David Price

[ChiSoxCity]

The Cubs are better off trading for Hamels.


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[CSF77]

Someone would take him. He has so many tools that a team would think they could fix him. Lake can legitimately look like a superstar for a stretch then look like he shouldnt even play ball in the next. Its weird.

Lake: 110 SO to 14 BB.

7.86 SO's to every walk. There is something wrong with his development.

 

[CSF77]

The Cubs are better off trading for Hamels.


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I agree with the control issue. So getting what you pay for yes he is worth more in prospects. But in Hamels to Price.

Hamels: 274 GS: 108/83 3.27 ERA. 1801 IP 1707 SO 453 BB. 1.14 WHIP
Price: 181 GS 86/51 3.21 ERA 1221 IP 1147 SO 324 BB 1.14 WHIP.

Numbers wise they are about the same guy. Price has less miles on his arm and he held the same numbers in a harder league in the hardest division.

Price holds more weight. Hammels would be a cost per year buy paying prospects to cheapen overhead.

Price is worth every $$$ IMO when he hits F/A.

 

[SilenceS]

Hamels would cost better prospects


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[beckdawg]

Lake: 110 SO to 14 BB.

7.86 SO's to every walk. There is something wrong with his development.

Not saying you're wrong about Lake but again I'd bring up the inherent bias people have. As a counter point, Baez had 95 SO to 15 walks yet most are on the "it's too soon" bandwagon with him. We're only talking about a difference here of around 300 PAs. I'm not going to strongly advocate for Lake. I think he's probably at best a fringe starter. But I will say this, he's played significantly better in winter ball.

in 140 AB, Lake has a .243 avg but his OBP is around the .400 mark thanks to 30 BB in 42 games. He has also stole 21 bases in 23 attempts and has only struck out 51 times.

That was as of last week. If that's what Lake is going forward then it's probably a decent OFer. Clearly he will come down some with regard to being in the majors. But those numbers are roughly Brett Gardner-like. What's interesting in particular about Lake's winter league stats is his power has largely disappeared(2 HRs). All of this suggests a possible change of approach. It's possible that this is just a false indicator as well but if you're looking for reason for optimism that's it.

 

[SilenceS]

His power didn't disappear. He has raw power that comes in spurts. He never has had consistent power. He also is probably specifically working on something. I wouldnt let go of lake now. He has to many tools to just give away


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[beckdawg]

His power didn't disappear. He has raw power that comes in spurts. He never has had consistent power. He also is probably specifically working on something. I wouldnt let go of lake now. He has to many tools to just give away


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Well, I'm not suggesting he's suddenly lost it but more that it is possible his approach to hitting has change where as he has realized with his athleticism putting the ball on the ground is possibly better. I'm kind of talking out of my ass here as there's not a ton of data or evidence to back it up but when I talk about him possibly having a fundamental change that's what I'm getting at. If that's the approach he ends up taking going forward, I honestly think it only costs him maybe 5 HRs a year so you might be looking at more of a 10/30+ type rather than a 15 HR type but clearly if his on base is improved it's entirely worth it.

 

[ChiSoxCity]

I agree with the control issue. So getting what you pay for yes he is worth more in prospects. But in Hamels to Price.

Hamels: 274 GS: 108/83 3.27 ERA. 1801 IP 1707 SO 453 BB. 1.14 WHIP
Price: 181 GS 86/51 3.21 ERA 1221 IP 1147 SO 324 BB 1.14 WHIP.

Numbers wise they are about the same guy. Price has less miles on his arm and he held the same numbers in a harder league in the hardest division.

Price holds more weight. Hammels would be a cost per year buy paying prospects to cheapen overhead.

Price is worth every $$$ IMO when he hits F/A.

I know they're about the same talent-wise.

It doesn't make sense to give up valuable prospects for a rental. Either wait a year for Price or trade for Hamels, who has years left on his current contract.

The Cubs probably won't contend until 2016 anyway, so you might as well wait on Price to hit FA and use your prospects elsewhere.
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[CSF77]

I know they're about the same talent-wise.

It doesn't make sense to give up valuable prospects for a rental. Either wait a year for Price or trade for Hamels, who has years left on his current contract.

The Cubs probably won't contend until 2016 anyway, so you might as well wait on Price to hit FA and use your prospects elsewhere.
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Hard to say talent wise. We are talking about pitching vs a DH and vs a pitcher. League wise AL east is far dominate to the NL east. Recent not as much as it has been.

Milage 600 IP is 3 years less wear.

Hamels would cost more. But the pay off would be 22.5 per vs I'll bet 28-30 per. Does that matter? It shouldn't/ They should go for the arm with the most to give with a youthful team. Per year we are talking about 6 mil per. That is what Theo was paying for a rental arm on a flip.

In the big picture they are getting cost relief from having a stacked farm system. What they need to keep away from is paying 6 mil for rentals. Investing big ticket players to lead the team while the farm providing cost relief is the best method.

So IMO they should pay less in talent and more in $$$ here. IMO they should wait until the dead line unless Det is willing to take lesser talent in return.

On the Lake thing: His SO:BB ratio shows he has little strike zone command. He has no identity as a player. One AB he is swinging for the fences the next he is trying to bunt to first. He doesn't take walks at all. Even in the minors he never took them so this is not a adaption (Baez) going on. It is who he is.

If he was a quality player we would not be having this debate. The only thing he has going on is he can mash it when he get ahold of one. But his plate discipline prevents him from being a real threat as a hitter.

My honest opinion is he it too far gone. He was in the Cubs system as long as Vitters so it is not like he was rushed or anything. He was the product of bad teaching and I'm not sure if his tool box (Brain) is as good as the rest of his tools.

