Getting Soriano out of town...(another idea for a swap of bad contracts)

[dabynsky]

Watching the game tonight I was struck with the idea of swapping Soriano for Zito. Both have been disappointments for their respective teams. Soriano has been the more productive player but Zito is younger and signed for less money overall/fewer years. Another idea like the Dunn swap that is pure fantasy and won't happen, but hear me out on this one.

Giants perspective:
I would have to think that they would jump on this trade in a heartbeat. They have 6 SPs with Zito and a terrible offense. Being able to trade a terrible contract at a position of depth for the team for a guy that is overpaid but still productive. Soriano would instantly be the best offensive threat on the Giants right now for a team that has played Pat Burrell, Aaron Rowand, Cody Ross, and other garbage in the OF this year.

Cubs perspective:
This is the harder sell. Barry Zito has been absolutely awful and is one of the highest paid pitchers in baseball. That said he is only owed 39 million over the next two seasons as opposed to 54 million over 3 seasons. He does have an option for 2014 that does become guaranteed if he pitches 400 innings the next two years or 200 innings in 2013. The deal also has a 7 million dollar buyout, and the deal only remotely makes sense if the Giants kick in the cash to cover the buyout. The players are actually fairly comparable using WAR:
Soriano
2009- -0.1
2010- 3.0
2011- 1.1
3 year total- 4.0

Zito
2009-2.2
2010-2.1
2011- 0.0 (Before tonight's performance)
3 year total- 4.3

The reason I think this has any merit is because the Cubs closest pitching prospects have either been hurt (Whiteneck, McNutt, Cashner) or sucking in the minors or majors (Jackson and Coleman, if you want to call him a prospect). Zambrano and Dempster are both done after next season, and I don't want to trust Cashner, Wells, and McNutt to fill two rotation spots next season. Moving Soriano and Fukudome, which should be a lot easier, allows the Cubs to put the far more athletic OF of Byrd, Jackson, Colvin out there to improve the defense, and I am not sure how much offense you lose going from that to Soriano, Byrd, Fukudome.

I am not entirely sold on the idea, but I thought it was an interesting fantasy trade and topic for discussion.

 

[X]

I'm sold.

 

[CODE_BLUE56]

hmmmm....interesting angle i never thought about this

i wonder if the cubs FO would ever consider a trade in contracts like this

 

[dabynsky]

hmmmm....interesting angle i never thought about this

i wonder if the cubs FO would ever consider a trade in contracts like this

Well to make things complicated both Soriano and Zito have full NTC. Soriano as we all know has already stated he would waive his NTC, and why wouldn't he to go to a team with a chance to win the World Series. It is a much harder sell for Zito, but he got left off the postseeason roster last year. And there is little reason to believe that he would make the postseason roster if the Giants win the West again this year.

 

[DewsSox79]

this was discussed on the radio last week. i dont know what i would do here. both blow ass

 

[dabynsky]

this was discussed on the radio last week. i dont know what i would do here. both blow ass

Damn thought I had come up with something new here. It is an interesting idea and has a lot more merit than the Dunn swap I think.

 

[X]

Yeah, the Dunn swap won't happen...he'll turn it around, and even if he doesn't, Sox fans will give him another full year to do so (not that I blame them...I'd do the same thing if he was a Chubbie...) But this one could have some legs.

 

[CODE_BLUE56]

i mean alfonso isnt very good anymore but atleast he hits with power:shrug:

zito is good sometimes but alot of the time he is just a wreck

i see your strategy but idk

 

[DewsSox79]

Yeah, the Dunn swap won't happen...he'll turn it around, and even if he doesn't, Sox fans will give him another full year to do so (not that I blame them...I'd do the same thing if he was a Chubbie...) But this one could have some legs.

He is only getting this season as a pass with me. Looking at his career numbers, you dont just drop off that drastic. 2nd since 2004 in homeruns. Thomas had the same problem going to a DH and he is a HOFer, plus dunn is doing this while going to a new league.

Damn thought I had come up with something new here. It is an interesting idea and has a lot more merit than the Dunn swap I think.

dont feel bad, just cus it was brought up, you thought of it on your own as well. this is a good thread by the way, hope it doesnt get derailed.

 

[Rice Cube]

I've heard this idea before. I don't think the Giants do it as they're overloaded in the OF anyway.

 

[dabynsky]

I've heard this idea before. I don't think the Giants do it as they're overloaded in the OF anyway.

