[A] The Hot Seat: Joel Quenneville

[Pez68]

A lot of teams..not just the Bruins. Canucks and Wings would fair well against us (as of right now both would beat us in a 7 game series). Rangers would also. Blues probably could as could the Preds the way they play us. Im not going to sit here and wear Hawk blinders and say this is a great team because I cheer for them..i watch and look at a whole shit load of other teams every night. Its simply not a good team outside of its core. There is absolutley zero 3rd line on this club with Bolland centering no one. There is not good depth on the blueline and there has not been good goalkeeping. No team wins shit without a good 3rd line and better blueline depth and good goalkeeping. No team.



Dont fool yourself. Its not ALL coaching. Def a lot to do with coaching but that isnt the entire problem. 80% of the teams in the NHL have a decent to good core group. About 65% to 70% of the teams in the NHL have better and seasoned depth players than us up front and at the back. Right now about 80% of the teams have better goalkeeping.



Hawks are a 2 line team up front whos coach cant even solidify the 2nd line by using the proper center there. Our 4th line is alright and thats due to Meyers only. Qès biggest fault up front is trying to balance lines with inadequate depth players he has been given to do it with. Thats up front. On the back end I agree Q has no idea what the **** he is doing with defense anymore.



Agree though the quality shots the Hawks give up are too many (at even strength). Disagree that goalkeeping doesnt have a responsibility in dealing with some of those shots though..its their job to stop some difficult shots and to not allow the easy ones in. Ours are not doing the best job at that right now and have been inconsitent all season..good defense or not.



im going to go to stats here which i dont like doing but in this case are pretty telling (or could be) and this is just going to be PK related because there seems to be a lot of talk about PK system and PK defense. I find it an interesting discussion.



Guess where Cory Crawford is in save percentages on the PK in the league. 61st in the league..unecceptable even if one wants to bring up the defense excuse.



Guess how many shots Cory has faced on the PK...... 156. In actual fact looking around at the rest of the league that is actually a very low number of shots faced on the PK. So it sort of trumps everything people are saying about Crawford being hung out to dry on the PK by bad penalty killing. I dont know how many of those shots would be counted as quality ones but im taking a guess that out of 156 shots it aint that high of a percentage compared to the quality shots other goalies are facing on the PK.



156 shots Crawford has faced on the PK. Goals allowed...25 save percentage.....840



Lets compare that to some other goalies in the league who are deemed starters.



Quick has faced 254 PK shots 21. Goals allowed....21 save percentage .917



Craig Anderson has faced 278 shots on the PK. Goals allowed...32 save percentage .885



Cary Price has faced 206 shots...Goals allowed...18. Save percentage .908



Jonas Hiller has faced 202 shots..goals allowed...25. Save percentage .882



Rinne (this is a fun one seeing people thing the Preds are the best defensive team in the league). has faced 214 shots..goals allowed..28. Save percentage .869



Need I go on here.



fact...Crawford hasnt faced a crap load of shots on the PK as compared to his counterparts around the league. Fact..Crawford has allowed more goals on less PK shots than a crap load of his counterparts. Fact every team gives up quality chances and assuming that one team is giving up over 200 shots and one around the 150 mark I am willing to bet both are giving up just as many quality shots. Fact..good goalkeeoing on the PK is vital to any teams success. Fact..we aint getting it.



I dont think Crawford can be given escape rights at least when it comes to PK production and helping the team out there.

These stats are meaningless, as there is no way to account for QUALITY of shots. Vancouver might only get two shots on the PP, but one was a cross ice empty net tap-in because the Hawks PK sucks so bad. How is that on the goalie? Also, the Hawks goalies don't face a lot of shots on the PK, because the Hawks are one of the least penalized teams in the league. But when they do take a penalty, man do they suck at killing it off. I cannot fault the goalies at all, except in games like Edmonton where they give up terribly soft goals. The quality of shots given up by this Hawks team is astounding. They might only give up 25 shots in a game, but 15 of those are high quality scoring chances. They don't keep the opposition to the outside and force bad angle shots. It seems like EVERY shot the Hawks give up is point blank, right in the slot, or through a ridiculous amount of traffic. There's not a goalie in the NHL right now that would be in the top 10 in save percentage playing behind this team defense and PK. Period.

 

[Shantz My Pants]

I agree with the points made by both TCD and Pez.



To me, and I don't think there is a stat for this besides scoring chances which is like hits (based on perception), but the Hawks give up a ton of shots in the low slot and other high scoring opportunity areas. It's not tough to defend these because you just need to stay in position.

 

[Ton]

The Hawks actually allow closer to 30 shots a game. I kind of agree with Pez, but with that information it's clear Crawford is struggling on the PK, take that away and his numbers actually aren't so bad.

