What Would You Think is a Fair Trade for Chris Sale?

[brett05]

Rather trade for Jose Quintana. Would cost less and he fits in as a 2nd LH pitcher on the staff.

He'd definitely cost less. Probably one ML guy, one top 25 and one to two top 100 specs.

 

[brett05]

Teams are not going to over pay for Sale with Price on the market in the offseason. Price will cost a 1st round pick and with the way the Cubs are playing that is a late 20's pick. Not a big deal to be honest.

Reality is they are not going to give up any player that is not replaceable.

Add to it you undervalue Alcantara. SH that has 20 HR power. Can be moved around like Zorbrist. Is running 8-10% BB with good speed. Plays strong D at 2B. This is a guy that you could develop as a lead off type.

The main point is they would be able to fill roles on the team at cheap cost. Then they can use that savings towards the rotation.

This isn't whether AA can play. It's if he fills a need for the White Sox. With what the Sox have right now he does not. They got guys like Micah Johnson , Carlos Sanchez, Tim Anderson, etc. Even if you say AA is better, the marginal better is worthless to the White Sox. That's the point. Zero need for him on the White Sox.

 

[CSF77]

This isn't whether AA can play. It's if he fills a need for the White Sox. With what the Sox have right now he does not. They got guys like Micah Johnson , Carlos Sanchez, Tim Anderson, etc. Even if you say AA is better, the marginal better is worthless to the White Sox. That's the point. Zero need for him on the White Sox.

fair enuf.

He'd definitely cost less. Probably one ML guy, one top 25 and one to two top 100 specs.

I would give Almora and Vogelbach for him. Toss in Olt. (Olt is the guy who has low value right now).

 

[brett05]

It depends.......

I would have no problem parting with Almora, Vogelbach, Baez or Castro, and CJ Edwards for Sale, Spencer Adams and Jace Fry.

But if Kenny were going to entertain talks, how does he not ask for Schwarber off the bat (pun intended), and plug him in day 1 at DH or in the OF, or let him play Catcher. Kenny doesn't like to baby guys, Theo does.

Sale would cost one of Russell, Schwarber, or Bryant. Bryant's off the table. I know everybody on the South Side is DYING to get rid of Alexei Ramirez.

For some stupid reason when Waddle & Silvy go to break, if Im too bored to listen to commercials driving home I turn on Boers and Bernstein, who are just assholes. After being assholes (deservedly so) to dipshit callers, they rag Ramirez for being god awful.

It would depend who Kenny likes. Kenny doesn't like a certain kind of ball player the way Theo does. Theo's guys walk. Kenny's guys hit. Kenny may love Starlin Castro because his offensive game is simple. See the ball, hit the ball. Kenny likes his players like that. He may love Baez.

Hard to see him not demanding Schwarber. Kenny has the upper hand. Sale is under contract until 2019, is it?

So my final offer: Schwarber, Vogelbach, CJ Edwards, Almora and Baez for Sale, Adams, and a PTBN later--who I'd ask for Fullmer or Zack Erwin (2nd round pick after Fullmer) this winter/upcoming spring or whenever he's able to be dealt.

And then Theo can go back to bulk drafting hitting. Cubs get a true TOR ace and future TOR potential arms, albeit 18 and 20, Sox get a AED jumpstart on their currently dead future and their laughable offense.

I'd highly doubt they'd move either Fullmer or Erwin. Also not sure how long you can wait on a PTBNL.
Not a bad offer though. Still missing a ML proven young piece in my eyes that I think Hahn would want.

 

[TC in Mississippi]

He'd definitely cost less. Probably one ML guy, one top 25 and one to two top 100 specs.

that's probably right but as barren as the Sox farm is that probably doesn't help. Sale restocks the pipeline immediately with near ready guys. To me if they don't trade Sale they should trade no one and keep trying free agents because in two years that pitching staff of Sale, Rodon, Quintana, Fulmer and whoever will be almost unstoppable. The issue would be whether they could hit or play defense.

 

[TC in Mississippi]

I'd highly doubt they'd move either Fullmer or Erwin. Also not sure how long you can wait on a PTBNL.
Not a bad offer though. Still missing a ML proven young piece in my eyes that I think Hahn would want.

As of a couple months age you can't use just drafted guys as a PTBNL. Instead those guys are available to be traded immediately after the World Series so Fullmer wouldn't be an option until then.

 

[CSF77]

I disagree with you on Price over Sale. I read the other day that Sale would get the largest haul in trade that a pitcher has ever gone for and I believe that. You're talking a cost controlled 26 year old who on a given day is the best lefty in the game. Price will sign for 7 year and roughly $220 million at 30 years old. Sale would rebuild the Sox farm in one fell swoop. I'm not sure if I'm the Cubs I trade for him, if he were available, but I sure would take a look.

That is why I wouldn't go after Sale. I would not trade Russell, Bryant or Schwarber. Those 3 are the back bone of your future. I would toss Soler out there but they could move Bryant to RF and use Olt or Baez at 3B as back fill.

