2nd Line Center...

[KBIB]

A lot of people are projecting him as another RW...

Like who? HawkWriter? The same moron who proclaimed beer leaguers to have a better understanding of an umbrella powerplay then the Hawks? Just stop right there. TT has been playing against men right now as a center and has drawn all of the important responsibilities, offensively and defensively for the Joke. He is the first forward over the boards for the PK and has developed his defensive game to the point that right now he might be on par with Kruger in his own zone with the exception Kruger is fantastic on the dot. This is a kid who put almost 20 pounds onto his core during the off season and chose to go back over seas to work on every aspect of his game instead of taking a gifted spot on a Cup winning team. I don't care what nimrods are predicting for the kid, I care what Bowman predicts, which has been as a center.

I am talking about having a complete 2nd line center... I know they have certain qualities and I admire Shaws style completely... I am not complaining about any of them... I am saying we need a 2nd line center... There is a reason we pull him off the ice if the play doesn't develop... that is all I am saying... and its not a good thing

What hasn't Shaw done? I don't get this considering he has taken to the perfectly.

Dude... I am a huge Patrick Kane fan... I like Handzus also... But like you said man if the guy still had some wheels... Even he admitted last year during the playoffs that what he lacked in speed against the younger guys he made up for in technique and experience...

Which the end result was......a Cup?(scratches head)

So its impossible to trade multiple picks and perhaps a player to move up in the draft?

To get a top five pick? You have to put yourself into the shoes of the other team and think why would they gift the Hawks a sure fire first line prospect for filler such as Bickell and late first round choices, which would have to be multiple first round choices. No team in their right mind would fathom such a preposterous notion when the goal of the draft is to make a weak team better in the talent department. Why would any team suddenly take a over paid left wing who has been a healthy scratch the last couple games making four million a year over taking a better projected prospect who will be cheaper? To get a couple draft picks that will be in the bottom 25? Come on.

Another point is that you cant get a guy like shane Doan because you have a salary cap... but if you sign a rookie his max salary if signed for 3 years is $925,000... Doan and other Centers worthy of the 2nd line make multi millions over multiple years
...

Are you willing to trade Saad and Leddy and a couple lower first rounders? Because no offense, that's what the price tag would be to get a top five pick. So, you finally filled the second line center spot in a couple years after the prospect develops, when even then, TT is surely already slotted into that position, so you pretty much lose Saad for the german Gretzky. Now, you have a huge hole on defense because Leddy is gone, and while I haven't been the biggest Leddy fan, the kid has grown leaps and bounds beyond my expectations, and that sudden positive influx of prospects who have a decent shot at making the NHL are gone for a couple years because you just traded away a couple first rounders. All with age catching up to players like Hossa and Sharp and pretty much killed this teams depth when depth is the main reason the odds are stacked in their favor to repeating this year.

This team has their skill players and were thrown a bone when TT fell in the draft. Learn to love them players because that is the core for the next four years.

And btw, fuck Shane Doan.


13-3!!!

 

[HawkWriter]

Like who? HawkWriter? The same moron who proclaimed beer leaguers to have a better understanding of an umbrella powerplay then the Hawks? Just stop right there.\

I actually said he would be a LW if he isn't a C...common now. Also, the second part is a bit off...I proclaimed that even players at that level know how to run an umbrella powerplay (certainly don't have a better understanding) and that I didn't put the PP woes on Kompon. I do appreciate the shout out though! Much love!

 

[Snorch]

Pirri or Bickell coupled with a draft pick or 2?

I don't see how you could think we don't have a broken 2nd line... we don't have a steady 2nd line guy and haven't in forever... the 2nd best center plays wing on the first line, Patrick Sharp...

If you are saying we stick with what we have and develop more talent in the minors I question your reasoning...

Yes we have Teuvo... but what about Pirri or Bickell coupled with a few 1st round picks... we have an abundance of wingers and we don't have any 2nd line NHL centers... We actually have trouble bringing up NHL ready guys because we have so many wings in the minor leagues...

The last thing we need is another 3rd line center or a developmental prospect... We have continue to improve our team... right now that means getting a sure thing second line center with 1st line talent...

winning face offs and controlling the puck would help the defense because the other team can't shoot the puck if we are controlling it...

I like Perri and I like Bickell.. but we have too many wings who can play in the NHL and not enough Centers... trade the picks with a player and get Draisaitl

I would be unreal if a team took Bickell's contract and gave us a top ten pick

 

[DMelt36]

I would be unreal if a team took Bickell's contract and gave us a top ten pick

Haha ain't it?

Bickell had a great postseason at the best time for his bank account.

 

[Raskolnikov]

I would be unreal if a team took Bickell's contract and gave us a top ten pick

Bickell gives us a physical element we need. Lets have one more look at him in the playoffs when things get extra physical. He was a top 5 performer in the playoffs last year, and it could be this element of his game is not suited for grinding through a long season.

 

[DMelt36]

Bickell gives us a physical element we need. Lets have one more look at him in the playoffs when things get extra physical. He was a top 5 performer in the playoffs last year, and it could be this element of his game is not suited for grinding through a long season.

He's starting to feel like Dustin Byfuglien 2.0.

I also don't think his knee is completely healthy from last year's offseason. Just doesn't look like the same player. Olympic break will serve him well, I think.

 

[KBIB]

I actually said he would be a LW if he isn't a C...common now.

You said;

There is a realistic chance that TT doesn't project to a center in the NHL and rather a wing.

Without the common knowledge he is already playing against men. If this projection you believe, and lord knows the whole finger puppet with the flashlight in the dark while listening to Eddie O on endless loop is something to be admired, to be true, they would have switched him up already instead of, you know, watch the kid play on another level while assuming he isn't big enough to play center. You do know he is the first line center for Jokerit, correct? And that he faces to other teams top checkers, correct? And that, as a center, he is leading the team in scoring while playing almost ten games less? So honestly, put your head back into the sand until Eddie O gives you more verbiage you can pass off here like some well of knowledge nobody really takes seriously.

Also, the second part is a bit off...I proclaimed that even players at that level know how to run an umbrella powerplay (certainly don't have a better understanding) and that I didn't put the PP woes on Kompon.

Yes. Which is why you played the lurking clod for how long? Its ok, you are here now and honestly, I cannot wait until you put your foot squarely back into your mouth yet again.

I do appreciate the shout out though! Much love!

Sure. I do love just how affectionate you are to being called a moron. It shows character......moron.



13-3!!!

 

[Raskolnikov]

You guys inspired me to look up Tuevo highlights…..and you can really tell he is the real deal. Its not what he is doing agains the competition, but HOW!! holy fuck balls. That is the kind of phenom that could for sure play in the league at 19. Very rangy and strong, with a bit of Kane in his moves.

Same height as Kane listed….5'11", but he looks longer than that, have a feeling he had a late growth spurt and he will eventually be listed for blackhawks around 6'2". I am disappointed he was listed as 5'11" 165 lbs actually, looked it up to finish this and his competition must be children because he looked big.

I don't know, but between Smith, Pirri, Morin and how young the rest of our solidified talent is other than Keith/Hossa/Versteeg/Handzus we must average the lowest age to minutes played in the league. I have never seen a chart like that correlated. Some teams are young but have an old starting rotation…..

the hawks play lots of youth lots of minutes.

 

[Diehardfan]

He's starting to feel like Dustin Byfuglien 2.0.

I also don't think his knee is completely healthy from last year's offseason. Just doesn't look like the same player. Olympic break will serve him well, I think.

Gees, I hope you're right but I just don't see it and clearly neither does Q....and I actually thought this guy could be another Secord. Ugh....brutal assessment by yours truly.

 

[DMelt36]

Gees, I hope you're right but I just don't see it and clearly neither does Q....and I actually thought this guy could be another Secord. Ugh....brutal assessment by yours truly.

I'm in no rush to close the book on Bickell because he's about 1/8th of the way thru the deal he signed last summer. Long way to go. But to think he was going to magically morph into in-his-prime Eric Lindros just because he signed a new contract is a foolish expectation. He was awesome in the last postseason ... but he was also playing with Toews and Kane for the majority of it. There are a lot of players that would look great alongside those two.