At the end of the day tools are just that. By no means does that make him a quality player.

 

[CSF77]

Almora has Gold Glove caliber defense written all over him. He just turned 20 and put up great numbers before moving up to AA. It's an adjustment period, he only played in 37 games for Tennessee. I'm a firm believer he's going to continue an upward trajectory with full season at AA. He's historically a slow starter (look at each of his minor league stops) -- it still floors me that people forget most of these prospects aren't old enough to drink a beer or go into a gentleman's club.

And I disagree with you 100% on Pierce Johnson. Look at what he's done over the last two seasons -- his biggest that needs to be addressed is the walk rate. Fastball command will certainly help improve that and could drastically alter his projection. Personally, I feel like he has a high floor to begin with. He misses bats and could potentially develop two plus offerings and another league-average offering. It'd be nice to see him add some weight, as well. I saw him pitch in Tennessee last year and he really doesn't "seem" like he's 6'3'', if that makes any sense.

He scuffled after his "hand" injury. He has not fully recovered from it. That said I do not see him as a lead off. I do not see him as a 3-5 hitter. That makes him complementary piece. Sense the team's talent is stacked towards the RH side of the plate he is expendable. I like him and all but he is not a impact bat like Bryant is. Or Baez could become or Soler has been proving. Sure his glove should save plenty of runs but it will be his bat that will reflect his value.

But, If he pumps up his BB% he may become a interesting lead off choice. That was a skill he has not shown thus far in the Cubs system. If I recall right that was something he was known for when he was drafted and he did not carry it over. If he was toting a .400 OBA my opinion would change fast on him.

 

[DewsSox79]

Every team has a bench player with great speed AND who has power?

Hmmm...I'l start with the Cards. Nope. Looking at their bench guys. I see nobody with speed and nobody with power - well, Mark Reynolds, so sort of. But not really.

No, most teams do NOT have a guy with those tools. Better all around players? Yes. But a guy on the bench with specific tools has value. And he is cheap.

Again, as a starter, I think he looks completely lost. No idea how to play properly. But I just think the physical tools have some value.

geeez those poor cards are going to suck now that you state what is on their bench. tell me more


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[JimJohnson]

These threads crack me up with all the Sox fans rushing in here telling the Cubs that they need to give up Russell, Bryant, or Soler for a rental.

LMAO. Thanks for the laughs guys.

 

[CuttyMarsh2012forOffice]

Agreed.

Since he's a rental he shouldn't cost a whole lot, and the Cubs have the £ to extend him.

If available, the Cubs should go hard for him.

Yes. Price loves when a cub gets hard for him

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[TL1961]

I know it does. But seriously I can get a guy that does say power and can back up 1b with a good glove and have another with speed and is a super sub. The value is zero on Lake. I absolutely can be wrong.

EDIT: Another way of looking at it. If he can't make it as a Cub on a team that has been desperate for offense, he isn't likely to be wanted by anyone.

Yeah, don't get me wrong. My stance on Lake is far more of "Don't give up on him. Don't give him away" than it is "He is valuable to any team looking to make a trade."

Believe me,m we've seen plenty of "Maybe someone will trade us something for Darwin barney" threads.

You're right to point out his status with the Cubs, who needed offense. But they tried him as a starter, and he doesn't have the makeup of a guy who can play daily. And they already had a roster full of "25th guys".

I am simply saying that they should be able to harness his speed as a tool they can use. They don't need to throw him out there and hope he's the next Vlad or something.

My prediction: He does not remain a valuable piece on the Cubs. My hope is that he changes his approach enough that he does.

 

[Shawon0Meter]

Hopefully David Price wants to play for the Cubs...the media and fans have always found reasons to connect him here such as his old Vandy pitching coach and now Joe Maddon...then there was the comments he made about winning a World Series with the Cubs. We'll see if it actually meant anything in the next year.

 

[CSF77]

Yeah, don't get me wrong. My stance on Lake is far more of "Don't give up on him. Don't give him away" than it is "He is valuable to any team looking to make a trade."

Believe me,m we've seen plenty of "Maybe someone will trade us something for Darwin barney" threads.

You're right to point out his status with the Cubs, who needed offense. But they tried him as a starter, and he doesn't have the makeup of a guy who can play daily. And they already had a roster full of "25th guys".

I am simply saying that they should be able to harness his speed as a tool they can use. They don't need to throw him out there and hope he's the next Vlad or something.

My prediction: He does not remain a valuable piece on the Cubs. My hope is that he changes his approach enough that he does.

He figures it out fine. Rather it be elsewhere.

 

[SilenceS]

Hopefully David Price wants to play for the Cubs...the media and fans have always found reasons to connect him here such as his old Vandy pitching coach and now Joe Maddon...then there was the comments he made about winning a World Series with the Cubs. We'll see if it actually meant anything in the next year.

In the end, money talks. I think he would love to come Chicago but he is going to get the money he wants to do it.

 

[TC in Mississippi]

In the end, money talks. I think he would love to come Chicago but he is going to get the money he wants to do it.

If Scherzer even gets close to the 7 years/$210 he wants then Price will get more. Maybe $32 million per.

 

[The Hawk]

Hopefully David Price wants to play for the Cubs...the media and fans have always found reasons to connect him here such as his old Vandy pitching coach and now Joe Maddon...then there was the comments he made about winning a World Series with the Cubs. We'll see if it actually meant anything in the next year.

Who in hell would want to play for the Cubs? Unless they throw much more money than he is worth at him.

 

[SilenceS]

Who in hell would want to play for the Cubs? Unless they throw much more money than he is worth at him.

Dynamite post. Thank you for stopping by. I will direct you back to the Sox or Bulls board where you will get made fun of. ray: