't much of anything. Brees is nothing. Russell Wilson has the only "uncommon" physical trait with his elusiveness, but he's also short with an average arm.

I am not sure how "elite physical traits" is a blueprint for success.

Wut

 

[didshereallysaythat]

Do you watch football?

Rodgers has good arm strength, but not elite/uncommon physical arm strength. If he did, there is no way the Niners take Alex Smith over him. Rodgers whole game is accuracy and timing, both of which have been off this year, and when Rodgers tries to depend on his arm strength he gets picked off.

Rodgers absolutely has elite/uncommon physical arm strength. They just didn't know it when he was drafted.

 

[didshereallysaythat]

That's kind of self-defeating to this 'argument', no?

No, it's not. You made a blanket statement that Rodgers had an average arm and now you have egg on your face.

 

[didshereallysaythat]

He does not have elite/uncommon arm strength. Ryan Mallett has a stronger arm, and he is out of the league. Rodgers isn't elite because of his elite/uncommon arm strength.

He absolutely does.

 

[didshereallysaythat]

http://bleacherreport.com/articles/...m-strength-of-all-32-nfl-starting-qbs/page/33 Ranked number 1

http://www.nfl.com/news/story/0ap30...-stafford-leads-list-of-top-10-strongest-arms Ranked 4th

http://www.foxsports.com/nfl/story/...-rodgers-matthew-stafford-michael-vick-063013 Ranked 2nd

 

[bearmick]

http://bleacherreport.com/articles/...m-strength-of-all-32-nfl-starting-qbs/page/33 Ranked number 1

This has Drew Brees ahead of Matt Stafford.

 

[didshereallysaythat]

This has Drew Brees ahead of Matt Stafford.

The point still stands.

 

[didshereallysaythat]

Which is?

 

[bearmick]

I love bleacher report rankings, especially when they are from 2012. Perhaps didshe can start a thread about how Roddy White is the best deep WR in the NFL, and Wes Welker is the best at running 'underneath' routes.

Rodgers isn't elite because of his elite/uncommon arm strength.

I've never thought so either. I think what he does have an uncommon ability to do is get his full zip with accuracy at more awkward angles and on the run better than anyone else, but I've never really thought he was a "throw it through a brick wall" type like Stafford, Cutler or Flacco.

 

[didshereallysaythat]

[video=youtube;owhXC_I4lMQ]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=owhXC_I4lMQ[/video]

 

[WindyCity]

All of the QBs mentioned are top 10 QBs in the NFL, which probably is important when defining a top 10 QB.

I think you need a top 10 QB in the NFL to realistically win a Super Bowl. Eli at that time was easily a top 10 QB and even crippled Peyton was still the greatest mind to play in the NFL.


I am not saying that you need to take that player in the top 10. I agree there are plenty of examples of guys picked later on that are top 10 guys, Derek Carr being an example of a young 2nd round pick who I think you can win a Super Bowl with.

It is just easier to pick those guys early as fewer teams can screw it up for you by taking your guy. In 2014 the Rams could have been waiting for Derek Carr to fall to them in the 2nd and then the Raiders scooped him.

Do not reach on a QB, but if a guy you really like is there then take him, you can cycle back to safety etc in round 2.

 

[westcoast bear fanatic]

Draft Pick (hopefully some white guy )
Hoyer
Shaw

 

[didshereallysaythat]

So you have no point...gotcha!

The discussion was that the Bears need to draft a QB with a high pick in order to get a QB with elite physical traits, which in turn translates into a Super Bowl winning QB. My response was that the Super Bowl winning QBs don't have elite physical traits, and only Eli Manning was actually a top 10 pick. Even if we allow that Aaron Rodgers has elite/uncommon arm strength, the fact that he was drafted at the end of the first round should be a point AGAINST the Bears needing to take a QB with a top pick, not for it.

My point was that Rodgers does have a unique strong arm. You even went as far as to say his arm was average... which is laughable.

The bold is silly too. So we should assume that since the vast majority of the league underrated Rodgers, that we should wait to draft a QB since it *could* happen again... rather than being proactive and drafting a player we like in the first round and not leaving their draft availability up to chance. Give me a break.

 

[didshereallysaythat]

You are silly. I'm guessing that finding an elite or SB-winning QB outside of the top 10 *could* happen again, since its happened with Rodgers, Roethlisberger, Brees, Wilson, Brady, Flacco.

I guess I have to ask you again, what is your point? How/why are you using Aaron Rodgers as the point of reference for the Bears' draft strategy?

Different subtopics are brought up in each thread all the time. I did not make any mention of Aaron Rodgers career success at pick 24 to the Bears draft strategy until my last post before this one. I jumped in to this thread mainly to mention that Rodgers absolutely has elite arm strength.

 

[didshereallysaythat]

http://www.cbssports.com/nfl/news/d...mate-aaron-rodgers-arm-strength-on-hail-mary/

I think Rory is Jim Caldwell.

 

[WindyCity]

What? Peyton Manning was one of the worst QBs in the league last year. Joe Flacco and Eli Manning are borderline top 10 guys. As is Russell Wilson. Brady, Roethlisberger, Brees & Rodgers were elite IMO, and even some people debated Roethlisberger's "eliteness".

And top 10 is just the top 1/3 of the league. If the argument is that you need to spend a premium pick to find a top 10 QB, then thats absurd. Guys like Flacco, Wilson, Brady, Roethlisberger, Brees, Rodgers were not top 10 draft picks.

I do not think you have to use a top 10 pick to get an elite QB or top QB.

It is just easier to get the guy you want the higher you draft. If you love a QB and want to take him in the 2nd round there is inherently more risk in waiting for him to fall.

Personally, I think it is a big risk to wait and hope "your guy" falls to you or that you can work a trade up.



I think development and system is even more important than who you draft. I do not think there is a ton of difference physically between Carr and Bortles physically, but one of them has gone to a really well coached team, with a solid OL and a system that fits what he can do and the other has gone to a terrible organization and a coaching staff that should be fired.

The Browns could have drafted Wentz and he would probably suck or be injured.