 

[Chris Sojka]

Like who? HawkWriter? The same moron who proclaimed beer leaguers to have a better understanding of an umbrella powerplay then the Hawks? Just stop right there. TT has been playing against men right now as a center and has drawn all of the important responsibilities, offensively and defensively for the Joke. He is the first forward over the boards for the PK and has developed his defensive game to the point that right now he might be on par with Kruger in his own zone with the exception Kruger is fantastic on the dot. This is a kid who put almost 20 pounds onto his core during the off season and chose to go back over seas to work on every aspect of his game instead of taking a gifted spot on a Cup winning team. I don't care what nimrods are predicting for the kid, I care what Bowman predicts, which has been as a center.

What hasn't Shaw done? I don't get this considering he has taken to the perfectly.

Which the end result was......a Cup?(scratches head)


To get a top five pick? You have to put yourself into the shoes of the other team and think why would they gift the Hawks a sure fire first line prospect for filler such as Bickell and late first round choices, which would have to be multiple first round choices. No team in their right mind would fathom such a preposterous notion when the goal of the draft is to make a weak team better in the talent department. Why would any team suddenly take a over paid left wing who has been a healthy scratch the last couple games making four million a year over taking a better projected prospect who will be cheaper? To get a couple draft picks that will be in the bottom 25? Come on.



Are you willing to trade Saad and Leddy and a couple lower first rounders? Because no offense, that's what the price tag would be to get a top five pick. So, you finally filled the second line center spot in a couple years after the prospect develops, when even then, TT is surely already slotted into that position, so you pretty much lose Saad for the german Gretzky. Now, you have a huge hole on defense because Leddy is gone, and while I haven't been the biggest Leddy fan, the kid has grown leaps and bounds beyond my expectations, and that sudden positive influx of prospects who have a decent shot at making the NHL are gone for a couple years because you just traded away a couple first rounders. All with age catching up to players like Hossa and Sharp and pretty much killed this teams depth when depth is the main reason the odds are stacked in their favor to repeating this year.

This team has their skill players and were thrown a bone when TT fell in the draft. Learn to love them players because that is the core for the next four years.

And btw, fuck Shane Doan.


13-3!!!

I don't reference other posters, I read articles from different draft sites and nhl related sites...

I saw a few months ago that TT was struggling and that he has recently picked his game up and brought it to a really high level... and that if he would have played like this all year long he would be far and away the leading point scorer in his league...

Smith, Pirri, Morin, Bickell are all young talented players with NHL potential...

You said that TT was a center and was dominating in the farm league.... So was Perri as a center for the Icehogs.... But he hasn't exactly made the smoothest adjustment to be a 2nd line center in the NHL....

I like all the guys we have Smith Perri Morin Bickell are all solid players but all of them seem to be wingers which we seem to have an awful lot of depth at...

If TT is going to be a stud 2nd line Center then hey... fuck it I am wrong and fuck the entire idea of trading anything... But if he is a wing then it just pushes another guy like Bickell Smith Perri or Morin down in the depth chart even further... Correct? So why not try to package 2 of them with a couple of 1st round picks and send them to another team for a 2nd line Center...

 

[DMelt36]

I don't reference other posters, I read articles from different draft sites and nhl related sites...

I saw a few months ago that TT was struggling and that he has recently picked his game up and brought it to a really high level... and that if he would have played like this all year long he would be far and away the leading point scorer in his league...

Smith, Pirri, Morin, Bickell are all young talented players with NHL potential...

You said that TT was a center and was dominating in the farm league.... So was Perri as a center for the Icehogs.... But he hasn't exactly made the smoothest adjustment to be a 2nd line center in the NHL....

I like all the guys we have Smith Perri Morin Bickell are all solid players but all of them seem to be wingers which we seem to have an awful lot of depth at...

If TT is going to be a stud 2nd line Center then hey... fuck it I am wrong and fuck the entire idea of trading anything... But if he is a wing then it just pushes another guy like Bickell Smith Perri or Morin down in the depth chart even further... Correct? So why not try to package 2 of them with a couple of 1st round picks and send them to another team for a 2nd line Center...

When/from where did you hear that TT was struggling? Never saw that anywhere.

Smith's peak is a 3rd line grinder. Bickell's ceiling isn't much higher. Pirri and Morin probably top out as 2nd line guys. Right now, TT's ceiling exceeds all of theirs.

