Cubs make a trade!

[CSF77]

Neither.....sounds like another body he stumbled across in that dumpster.

What a cheap bastard he is....no wonder Ricketts loves him.

Here's my thinking with Naylor. Both aren't good defenders. Both are bat first guys. Naylor is a good hitter but for my money not the type of bat you want out of 1B. Like I'll give Naylor the benefit of the doubt and just go with his past 2 seasons. He's had a .189 ISO in those seasons. He was a 20 grade runner coming up as a prospect which means realistically you're counting on homers for his ISO because he's not stretching singles into doubles and doubles into triples. Naylor has more of a Mark Grace like profile at 1B which listen I loved Grace but when you have Nico and Dansby who are weighted heavier on defense for their value than hitting you need more pop in my opinion.

Busch on the other hand was a 45 grade runner last update which isn't a speed guy but not a liability either. Busch has also shown he's able to walk more and as I said above he's shown real game power. Wouldn't surprise me if he hits 25-30 homers next season. Now that's not ya know Pete Alonso at 1B but it's more in line with the stereotypical 1B bat.

Overall, I get it if people are looking for more proven players. But proven players cost more as well both in terms of money and in terms of prospects. But for me personally, Busch is as close as you can get to a sure thing as a hitting prospect. No one questions his bat it's always been his defense which who cares at 1B? And if you buy into his bat and he shows what you think he can, that's a very valuable player the cubs have with his years of control.

To me this isn't a rays move. It's more like a move Atlanta would make recently. And to me, that's kind of how I want the cubs run not in the model of LA/BOS/NY. Invest heavy in development. Make wise trades and lock up your own players early for cheap. Teams like tampa and cleveland have done well with less resources but Atlanta's model with a bit more money or the 2000's era cardinals is a consistent way of winning without getting yourself tied up in bad contracts.

 

[knoxville7]

Here's my thinking with Naylor. Both aren't good defenders. Both are bat first guys. Naylor is a good hitter but for my money not the type of bat you want out of 1B. Like I'll give Naylor the benefit of the doubt and just go with his past 2 seasons. He's had a .189 ISO in those seasons. He was a 20 grade runner coming up as a prospect which means realistically you're counting on homers for his ISO because he's not stretching singles into doubles and doubles into triples. Naylor has more of a Mark Grace like profile at 1B which listen I loved Grace but when you have Nico and Dansby who are weighted heavier on defense for their value than hitting you need more pop in my opinion.

Busch on the other hand was a 45 grade runner last update which isn't a speed guy but not a liability either. Busch has also shown he's able to walk more and as I said above he's shown real game power. Wouldn't surprise me if he hits 25-30 homers next season. Now that's not ya know Pete Alonso at 1B but it's more in line with the stereotypical 1B bat.

Overall, I get it if people are looking for more proven players. But proven players cost more as well both in terms of money and in terms of prospects. But for me personally, Busch is as close as you can get to a sure thing as a hitting prospect. No one questions his bat it's always been his defense which who cares at 1B? And if you buy into his bat and he shows what you think he can, that's a very valuable player the cubs have with his years of control.

To me this isn't a rays move. It's more like a move Atlanta would make recently. And to me, that's kind of how I want the cubs run not in the model of LA/BOS/NY. Invest heavy in development. Make wise trades and lock up your own players early for cheap. Teams like tampa and cleveland have done well with less resources but Atlanta's model with a bit more money or the 2000's era cardinals is a consistent way of winning without getting yourself tied up in bad contracts.

Naylor wouldn’t necessarily cost more because like you used as a negative against him earlier, he has less team control

 

[CSF77]

Chicago Cubs make SURPRISING TRADE with Dodgers!

On the hinges of a trade with the Dodgers for 1B/DH Michael Busch and RP Yency Almonte, the Cubs are poised for an active rest of the offseason. We discuss h...

www.youtube.com

 

[CSF77]

 

[CSF77]

Seems that most feel this is a solid trade for both teams.

The one out of the Dodgers it was a simple block and that the Dodgers have the prospect depth to acquire a SP like Bieber. Also the Dodgers make deals like this to get high upside players because they don't get good draft positions.

Cubs side pretty much everyone feels that Busch is on the opening day roster. 1B most likely.

The 2nd pod cast had a interesting take. They sign Chapman and Bellinger. PCA starts in AAA and Bellinger is the starting CF. When PCA is ready Bellinger moves to 1B and Busch moves to DH.

But the vibe is D will be king at 3B and no way in hell Morel starts there to wreck the IF D. Both sides also feel that Busch is a 1B as his D is not high ended enough to start at 3B at the major league level.

So this means that Mervis is out. Bye bye to that experiment.

 

[Castor76]

Granted this very much depends on coming down to re-signing Bellinger, but if that is done, the Cubs actually would have a fairly good offense this coming year. Despite all the PAs from Hosmer, Mancini, Barnett, and even Madrigal last season, the Cubs had the 6th best offense in terms of runs scored last year. They were 11th or better in BA, OBP, SLG, and OPS. Bellinger back on this team and the offense is in a much better spot than it was last year.

