Bulls in the mix for Monta Ellis

[clonetrooper264]

When it comes to just flat out scoring, we could do worse than Ellis. His defense might be questionable and all, but let's be honest, he can score. I think playing with Rose and Boozer (assuming he's not traded in the deal) and Deng would be a lot better than playing with Curry, Lee, and Wright in GS and thus he wouldn't really have to jack up 30 shots in a game. The one thing that does bother me are his turnover numbers. I had him on my fantasy team and his turnover numbers were ridiculous at times. However, perhaps playing with Rose would reduce that. As it is, if we can't get anyone else, I'd be totally fine with him. I'd still take several players over him, but we can't be too picky at this point.

 

[Glide2keva]

When it comes to just flat out scoring, we could do worse than Ellis. His defense might be questionable and all, but let's be honest, he can score. I think playing with Rose and Boozer (assuming he's not traded in the deal) and Deng would be a lot better than playing with Curry, Lee, and Wright in GS and thus he wouldn't really have to jack up 30 shots in a game. The one thing that does bother me are his turnover numbers. I had him on my fantasy team and his turnover numbers were ridiculous at times. However, perhaps playing with Rose would reduce that. As it is, if we can't get anyone else, I'd be totally fine with him. I'd still take several players over him, but we can't be too picky at this point.

I agree with what you're saying.

I'm just against the small back court thing. I'm not against Ellis himself, just what he brings isn't going to fill the hole that the Bulls have, aside from scoring.

If we got him and he didn't cost the team too much, I'd have no problem with it either.

 

[clonetrooper264]

I agree with what you're saying.

I'm just against the small back court thing. I'm not against Ellis himself, just what he brings isn't going to fill the hole that the Bulls have, aside from scoring.

If we got him and he didn't cost the team too much, I'd have no problem with it either.

Yeah small backcourts don't really work out unless the duo is something like Isaiah Thomas and Joe Dumars. Both can score and one is an elite level defender with the other being pretty good himself. If Rose could somehow magically become a Wade level defender and if Monta actually knows how to play defense (or gets taught by Thibs) then I think it would work pretty well. That said, if that isn't the case and Monta is the best attainable SG, we have to get him if we're in a position to without also giving up Deng/Noah.

 

[Glide2keva]

Yeah small backcourts don't really work out unless the duo is something like Isaiah Thomas and Joe Dumars. Both can score and one is an elite level defender with the other being pretty good himself. If Rose could somehow magically become a Wade level defender and if Monta actually knows how to play defense (or gets taught by Thibs) then I think it would work pretty well. That said, if that isn't the case and Monta is the best attainable SG, we have to get him if we're in a position to without also giving up Deng/Noah.

Definitely.

His scoring would help us out and he gets steals and is very good in transition. He also can take over a game and Rose would have no problem deferring to him if he gets in takeover mode.

It'll be a gamble, but they'd be the fastest and quickest back court in the NBA and a nightmare every night.

 

[clonetrooper264]

Definitely.

His scoring would help us out and he gets steals and is very good in transition. He also can take over a game and Rose would have no problem deferring to him if he gets in takeover mode.

It'll be a gamble, but they'd be the fastest and quickest back court in the NBA and a nightmare every night.

Yeah if it works out, it pretty much boils down to if Lu can step up and make a shot if Lebron and Wade succeed in shutting them down in the 4th. If Ellis is on a tear it might force Miami to put Lebron on him which opens up Rose (since I believe he can score on Wade pretty easily in comparison (well duh)) to make something happen. But obviously, it just might not work out that way. Maybe Ellis is just a straight chucker who would do nothing for us. I guess there's just no way to tell for sure how he'd do outside of that GS offense.

 

[Glide2keva]

Yeah if it works out, it pretty much boils down to if Lu can step up and make a shot if Lebron and Wade succeed in shutting them down in the 4th. If Ellis is on a tear it might force Miami to put Lebron on him which opens up Rose (since I believe he can score on Wade pretty easily in comparison (well duh)) to make something happen. But obviously, it just might not work out that way. Maybe Ellis is just a straight chucker who would do nothing for us. I guess there's just no way to tell for sure how he'd do outside of that GS offense.

Honestly, I think he can be a good system scorer. He wouldn't take as many bad shots as he has to in GS.

 

[BNB]

I posted this in another thread

"I don't want Ellis on the Bulls, period. So I obviously think giving up Noah and Deng is crazy.