The biggest issue with Pirri has been his defensive game. And considering that TT was used on the top PK unit for Finland at the World Juniors this winter, it's hard to imagine that his defensive game is worse than Pirri's.

It's too early to make the assumption that TT is nothing more than a winger and that you should ship him off as part of any package deal for another prospect that's equally as unpredictable.

I'm not saying TT is the definitive answer at 2C for the Hawks. But I sure as hell have seen enough to let him answer that question. And the best part? He's already in the organization.

 

[Diehardfan]

I don't reference other posters, I read articles from different draft sites and nhl related sites...

I saw a few months ago that TT was struggling and that he has recently picked his game up and brought it to a really high level... and that if he would have played like this all year long he would be far and away the leading point scorer in his league...

Smith, Pirri, Morin, Bickell are all young talented players with NHL potential...

You said that TT was a center and was dominating in the farm league.... So was Perri as a center for the Icehogs.... But he hasn't exactly made the smoothest adjustment to be a 2nd line center in the NHL....

I like all the guys we have Smith Perri Morin Bickell are all solid players but all of them seem to be wingers which we seem to have an awful lot of depth at...

If TT is going to be a stud 2nd line Center then hey... fuck it I am wrong and fuck the entire idea of trading anything... But if he is a wing then it just pushes another guy like Bickell Smith Perri or Morin down in the depth chart even further... Correct? So why not try to package 2 of them with a couple of 1st round picks and send them to another team for a 2nd line Center...

Wow...that better be one hell of a center. That's Jerry Angelo general managing.....fortunately, that's not how this regime does business. They like to draft and develop their own, sure they hit free agency a bit but for the most part only for players to temporarily fill a hole till one of their kids step in. Its real sound strategy providing you continually draft well, which they have.....you stay young as young players move in while older players go FA or get moved elsewhere for picks or salary cap relief. It also avoids your players all getting too old at once.....something that Angelo never got a grasp of.

 

[DMelt36]

Wow...that better be one hell of a center. That's Jerry Angelo general managing.....fortunately, that's not how this regime does business. They like to draft and develop their own, sure they hit free agency a bit but for the most part only for players to temporarily fill a hole till one of their kids step in. Its real sound strategy providing you continually draft well, which they have.....you stay young as young players move in while older players go FA or get moved elsewhere for picks or salary cap relief. It also avoids your players all getting too old at once.....something that Angelo never got a grasp of.

I don't think it's any shock that the Hawks are set up for long-term success with a core of players that's just about 100 percent homegrown talent. Guys like Toews, Kane, Saad, Bickell, Keith, Seabrook, Hjalmarsson, and Crawford are all players that the Hawks drafted. Other players were acquired long before they were household names and developed either in Chicago or Rockford: Sharp, Leddy, Versteeg.

The only big splash the Hawks have made in free agency in this era was Hossa. That's it. A huge splash, yes. But only having to add one player from the outside to complete the group tells you just how good this team has been at acquiring and developing young talent.

 

[Diehardfan]

I think Tallon was the one that cut that 12 year Hossa deal. Bowman and McDonough are far more conservative in free agency....pretty much sticking to 1 year deals to older players.

 

[KBIB]

I think Tallon was the one that cut that 12 year Hossa deal. Bowman and McDonough are far more conservative in free agency....pretty much sticking to 1 year deals to older players.

No. Hossa was all McD.

Tallon wanted to resign Havlat. When Havlat's agent went into bitch mode it was McD who influenced the Bowmans into going bigger instead of listening to Tallon. Dale right then, knew he was just a pawn next to Scotty, and Stan was the one who drew out the basis of a circumventing contract.

McD has made some stupid decisions, but choosing Hoss over a body of broken glass just might have been his stroke of brilliance.


13-3!!!

 

[DMelt36]

I think Tallon was the one that cut that 12 year Hossa deal. Bowman and McDonough are far more conservative in free agency....pretty much sticking to 1 year deals to older players.

Tallon was more instrumental in the Campbell deal, IIRC. And while I still loved that move, it did screw the Hawks salary cap, leading to the post-2010 Cup purge. I think Bowman and McD have learned from that situation and that's why you're saying less of a splash in FA.

I also don't think the Hawks have needed to add much in FA lately.

 

[EbonyRaptor]

When/from where did you hear that TT was struggling? Never saw that anywhere.