They have a lot of people that are OFs, but none of them are very good. The only guy that is locked up long term in the OF is Rowand. I mean Burrell has been worse and is done after the year. I agree that it won't happen, but I don't see why the Giants wouldn't consider it.

 

[dabynsky]

dont feel bad, just cus it was brought up, you thought of it on your own as well. this is a good thread by the way, hope it doesnt get derailed.

I don't feel too bad, but I hadn't heard someone suggest it before. Just a little disappointing but I just want to talk about something besides how bad the Cubs are or how great Castro is.

 

[Rice Cube]

They have a lot of people that are OFs, but none of them are very good. The only guy that is locked up long term in the OF is Rowand. I mean Burrell has been worse and is done after the year. I agree that it won't happen, but I don't see why the Giants wouldn't consider it.

I think Brian Sabean has enough goodwill that he's able to keep Zito around until a better offer comes along. Plus the whole ego thing. It's a good trade of bad contracts on paper, but I just don't see it happening because Sabean knows the Cubs are desperate, but he is not. I actually think it's more likely he wants Pena instead and just throws Huff in the OF (suggested by someone else I was talking to).

 

[dabynsky]

I think Brian Sabean has enough goodwill that he's able to keep Zito around until a better offer comes along. Plus the whole ego thing. It's a good trade of bad contracts on paper, but I just don't see it happening because Sabean knows the Cubs are desperate, but he is not. I actually think it's more likely he wants Pena instead and just throws Huff in the OF (suggested by someone else I was talking to).

I don't think the trade will happen either. I don't know if that Sabean is really looking to keep Zito around for much longer because there has been a fair bit of talk prior to this year about the Giants buying out Zito. I don't know as if the Cubs are really that desperate at this point. The Giants have far more to lose in not making a deal then the Cubs do at this point. The problem I see for the Cubs is that you have a GM that knows he is on a short leash and that making moves to hurt this team's current chances, as infinitesimally small as they might be, because if this team doesn't rebound it is more than likely his job.

 

[Rice Cube]

I think if you think the Cubs should try to contend next season, they cannot have Barry Zito in their rotation. Even if they're not trying to contend, they cannot have Barry Zito in their rotation.

 

[bobferg]

Zito > Doug Davis

 

[dabynsky]

I think if you think the Cubs should try to contend next season, they cannot have Barry Zito in their rotation. Even if they're not trying to contend, they cannot have Barry Zito in their rotation.

Don't get me wrong. I don't want Barry Zito, but we have a few OF options that are ready to play by the end of this year. Moving Soriano would allow for us to have one of the fastest, most athletic OFs we have ever had. I don't see internal options to fill two rotation spots next year. I mean we can go into next year hoping that Wells, Cashner, and/or McNutt can fill two spots with a combination of low risk deals to guys coming off of injuries trying to make comebacks.

I guess it comes down to what do you think is a better option? Having those three guys trying to fill two rotation spots with Soriano, Byrd, and Jackson as the OF or Zito and those 3 guys fighting for one spot with Byrd, Colvin and Jackson as your OF. I am not entirely sold on either option, but I just get tired of Doug Davis being the best option to pitch every fifth day.

 

[Rice Cube]

Zito > Doug Davis

Doug Davis sucks but doesn't cost nearly as much as Zito :lol:

 

[Rice Cube]

Don't get me wrong. I don't want Barry Zito, but we have a few OF options that are ready to play by the end of this year. Moving Soriano would allow for us to have one of the fastest, most athletic OFs we have ever had. I don't see internal options to fill two rotation spots next year. I mean we can go into next year hoping that Wells, Cashner, and/or McNutt can fill two spots with a combination of low risk deals to guys coming off of injuries trying to make comebacks.

I guess it comes down to what do you think is a better option? Having those three guys trying to fill two rotation spots with Soriano, Byrd, and Jackson as the OF or Zito and those 3 guys fighting for one spot with Byrd, Colvin and Jackson as your OF. I am not entirely sold on either option, but I just get tired of Doug Davis being the best option to pitch every fifth day.

Easy. Move Soriano to 1B.

 

[dabynsky]

Easy. Move Soriano to 1B.

You still have the issue of three guys with injury history and/or inconsistent past performances to fill 40% of your rotation next season. And by moving Soriano to 1B you take yourself out of the running to land an elite level 1B.