Yes, Monta is a good scorer. But so are a lot of players in the league. Monta isn't any more special than any of them... and I don't know if I would even say Monta's scoring is "special" at all. His stats are kinda inflated due to the offense he plays in. He was able to get a bunch of shots off because of their fast pace... Also he has led the league in MPG the last 2 seasons. Last year, he regularly played the whole entire game. Obviously your scoring numbers are gonna look good.if any player played 48 minutes a game regularly, their PPG average would go up by a couple of points.

yeah, he's still a good scorer, but I wanna see how he does and how his numbers look after he plays a season while averaging only 36 MPG and plays in a half-court offense most of the time, etc. etc.

And the Bulls need a very good 3 point shooter playing SG. I would say Ellis is an average 3 point shooter. "

so I'm not high on Ellis.

 

[clonetrooper264]

I posted this in another thread

"I don't want Ellis on the Bulls, period. So I obviously think giving up Noah and Deng is crazy.

Yes, Monta is a good scorer. But so are a lot of players in the league. Monta isn't any more special than any of them... and I don't know if I would even say Monta's scoring is "special" at all. His stats are kinda inflated due to the offense he plays in. He was able to get a bunch of shots off because of their fast pace... Also he has led the league in MPG the last 2 seasons. Last year, he regularly played the whole entire game. Obviously your scoring numbers are gonna look good.if any player played 48 minutes a game regularly, their PPG average would go up by a couple of points.

yeah, he's still a good scorer, but I wanna see how he does and how his numbers look after he plays a season while averaging only 36 MPG and plays in a half-court offense most of the time, etc. etc.

And the Bulls need a very good 3 point shooter playing SG. I would say Ellis is an average 3 point shooter. "

so I'm not high on Ellis.

He's still better than Bogans/Korver/Brewer and we might still have Korver/Bogans for 3pt shooting. I have him below several other players as well, but I'm just saying that we could do worse and if the opportunity arises and there's no one better available, we have to pull the trigger (unless it involves Deng or Noah).

 

[houheffna]

Some of you want too much, you want a 20+ ppg scorer who can defend his position well....you know what they call those? All-stars! Ain't many of them at the SG position, if you can get a very good scorer...a guy that can carry a team offensively...you take him. Let Thibs work his magic on Ellis as he did in Boston with players like Ray Allen. Keep Bogans/Brewer if possible and you don't need Watson at all anymore, you have plenty of scoring and a lot of depth on the defensive end as needed at almost every position on the court. I think it will work out that way.

 

[clonetrooper264]

Some of you want too much, you want a 20+ ppg scorer who can defend his position well....you know what they call those? All-stars! Ain't many of them at the SG position, if you can get a very good scorer...a guy that can carry a team offensively...you take him. Let Thibs work his magic on Ellis as he did in Boston with players like Ray Allen. Keep Bogans/Brewer if possible and you don't need Watson at all anymore, you have plenty of scoring and a lot of depth on the defensive end as needed at almost every position on the court. I think it will work out that way.

Well obviously an All Star is what we all want. An All Star SG imo gets us past Miami. But I agree with you, if we get a scorer, we just have to let Thibs do his thing to whip him into shape defensively.

 

[BNB]

He's still better than Bogans/Korver/Brewer and we might still have Korver/Bogans for 3pt shooting. I have him below several other players as well, but I'm just saying that we could do worse and if the opportunity arises and there's no one better available, we have to pull the trigger (unless it involves Deng or Noah).

I would take Ellis over Korver, Brewer and Bogans in a heartbeat!

But I think some people overrate Ellis' ability because of his scoring numbers. There are stories behind those numbers... like I mentioned, a lot of minutes, fast pace offense, etc.

Another thing people say is that Ellis is an above average/ very good shooter.

That's not true. He CAN hit jump shots, but he's not great at them.

Last season, he shot 32% between 10-15 feet. That's terrible. That's not a fluke year either. He was 38% a year before that and 26% before that.

38% between 16-23 feet. That's not very good.

Would that improve if he played next to a guy like rose? Maybe... but I can't say he can with confidence.

also, another thing I don't like is that he was not able to win many games as the best player on a team. Great players find ways to win games even if the players around them aren't good enough. Ellis failed to do that... and that bothers me a little.

 

[clonetrooper264]

I would take Ellis over Korver, Brewer and Bogans in a heartbeat!

But I think some people overrate Ellis' ability because of his scoring numbers. There are stories behind those numbers... like I mentioned, a lot of minutes, fast pace offense, etc.

