What should be done about Coby White?

BNB

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I've obviously been pretty vocal about how the Bulls should have gotten rid of Zach LaVine when they had a chance, and when his stock was at its highest (3 years ago). While LaVine put up nice numbers, it was pretty apparent that he was just not a guy to build a franchise around, and with the contract that he was on coupled with his age, we could have gotten some really good picks/young players with potential.

I'm almost feeling that way with Coby White right now. He's got 2 years left on a cheap deal, and his stock may be as high right now as it's ever going to get.

Is it smarter to try to get as much as we can for him and start a complete rebuild, or do we hang onto him and have him be a crucial part of the rebuild?
 

knoxville7

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use for trade to help start an actual re build. but thats not going to happen with this front office

coby is what he is...6th man that can come in and score in bunches. hes still not a very good defender, other teams constantly attack him still. hes gotten better at on ball defense, but his off ball is terrible.

if bulls could get an unprotected 1st + filler, id be all for pulling the trigger
 

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On the one hand, there is not a single player on this roster worth building anything around. On the other hand, this FO isn't going to do a 180 and decide to plunge the team into Washington Wizards/Detroit Pistons territory of suck. FO will try to sell the public on Coby ascending to an all star and "retooling" around him and probably Ayo if they do manage to sell off the others
 

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On the one hand, there is not a single player on this roster worth building anything around. On the other hand, this FO isn't going to do a 180 and decide to plunge the team into Washington Wizards/Detroit Pistons territory of suck. FO will try to sell the public on Coby ascending to an all star and "retooling" around him and probably Ayo if they do manage to sell off the others
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Oh to answer the original question, of course the smart thing to do is trade him for all you can get. Really the smartest thing to do is obliterate this roster and sell everyone for expirings and whatever draft capital you can muster. Maybe you can keep the two way players and just play them for a couple years to ensure you keep that 1st which is owed to the Spurs. The team will be virtually unfollowable for about 5 years while they rebuild, but perhaps after that there would be hope in something that actually makes the playoffs.

This FO is committed to never rebuilding though (probably also a mandate from Jerry so butts stay in seats) so the real question is, how does one retool this team into something that has an actual shot at the playoffs?
 

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Nobody wants to play here.

Ownership is cheap and slow.
Fans are among the most toxic and impatient on the planet (prove me wrong).
The Jordan museum will keep selling tickets for another 20 years.

So what do you do with your best young player? At this point he does whatever he wants. Which is; a) leave, b) get overpaid, or c) wind up in a trade where the Bulls get less in return. And of course, d) Career altering injury. There are no other options. So WGAF.
 

knoxville7

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Nobody wants to play here.

Ownership is cheap and slow.
Fans are among the most toxic and impatient on the planet (prove me wrong).
The Jordan museum will keep selling tickets for another 20 years.

So what do you do with your best young player? At this point he does whatever he wants. Which is; a) leave, b) get overpaid, or c) wind up in a trade where the Bulls get less in return. And of course, d) Career altering injury. There are no other options. So WGAF.
they do show up and buy a ton of tickets still. doesnt come off as the most impatient on the planet. also, you forgotten knicks fans for the last 35 years??
 

Crystallas

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'among'
 

clonetrooper264

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As I understand it, the most toxic fanbases are NY, Philly, and Chicago
 

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Nobody wants to play here.

Ownership is cheap and slow.
Fans are among the most toxic and impatient on the planet (prove me wrong).
The Jordan museum will keep selling tickets for another 20 years.

So what do you do with your best young player? At this point he does whatever he wants. Which is; a) leave, b) get overpaid, or c) wind up in a trade where the Bulls get less in return. And of course, d) Career altering injury. There are no other options. So WGAF.

That's hard to prove objectively, but if you Google it, Bulls fans aren't really seen as toxic by other fans.

Below is a question on Reddit from 9 months ago asking which fanbase is most toxic. Lakers, Boston, Philly, and NY were mentioned A LOT. Some Golden State and Utah (surprisingly) were sprinkled in there... But not a single person mentioned the Bulls.

https://www.reddit.com/r/Basketball/comments/15gd3e0
This was asked on the Pacers sub reddit (a rival), and the Bulls were only mentioned once

https://www.reddit.com/r/pacers/comments/w46l8w

I know it's a smaller pool of people, but this random sample of outside fans don't seem to view the Bulls fanbase as toxic, at least compared to other very toxic fanbases.