[/I]

TT was struggling through most of the first 2-3 months of the season, but so was the whole Jokerit team. TT started out playing 1st line center, then he was moved back to 2nd line center, then to 2nd line RW. Over those games, there were several posters from Finland on HF that would post reports about TT after watching the Jokerit games in person. The reports consistenly said that he was struggling. But they also reported that his linemates and the team in general were playing poorly. The discussions revolved around how much was TT struggling versus not having good players around him to play with.

Then right around the time of the WJC tourney, Jokerit fired their coach and acquired a couple (better) players. The team started playing better and when TT returned from the WJC, the new coach inserted TT back at 1st line center and played the best wingers with him. Whether it's the confidence he got from leading Finland to the Gold Medal, the new coach, the better wingers, or some combination of all of that, he has been playing at a higher level and in fact was named the sm-liiga player of the month for January.

Before the WJC tournament, TT had scored 3 goals and had 14 assists in 29 games. In the 9 games he has played since returning from the WJC, he has scored 2 goals and had 14 assists. So he had 17 points in the first 29 games and 16 points in the last 9 games.

A couple of the Finns posting on HF often post highlights of the game and so I've seen a lot of the points TT has gotten this season. It seems like the majority are on the power play. He often sets up on the right side half boards kinda like Kane likes to do and he is a very good passer. Makes quick and accurate passes and gets lots of primary assists on the PP. He is very shifty with elite level hands so the defenders often give him a little extra room so he doesn't dangle past them and that allows TT that little extra space to thread the needle on some beauty passes. It looks like he has a decent wrist shot - accuate and gets it off quickly, but he looks like a pass first guy.

Very exciting prospect.

 

[DMelt36]

TT was struggling through most of the first 2-3 months of the season, but so was the whole Jokerit team. TT started out playing 1st line center, then he was moved back to 2nd line center, then to 2nd line RW. Over those games, there were several posters from Finland on HF that would post reports about TT after watching the Jokerit games in person. The reports consistenly said that he was struggling. But they also reported that his linemates and the team in general were playing poorly. The discussions revolved around how much was TT struggling versus not having good players around him to play with.

Then right around the time of the WJC tourney, Jokerit fired their coach and acquired a couple (better) players. The team started playing better and when TT returned from the WJC, the new coach inserted TT back at 1st line center and played the best wingers with him. Whether it's the confidence he got from leading Finland to the Gold Medal, the new coach, the better wingers, or some combination of all of that, he has been playing at a higher level and in fact was named the sm-liiga player of the month for January.

Before the WJC tournament, TT had scored 3 goals and had 14 assists in 29 games. In the 9 games he has played since returning from the WJC, he has scored 2 goals and had 14 assists. So he had 17 points in the first 29 games and 16 points in the last 9 games.

A couple of the Finns posting on HF often post highlights of the game and so I've seen a lot of the points TT has gotten this season. It seems like the majority are on the power play. He often sets up on the right side half boards kinda like Kane likes to do and he is a very good passer. Makes quick and accurate passes and gets lots of primary assists on the PP. He is very shifty with elite level hands so the defenders often give him a little extra room so he doesn't dangle past them and that allows TT that little extra space to thread the needle on some beauty passes. It looks like he has a decent wrist shot - accuate and gets it off quickly, but he looks like a pass first guy.

Very exciting prospect.

:clap:

 

[EbonyRaptor]

TT with another 2 (primary) assists in Jokerit's 4-2 win over SaiPa today. One assist was at even strength and the other on the power play. His scoring streak is now 10 games with 2 goals and 16 assists over that span. His season totals of 35 points has him 11th in league scoring and his 30 assists put him one assist less than the league leader. In both overall scoring and assists, TT has played fewer games than the guys above him on the list, in some cases up to 10 fewer games.

The highlights from the game today haven't been posted yet, but here is the highlights from his last game (Tuesday) where he had the primary assist on a power play. Its right in the first 30-45 seconds of the highlights where he makes a nice pass to a guy right in front of the net for a tap in. TT is easy to spot because he wears the gold helmet for Jokerit which is a sm-liiga custom to have the leading scorer on each team where a gold helmet.

http://www.ruutu.fi/ohjelmat/sm-liiga/huippuhetket-jokerit-jyp-422014