I'd say trade does probably mean Mervis is gone and Wisdom is beyond expendable as I'd much rather see Canario on the opening day roster as the primary backup OF while PCA starts in Iowa and has the year to make himself undeniable for MLB.

 

[JP Hochbaum]

Jackson Ferris was a fringe top 100 prospect.

Well he is 19. Very hard for players to get onto top 100 lists at that age. If he develops he will definitely be on there.

 

[CSF77]

Well he is 19. Very hard for players to get onto top 100 lists at that age. If he develops he will definitely be on there.

Callas pretty much said that he would have broken it this year. Now on the Dodgers pod cast they broke it down pretty well. Delivery was not smooth but LAD excels at smoothing out pitchers. He projects as a mid rotation starter. And might have higher top end than Bosch.

It will take around 3 years for this to develop but it could turn into another Cease situation.

 

[JP Hochbaum]

Callas pretty much said that he would have broken it this year. Now on the Dodgers pod cast they broke it down pretty well. Delivery was not smooth but LAD excels at smoothing out pitchers. He projects as a mid rotation starter. And might have higher top end than Bosch.

It will take around 3 years for this to develop but it could turn into another Cease situation.

Yeah it really works for both teams. This is a win now move for the Cubs and for the Dodgers they get rid of a blocked prospect and get lots of potential in return.

 

[beckdawg]

Naylor wouldn’t necessarily cost more because like you used as a negative against him earlier, he has less team control

Yeah potentially. Tough to say but thing with Busch is LA needed the 40 man spot for hernandez and everyone knew they were trading him or someone else. Cleveland doesn't have to move Naylor in the same fashion. So, that's why my initial gut reaction to this was wow cubs gave up a lot. But as i've had some time to digest it I get it a bit more because he is a top 50 prospect. Sure he's not super young like you'd prefer and you'll never hear me hound over 1B prospects assuming that is where they play him but he clearly has value and people truly believe in his bat.

I look at it a bit like this...we'd probably want a similar return on Morel if the cubs trade him and Morel wasn't even a top 50 guy. You could argue Morel has proven a bit more and that's fair. But i guess for me i just believe in his bat a lot. You put his eye with that power and even if he's not an average hitter he's gonna be useful.

 

[CSF77]

Granted this very much depends on coming down to re-signing Bellinger, but if that is done, the Cubs actually would have a fairly good offense this coming year. Despite all the PAs from Hosmer, Mancini, Barnett, and even Madrigal last season, the Cubs had the 6th best offense in terms of runs scored last year. They were 11th or better in BA, OBP, SLG, and OPS. Bellinger back on this team and the offense is in a much better spot than it was last year.

I'd say trade does probably mean Mervis is gone and Wisdom is beyond expendable as I'd much rather see Canario on the opening day roster as the primary backup OF while PCA starts in Iowa and has the year to make himself undeniable for MLB.

It could play out as this:

Chapman signed on at 3/60 Cody at 6/180..

Right now Jed is 40M under tax. It would be a tax hit to do this. Now if Cody drops to 25M AAV and they extend the deal to 8 years I could see that being a plausible offer. 8/200. Lets him age into 1B. Chapman then Jed could try going 5 years 15 AAV 5/75M For a plus D 3B that strikes out a lot and can get 30 HR it fits the team as D comes first.

 

[CSF77]

Yeah potentially. Tough to say but thing with Busch is LA needed the 40 man spot for hernandez and everyone knew they were trading him or someone else. Cleveland doesn't have to move Naylor in the same fashion. So, that's why my initial gut reaction to this was wow cubs gave up a lot. But as i've had some time to digest it I get it a bit more because he is a top 50 prospect. Sure he's not super young like you'd prefer and you'll never hear me hound over 1B prospects assuming that is where they play him but he clearly has value and people truly believe in his bat.

I look at it a bit like this...we'd probably want a similar return on Morel if the cubs trade him and Morel wasn't even a top 50 guy. You could argue Morel has proven a bit more and that's fair. But i guess for me i just believe in his bat a lot. You put his eye with that power and even if he's not an average hitter he's gonna be useful.

I wouldn't argue too much. They don't like to listen to reason much. Busch is ranked #44 on the top 100 so he was not Mervis. But the jump from AAA to the majors is the hardest jump.

So he could flop. But with his AAA numbers last year I would lean more towards success going forward. He is low risk.`

I would give Jed a B- so far this offseason. It was a F- a week ago. Get Cody and Matt then we are getting into A-

 

[beckdawg]

Was watching some stuff and saw someone compare Busch to Nolan Jones who had a similar situation. Was a 24 year old who was kinda blocked in Cleveland as a 2nd round pick. He hit .276/.368/.463 with a .187 ISO in 248 PAs in AAA. Came up for a quick MLB stint and put up a 95 wRC+. Cleveland traded him last offseason to Colorado and he balled out in AAA hitting 183 wRC+ then got promoted and had a 3.7 fWAR season.