 

[the canadian dream]

Pez I mentioned in the post that quality of shots cant be taken into account as there are no stats to provide for that. However any betting man would bet that if one team is giving up 250 shots and the other 150 that the shot qualities are probably even if not in the favor of the team giving up more shots. Just would make logical sense based on averages. Can't prove it but chances are it's true.



As for the team not taking a lot of penalties. That's great. Really has nothing to do with this though. We are discussing goalie production on PK's that the Hawks do find themselves on.



And the Hawks are actually in the middle of the pack as far as PK time goes anyways. I believe 15th in the league. Not one of the least penalized team in the league actually. Middle of the pack can never be constituted as "least penalized". Not sure where you got that idea from.



Here's a good one for you. Nashville actually serves 2nd less time on the PK in the league yet also gives up the 2nd greatest amount of shots on the PK in the league. That's that team everyone says has amazing defense and doesn't allow a lot of shots. Rinne stands on his head on the PK and more often than not gives his team the chance to win games. Now obviously Craw is no Rinne to begin with. Can't tell me Rinne isn't facing just as many quality shots as Crawford overall.



Here is another funny one. LA serves the 2nd most PK time in the league (about 40 minutes more than the Hawks..thats huge) and also gives up the 2nd most PK shots in the league (that would make sense). Yet Quick has allowed less goals against than Crawford has on the PK? Can't tell me LA and Quick aren't facing the same amount if not more quality chances than Crawford. Won't buy it if you are to tell me that. You don't have to try anyways I watch a shit load of LA games and Quick is facing a lot of quality shots...more so than Crawford actually.



Pens - Serve less time on the PK than the Hawks. Have allowed more shots on the PK than the Hawks (thats bad defense). Fluery significant less goals against than Crawford.



Carolina- Serve less time on the PK than the Hawks (about 27 minutes less). Ward has seen a lot more shots than Crawford has on the PK (again thats bad PK defense). Ward and Crawford..both 25 goals against. Wards goals against should be much higher by law of averages. And there is noooo way you can tell me the Canes aren't giving up quality shots here.



Ducks - Most time spent on the PK in the league (silly 52 minutes more than the Hawks). Hiller has seen 50 more shots than Crawford (this would make sense though). Both goalies...25 goals against. Again the Ducks goals against should be much higher by law of averages and another team if you told me didn't give up quality shots...I would laugh. Ducks PK is not good..but PK goalkeeping actually has been (another team I watch a lot).



I could keep going on here. Because there are a whole lot of other goalies posting better PK numbers than Crawford despite spending more time on the PK and facing more shots or less time on the PK and facing more shots.



Everything is pointing out to me that Crawford has not been very good on the PK this season and probably has a lot to do with why the Hawks PK hasn't been the best at times. Compared to other teams around the league and their goalkeeping..Crawford isn't measuring up on the PK.



In Crawfs defense though he does keep good company with goalies whos PK production isn't very good. Loungo, Niemi, Bryzgalov. So he isn't the only shitty PK goalie in the league...phewwwww.

 

[Chief Walking Stick]

Why is O'donnell playing tonight instead of Scott?



FIRE Q!!

 

[BigPete]

Kitchen and/or Q must go. Dumbest D pairings I have ever seen, injuries be damned.

 

[CLWolf81]

Its not just the pairings, but the lines against the Sharks tonight were a bit odd, even for Q....



We need centers still apparently if Morrison and Kruger are both being slotted as wingers now.

 

[bookjones]

Good grief. It's kind of embarrassing when the Hawks being on a downward spiral is the subject of Adrian Dater's latest "Inside the NHL" story at SI. It doesn't paint a pretty picture and it was published on Friday afternoon when the streak was ONLY at a mere 6 games. Sighs.

Heat's on in Chicago



http://sportsillustr...?sct=nhl_t11_a1

 

[the canadian dream]

just for fun Crawford has fell from 61st in the league with worst pk save percentage to 64th in one game.



64th. a beautiful .833 save percentage on the PK. thats lovely.



Only "starters" with a worse save percentage on the PK are Varlamov, Halak and Mason. Halak has left the starting job in St Louis games ago. So if Crawford isnt part of the problem then the Hawks defense is as bad as the Caps and Columbus. On paper they certainly are not. Maybe they are in actual fact? Or is Crawford just garbage? Or a little of both?



But keep in mind here the Hawks are the 10th most penalized team in the league. are the 6th in the league in most time spent on the PK and are aren't giving up as many shots on the PK as people might think they are..pretty average in comparison to other teams and a lot less than many (Crawford is not being over worked by any stretch of the imagination). Quality shots excuse is moot in my mind because all teams give up quality shots on the PK...watch a few of other teams games to find out for yourselves.



So something doesn't add up here. Too me at least the PK issues isn't really the system (which isn't great dont get me wrong) and really not the defense (besides Leddy being horrible and misused). It's the goalkeeping.



**** it all though...i just dont care right now and just want something huge to happen. A coach firing or a major roster addition. Dont care if costs Stan one of his precious prospects. At some point an above average current roster player is more important than a stock pile of unproven prospects. Can't just wipe your hands of the now when you still have a good core than needs help. Coach firing first would be a great gift. If that ain't happening ill take the consolation prize.

 

[Pez68]

Watched Philly play Detroit last night and it's pathetic how poorly this team is coached in relation to Detroit. Detroit's success is almost entirely based upon their system. They've got an AHL goalie in net, and are still winning games. They are taught puck support, they always have a forward high in the offensive zone(none of this three guys below the goalline shit), and they always have a forward coming back to support the defense on the breakout. You don't see three forwards standing at the opposing blueline while the defense carries the puck up ice and has to dump it in. You see them coming up the ice as a TEAM. If there's nothing there, they circle the puck back and regroup again, and give it another go. As a TEAM. Their up-ice movement always involves three or more players moving together, making short, crisp passes. In the defensive zone, they are tight to their man, and keep everything to the outside. They allow very little from the pointmen. This team is a fucking joke when you watch teams like Detroit work like a well oiled machine, with an obvious system in place.

 

[LordKOTL]

Something to point out:



Brent Seabrook:

+11 23:06 Toi/G​

Duncan Keith:

+6 26:45​

Nick Hjalmarsson

+5 20:31​

Steve Montador

+4 14:57​

Sami Lepisto

+4 12:00​

John Scott

0 7:44​

Dylan Olsen

-3 14:52​

Sean O'donnel

-5 14:07​

Nick Leddy

-10 22:06​

Here's what I take from that:



Why isn't Lepisto playing over O'donnel?

Why does Q even bother icing Scott at all?

Why the hell is Nick Leddy getting all of those minutes?



Seriously, I know +/- isn't everything, but at this point it seems like our D could benefit a bit more from being balanced.

 

[Pez68]

I've been preaching this all season.



Why isn't Lepisto playing over O'donnel? The same reason Boynton and Cullimore and Walker played over guys that were obviously better than them. Q guys.



Why does Q even bother icing Scott at all? Good fucking question.



Why the hell is Nick Leddy getting all of those minutes? Because Q is an idiot, refuses to take him off the PK, and refuses to give Montador a legit shot in the top 4.

 

[LordKOTL]

I've been preaching this all season.



Why isn't Lepisto playing over O'donnel? The same reason Boynton and Cullimore and Walker played over guys that were obviously better than them. Q guys.



Why does Q even bother icing Scott at all? Good fucking question.



Why the hell is Nick Leddy getting all of those minutes? Because Q is an idiot, refuses to take him off the PK, and refuses to give Montador a legit shot in the top 4.

I agree...even though I've liked Scott's play this year...when he's been on the ice.



Right now I would ice the lines as:



Seabs/Keith

Montador/Hammer

Leddy/Lepisto



Scott fills in when we need some more D-presence against ******* teams. That, and make sure Leddy/Lepisto is only out there when a line is out that can play D fairly well.

 

[MassHavoc]

Can OD be waived, released, sent down, anything? I know it's probably bad for and all but at this point I don't have any use for him and I can't stand that they so easily sent down Oli and his 3.1 mil but can't quite let go of ODs 850k... maybe they just don't think it's so little that it's not even worth it, but at the same time why even play him.

 

[supraman]

I hope we lose the rest of this season, seriously not win a single game. That would ensure Q gets fucking canned. Seriously, I'd rather have this season be a waste than wasting our core's prime years with an incompetent coach.



Half the games whatever. Bottom line for me I just want this fucking coach and his one jackass assistant gone. Sick of their bullshit hockey.

 

[MassHavoc]

I don't hope that because one, it would really suck. 2.) it would really really suck and piss me off, and 3.) It still wouldn't ensure Q gets fired.

 

[Rex]

exactly. Losing every game does not guarantee that Q gets fired. And with McD running the team, Haviland wouldn't replace him, they would look to sign a big name coach, who doesn't really exist on the market right now.

 

[Pez68]

You don't think they'd fire the coach if the Hawks lost every game from here on out? With the talent this team has? ****, he might get canned if they lose 15 straight, let alone lose out for the season.

 

[Rex]

the blame will fall on Crawford and Emery as it has all season.

 

[supraman]

I don't hope that because one, it would really suck. 2.) it would really really suck and piss me off, and 3.) It still wouldn't ensure Q gets fired.

So we waste the season dicking with a goalie just so next year our new goalies blow ass too, then what? Also as soon as it starts really affecting ticket sales, you know someone's head will roll