Another thing people say is that Ellis is an above average/ very good shooter.

That's not true. He CAN hit jump shots, but he's not great at them.

Last season, he shot 32% between 10-15 feet. That's terrible. That's not a fluke year either. He was 38% a year before that and 26% before that.

38% between 16-23 feet. That's not very good.

Would that improve if he played next to a guy like rose? Maybe... but I can't say he can with confidence.

also, another thing I don't like is that he was not able to win many games as the best player on a team. Great players find ways to win games even if the players around them aren't good enough. Ellis failed to do that... and that bothers me a little.

I see and pretty much agree with what you're saying, but really, we can't be that picky when it comes to this. If Ellis is the best SG we can get, we have to get him. If he doesn't work out, then I'm sure some other team might take the chance on him since he's young enough (after all, Philly wants to trade Iggy for him, maybe we could try to do the same xD).

 

[houheffna]

I see and pretty much agree with what you're saying, but really, we can't be that picky when it comes to this. If Ellis is the best SG we can get, we have to get him. If he doesn't work out, then I'm sure some other team might take the chance on him since he's young enough (after all, Philly wants to trade Iggy for him, maybe we could try to do the same xD).

Look at what Thibs did with Watson on the defensive end. Find me anywhere where there was a scouting report lauding Watson's defense last summer...anywhere. You won't find it. Watson only played 10 minutes a game but he is a better defender at the position than Rose is. I don't think that was the case when they first got Watson. Or maybe it was, and the system in GS didn't allow him to show that.

 

[clonetrooper264]

Look at what Thibs did with Watson on the defensive end. Find me anywhere where there was a scouting report lauding Watson's defense last summer...anywhere. You won't find it. Watson only played 10 minutes a game but he is a better defender at the position than Rose is. I don't think that was the case when they first got Watson. Or maybe it was, and the system in GS didn't allow him to show that.

Personally, I think it was the second case. I think Watson is just a fundamentally better defender than Rose (I think we all remember how bad Rose was his rookie year) and being in Thibs's system has shown that. Of course, I could be wrong, but who's to say that Thibs can't teach Ellis defense? As long as a player is committed, Thibs is going to make him a better defender in some way. Even if that players name is Carlos Boozer. xD

 

[BNB]

I see and pretty much agree with what you're saying, but really, we can't be that picky when it comes to this. If Ellis is the best SG we can get, we have to get him. If he doesn't work out, then I'm sure some other team might take the chance on him since he's young enough (after all, Philly wants to trade Iggy for him, maybe we could try to do the same xD).

If we got Ellis for like.. idk, Taj, Brewer and a first round pick.. then I wouldn't mind going for him. But that won't happen.

the Warriors would probably want Deng and Taj or Noah or Asik... IMO, that's too much.

We can still get a SG who can score for less than that.

we'll see though

 

[clonetrooper264]

If we got Ellis for like.. idk, Taj, Brewer and a first round pick.. then I wouldn't mind going for him. But that won't happen.

the Warriors would probably want Deng and Taj or Noah or Asik... IMO, that's too much.

We can still get a SG who can score for less than that.

we'll see though

Again, I agree. I wouldn't give up Deng or Noah in a deal for a SG if I could avoid it. Giving up Taj or Asik is feasible, as long as there is another serviceable PF/C that we could also get in some other way.

 

[Glide2keva]

Well obviously an All Star is what we all want. An All Star SG imo gets us past Miami. But I agree with you, if we get a scorer, we just have to let Thibs do his thing to whip him into shape defensively.

I don't necessarily want a 20PPG scorer and an elite defender at the 2. I just want a good scorer who can defend his position. That isn't too much to ask.

 

[clonetrooper264]

I don't necessarily want a 20PPG scorer and an elite defender at the 2. I just want a good scorer who can defend his position. That isn't too much to ask.

Well most people's ideal scenario is an All Star SG. More realistic is getting a decent defender who can score a bit (Courtney Lee, Aaron Afflalo, etc). I guess what we want is somewhere in the middle.

 

[Lex L.]

I think Ellis would work well in Chicago. We might actually have a tandem in Rose and Ellis thats faster than James and Wade, which would be nice.

 

[BNB]

Well most people's ideal scenario is an All Star SG. More realistic is getting a decent defender who can score a bit (Courtney Lee, Aaron Afflalo, etc). I guess what we want is somewhere in the middle.

Afflalo would be awesome. I would love him on the Bulls.

It just sucks that the Nuggets view him as "untouchable." I don't blame them.