Obviously that's kind of "best case" but i think it's an interesting comparison on what's possible.

 

[Zvbxrpl]

I'd feel a lot better about the deal if Ferris' medicals/future prognosis significantly drop his odds to be a starter, because he's got TOR stuff, obviously location issues until he had a window of brilliance pre-TJ at Arkansas.

Otherwise I get the trade but I'm not too fond of it. The dodgers know when to get rid of prospects and when to keep them, and unlike the cubs who have only seen recent returns, the Dodgers know how to develop pitching. And for them to covet Busch for a couple years/not deal him when teams ask for him in deals only then get rid of him like that...I'm skeptical and my initial feeling is the cubs got fleeced. The cubs need a 3B and the kid has checked boxes in the minors you'd want to see progression-wise. Now its time to do it in the bigs.

Mix that with how for years I've screamed for Jed/Theo to draft a true power arm that can consistently hit upper 90s in a sea of their preferred soft tossing arms who throw 90-93 and can 'touch' 96. Then they took this kid, also a lefty, a move I gave them immense credit for.

Seems like the cubs win short term, but if Ferris becomes a power arm, TOR starter as was his ceiling, this can be a lopsided, ugly-looking trade that can be an all-timer in terms of being bad. Plus LA can rake in more money selling 'Ferris' and 'Buehler' in their rotation.

 

[JP Hochbaum]

I'd feel a lot better about the deal if Ferris' medicals/future prognosis significantly drop his odds to be a starter, because he's got TOR stuff, obviously location issues until he had a window of brilliance pre-TJ at Arkansas.

Otherwise I get the trade but I'm not too fond of it. The dodgers know when to get rid of prospects and when to keep them, and unlike the cubs who have only seen recent returns, the Dodgers know how to develop pitching. And for them to covet Busch for a couple years/not deal him when teams ask for him in deals only then get rid of him like that...I'm skeptical and my initial feeling is the cubs got fleeced. The cubs need a 3B and the kid has checked boxes in the minors you'd want to see progression-wise. Now its time to do it in the bigs.

Mix that with how for years I've screamed for Jed/Theo to draft a true power arm that can consistently hit upper 90s in a sea of their preferred soft tossing arms who throw 90-93 and can 'touch' 96. Then they took this kid, also a lefty, a move I gave them immense credit for.

Seems like the cubs win short term, but if Ferris becomes a power arm, TOR starter as was his ceiling, this can be a lopsided, ugly-looking trade that can be an all-timer in terms of being bad. Plus LA can rake in more money selling 'Ferris' and 'Buehler' in their rotation.

This is pretty much how most trades of prospects go. Otherwise the other team wouldn't do it. We win now, they may win later.

 

[DrGonzo]

Chicago Cubs News: The Cubs just gave up their best pitching prospect since Mark Prior

As a Cubs fan it’s hard not to base your idea for what success looks like on the only team in the last 120 years to be successful: The 2016 team. That team buil

cubbiescrib.com

 

[Diehardfan]

Chicago Cubs News: The Cubs just gave up their best pitching prospect since Mark Prior

As a Cubs fan it’s hard not to base your idea for what success looks like on the only team in the last 120 years to be successful: The 2016 team. That team buil

cubbiescrib.com

Who the fuck is that idiot? Playoff team? Mismanagement of what bullpen? They didn't have one from what I saw. This guy sounds like the racist that got banned.

I will say that Ferris does have a big time arm from the clips I saw....teach him some off speed stuff to go with it and you may have something.

We'll have to wait and see on the guys they got. Not expecting a whole lot but was not the least bit interested in acquiring Chapman's 150 Ks.

 

[CSF77]

Was watching some stuff and saw someone compare Busch to Nolan Jones who had a similar situation. Was a 24 year old who was kinda blocked in Cleveland as a 2nd round pick. He hit .276/.368/.463 with a .187 ISO in 248 PAs in AAA. Came up for a quick MLB stint and put up a 95 wRC+. Cleveland traded him last offseason to Colorado and he balled out in AAA hitting 183 wRC+ then got promoted and had a 3.7 fWAR season.

Obviously that's kind of "best case" but i think it's an interesting comparison on what's possible.

I've seen this: numbers at AAA were close

https://www.mlb.com/rangers/player/josh-jung-673962

 

[CSF77]

As of today:

Hoerner 2B
Happ LF
Suzuki RF
Morel DH
Swanson SS
Bosch 1B
Gomes C
Tauchman CF
Madgral 3B

So the 2 positions in need are 3B and CF right now. I doubt that this is done.

 

[knoxville7]

As of today:

Hoerner 2B
Happ LF
Suzuki RF
Morel DH
Swanson SS
Bosch 1B
Gomes C
Tauchman CF
Madgral 3B

So the 2 positions in need are 3B and CF right now. I doubt that this is done.

CF is done. PCA and Tauchman will be handling that

They aren’t bringing Belli back IMO, and that’s a good thing

They still need to find a 3B