I'd argue that we're not toxic or impatient enough. Maybe if we were, the Bulls would actually try making bigger moves to win games instead of doing well enough to continue filling seats.
 

knoxville7

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guess it comes down to whatever criteria crystallass uses for determining this. toxic and impatient is somewhat subjective.

as clone mentioned philly and NY. i think you could add LA lakers, boston, indiana, and miami to the toxic fans list

so sure, chicago may be AMONG them, but the list is roughly 7 teams long just for toxic fanbases...almost a quarter of the league
 
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Crystallas

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TRIGGER WARNING

*Read at your own risk



Rookies that aren't stars in their first few seasons are labeled busts.
90% of the area bandwagons or just bickers about being the armchair GM.
When players sign here out of their own free agency, they get chased out of town more than 90% of the time if the team they play for doesn't win a title.
A title is a 0.3% chance every year for every team in the NBA, and that title is the metric that is considered a success for most fans, because they are mostly bandwagoners. Any positive discussion is considered homerism, waaay more than a healthy near-50% pessimism. If you're the GM that builds the dynasty, your widow gets booed on tribute night.

0.3% chance, so one title per 30 years are the most absolute baseline of odds. The odds increase and decrease based on the available perameters, and fanbases are most certainly one, a VERY BIG ONE.

toxic and impatient

Everyone sees the constraints from the owners group(yes group, JR is the figurehead and a minority share), yet, they huff and puff all day about the GM with very little sympathies to the constraints. The scale is either construct a miracle on one side or fire their ass on the other, polarized to an extreme. Here's the funny thing (yes you will need to put all these details into memory to calculate a solid opinion, not omit and cherry pick details, if you're capable of such, ignore this PA comment), the Knicks are thrown out here, yep, toxic fans. But the Knicks have had some of the highest payrolls. The Knicks fans are worse than the Bulls fanbase, for sure. Let's use history to see where toxicity and impatience leads a fanbase. And they're going to drive Thibs out of that city too, the last coach that actually did shit here, is doing it in New York. makes you wonder if anyone else could(that actually wanted to, we're not talking about video game forced trades here). Hmmm... do we learn, do we learn? I mean, if the fans can't learn, why the fuck would the rest of the team?

A fanbase MAKES a team. Names I saw tossed out. Utah and Indana fanbases are hyper supportive, toxic to other fans maybe, but not toxic fanbases to their own. They do not canibalize the way Knick and Bulls fans canibalize on their own. I think Indiana and Utah have done more with lesser caps than the Bulls. Those teams can't afford to have toxic fanbases.


Bulls fans as a whole need to rationalize better before thrashing the team that *they choose to support*.
How long on average, does it take for a new GM to win a title?
How long on average does it take for a new GM to get past the first round of the playoffs?
How long on average does it take for a new lottery pick to make it to an accolade status(All-NBA/All-Star/All-D)?
It's almost like we know how long it takes for these things to happen, yet let's reset every few seasons, great idea. Go against the grain a bit.

So how many teams that have done a rapid reset system, have won a title, and how long did that take? Not examples of it happening, how often when teams choose to rapid-reset does it wind up in an odds besting success rate? It's like playing poker and throwing back 5 cards on every deal and bitching about the kitty.


And when good Free Agents sign here(their choice), especially when they have favorable contracts, stop turning them into your blow-up-the-team leverage trade chips. It sends out a bad message. Very unsportsmanlike, Knick-fan-ish.
 

knoxville7

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Let me guess. you're a natural contrarian?
you must think @BNB is too then??

sorry that some here disagreed with your take and BNB even gave some evidence of it. but hey, its easier to just label others i guess!
 

Enasic

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Bulls can’t let young talent like Coby go. He’s one of the only guys on the roster I’d actually keep. Bulls need to trade Zach and Vuc and ideally S&T DeMar. Tear this shit down starting from AKME on down. BD should have been canned over a year ago
 

Crystallas

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you must think @BNB is too then??

sorry that some here disagreed with your take and BNB even gave some evidence of it. but hey, its easier to just label others i guess!

Nice dodge.
BNB and I are good. We can disagree like civil human beings. Or even attempt to change each others minds.
 

knoxville7

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Nice dodge.
BNB and I are good. We can disagree like civil human beings. Or even attempt to change each others minds.
there was no dodge

interesting that you think i am disagreeing with you in an uncivil manner. think this speaks to you a lot more than it does me 🤷‍♂️
 

Probie2429

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I don’t even think I watched a single Bulls game this year. This is what Reinsdorf has done to many of the fans. We simply don’t care anymore. As far as Coby, they will sign him to an extension because that’s the wrong thing to do.
 

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