So no-no's:
Bryant/Schwarber/Russell

Rather not:
Soler/Baez

Prime to trade:
Alcantara/Almora/Vogelbach

Reality teams looking to deal with the Cubs will come looking for hitting. If they are looking for mostly pitching there are far better teams to trade with.

 

[brett05]

fair enuf.




I would give Almora and Vogelbach for him. Toss in Olt. (Olt is the guy who has low value right now).

No thanks

 

[TC in Mississippi]

No thanks

Yeah that's kind of silly. There are a lot fo teams who would like Sale and have the goods to get him. I'd say The Dodgers, Astros, Red Sox (even in a bad year), Braves and possibly the Rangers could all incur the prospect costs. That's a lot of talent to choose from if Rick Hahn goes that route.

 

[brett05]

Yeah that's kind of silly. There are a lot fo teams who would like Sale and have the goods to get him. I'd say The Dodgers, Astros, Red Sox (even in a bad year), Braves and possibly the Rangers could all incur the prospect costs. That's a lot of talent to choose from if Rick Hahn goes that route.

I think CSF77 was meaning for Quintana

 

[TC in Mississippi]

I think CSF77 was meaning for Quintana

Ah gotcha.

 

[CSF77]

Ya for Quintana, He is a good #3 right now. I would rank him lower than Arrieta and Hammel in the rotation but above Hendricks. So a good #4 pitcher. I would not pay that much for him. I believe he could be better in the NL. I would not rank him as a TOR though.

Sox will have Sale and Rondon going forward and need to build up some strong RH starters around them.

I really do not see a match with the teams going on.

So I would not give up more than some fringe players that will be on the outside looking in for playing time. Cubs are stacked pretty deep right now in hitters.

 

[CSF77]

Mlbtr

the astros remain interested in jeff samardzija, and as rosenthal notes, a move away from what has been a brutal white sox defense would likely help samardzija quite a bit. Samardzija’s .338 babip has helped contribute to a significant discrepancy between his 4.53 era and 3.67 fip. Of course, chicago’s porous defense doesn’t necessarily explain samardzija’s diminished strikeout rate and struggles to strand runners in 2015. The astros, rosenthal says, are eyeing samardzija and other pitchers, but the white sox are not yet ready to sell.

 

[CSF77]

I believe Shark's lower SO rate is due to him using his cutter more vs his split. Cutters tend to put the ball in play and the Sox D works against it. Depending on the SO tends to push up pitch counts early on. Better to have that split just for the times when you need that SO vs being co-dependent on it.

Still this tells me what the Sox prime need is: IF D. 4.53 ERA and a 3.67 FIP screams poor D metrics behind the starters. Sox need to address this first.

 

[WindyCity]

My guess is Bryant, Rizzo, Russell and Schwarber are untouchable. I think that they are exactly what Theo and Jed want, they are super young, productive and healthy.

Chris Sale would be awesome, but the package would have to center around

Soler
Baez
Castro


I was listening to ESPN 1000 from Wednesday and I believe that Jesse Rodgers was saying that the listed guys are not going to be traded for anything and they would not even be in the conversation. This is why they did not see a Sale deal happening.

 

[SilenceS]

My guess is Bryant, Rizzo, Russell and Schwarber are untouchable. I think that they are exactly what Theo and Jed want, they are super young, productive and healthy.

Chris Sale would be awesome, but the package would have to center around

Soler
Baez
Castro


I was listening to ESPN 1000 from Wednesday and I believe that Jesse Rodgers was saying that the listed guys are not going to be traded for anything and they would not even be in the conversation. This is why they did not see a Sale deal happening.

Bryant and Rizzo may be untouchable but no one else is. If the Cubs made Schwarber and Russell untouchable then they are dumb.

 

[TC in Mississippi]

Bryant and Rizzo may be untouchable but no one else is. If the Cubs made Schwarber and Russell untouchable then they are dumb.

I think Schwarber is untouchable, some say they value him more than Bryant, I'm not sure that Russell is for the right deal, but I could be wrong

 

[SilenceS]

I think Schwarber is untouchable, some say they value him more than Bryant, I'm not sure that Russell is for the right deal, but I could be wrong

Unless Schwarber stays at Catcher, he is not more valuable than Bryant. His bat isn't as good. Don't take that as a knock. I think Bryant could be the next Miguel Cabrera. He has impressed the hell out of me. He has ice water in his veins and doesn't rattle at a very early age. That once in a generation type of special.

 

[brett05]

Ya for Quintana, He is a good #3 right now. I would rank him lower than Arrieta and Hammel in the rotation but above Hendricks. So a good #4 pitcher. I would not pay that much for him. I believe he could be better in the NL. I would not rank him as a TOR though.

Sox will have Sale and Rondon going forward and need to build up some strong RH starters around them.

I really do not see a match with the teams going on.

So I would not give up more than some fringe players that will be on the outside looking in for playing time. Cubs are stacked pretty deep right now in hitters.

And with Q being a TOR you are right there is probably not a match if Theo would only part with fringe quys for Q

 

[brett05]

Thanks everyone. Tried this talk elsewhere on the web and it was either dead, or unrealistic. I think everyone was great on input!