Glennon Is A Week-To-Week Starting QB

[Teddy KGB]

Why do some ignore the sequence of events? Bears cut/release every QB on the team, to wit, they have no starter or back up on the roster prior to free agency. They sign Glennon and Sanchez, then they draft Trubisky. Had they figured they would get Trubisky and, say, just signed a mid level guy like Sanchez and resigned Fales and then Clev or SF decided they wanted Trubisky, how excting would that be right now?

Sanchez, Fales and the likes of Davis Webb would be a shitshow.

1) Pace didn't have any way to know that Trubisky would be available.
2) If FA was after the draft, does anyone think they would have signed Glennon?
3) Glennon was offered $8M , I believe,to remain TB's back up.
4) The money paid him in no way hampers anything the Bears would have done or will do cap wise.
5) Worst case scenario is Glennon sucks on a Brian Hoyer level and the Bears move on with minimal financial effect next season. Best case, Pace ends up with a upper level draft chit that costs him $18M.

My question is, given the ample space the Bears have in the cap, why would anyone care what Glennon makes? How does it impact the Bears or your lives personally?

I mostly agree with this. I think the Glennon signing was meant to be 2-fold.

1) They signed a guy with starting QB potential who might pan out.

2) Signing Glennon paved the way for the Bears to aggressively pursue drafting a future QB, and they still had Glennon if they didn't end up with him.


The issue here is fans are thinking too linearly, while what Pace did makes sense on multiple levels, as he wasn't trying to put all his eggs in one QB basket.


My take?

Pace wanted to get a QB in the draft and in the first round all along. He tried to trade up for both Mariotta and Wentz, but didn't have enough assets to make that deal.

So, to give himself maximum leverage, he needed to sign a guy in free agency who could believably develop into a starting QB, while at the same time allowing Pace to trade up if needed to get his QB guy without other teams thinking a trade up would be for a QB (remember when they thought in the moment it was for Solomon Thomas?) and therefore outbidding the Bears for the spot.

Draft day comes, the plan works, and the Bears get the QB they really wanted. And had it not worked out, the Bears will still have had a QB on their roster who could be a good starter for them ideally.

Strategically, even in hindsight, the Glennon move makes total sense.

 

[iueyedoc]

I mostly agree with this. I think the Glennon signing was meant to be 2-fold.

1) They signed a guy with starting QB potential who might pan out.

2) Signing Glennon paved the way for the Bears to aggressively pursue drafting a future QB, and they still had Glennon if they didn't end up with him.


The issue here is fans are thinking too linearly, while what Pace did makes sense on multiple levels, as he wasn't trying to put all his eggs in one QB basket.


My take?

Pace wanted to get a QB in the draft and in the first round all along. He tried to trade up for both Mariotta and Wentz, but didn't have enough assets to make that deal.

So, to give himself maximum leverage, he needed to sign a guy in free agency who could believably develop into a starting QB, while at the same time allowing Pace to trade up if needed to get his QB guy without other teams thinking a trade up would be for a QB (remember when they thought in the moment it was for Solomon Thomas?) and therefore outbidding the Bears for the spot.

Draft day comes, the plan works, and the Bears get the QB they really wanted. And had it not worked out, the Bears will still have had a QB on their roster who could be a good starter for them ideally.

Strategically, even in hindsight, the Glennon move makes total sense.

Agreed. I also think Pace has strong conviction on what he values in a QB and Trubisky was the only guy that possessed those traits,had Clev or SF decided that MT was going to be their guy, I think Pace would have waited much later in the draft for a 2-3 year developmental guy, and maybe would take another shot at "his" guy next year.

 

[Teddy KGB]

Considering how much it cost the Bears to move up one spot in the draft for Trubisky, how could it not have "worked out"? What scenario would end up with the Bears not having Trubisky?

Other teams were angling for that #2 pick. Teams knew who San Francisco was taking. For all the anger and bluster from "sources" and other GMs about how Pace overpaid, all you need to know are 2 things that show all those sources were bullshit.

1) Teams were talking with San Francisco and trying to get into their spot. The 49ers were fielding calls from MULTIPLE interested parties.
2) Once the trade was announced, teams starting making calls to the Jags for trading. Those calls stopped DEAD once the Bears picks Mitch Trubisky.

Anyone with a brain can tell from that, that other teams were after Trubisky. And had they known the Bears were after Mitch, they may have upped their offers to the 49ers and outbid the Bears for the spot, whereas thinking the Bears had Glennon, and thinking they could just get Trubisky at pick 4 with a trade with the Jags, they were holding into their chips.

That's your scenario. A young GM played a bunch of the NFL GM old guards, and all that narrative about Pace outbidding himself was sour grapes from GMs pissed they got fooled.

 

[Teddy KGB]

Agreed. I also think Pace has strong conviction on what he values in a QB and Trubisky was the only guy that possessed those traits,had Clev or SF decided that MT was going to be their guy, I think Pace would have waited much later in the draft for a 2-3 year developmental guy, and maybe would take another shot at "his" guy next year.

I agree. Pace identifies his "guy" every year and tries to get him, and kudos to him, he learned from not getting Wentz and Mariotta, and figured out a way to get his guy this time.

 

[gpphat]

Had Pace not spent a 2nd overall pick on a QB then I would agree, but what is the graphic for his salary compared to backups? Because Pace, Fox, the McCaskey's, Trubisky, all the players except Glennon, and most fans want to see and are hoping Trubisky is starting at some point this season. If the article in the OP is right we'll see him starting early in the season. So if Glennon is the starter for the whole year, you are 100% right compared to the rest of the league starters he is on the cheaper side...but if he is the back up by week 4, what does his salary look like compared to the leagues backups? If you have that graphic it would be very helpful, maybe he is a cheap backup and my expensive insurance plan comment was unwarranted.

I went ahead and did the research for you on the backups salary and the results are not surprising. Because it seems like visual aids work best for you I put the data into a bar graph. I based the info off of rotoworlds depth chart, for the teams who don't have clear cut starters if rotoworld listed a player as a backup and your chart listed them as a starter I put the player rotoworld said was the starter as the backup. I used over the caps average contract value for each player as the APY salary which looks like it matched up with what your chart used. I also included Trubisky in the mix.

So as I stated, if Trubisky is the starter sooner rather than later as the OP article suggests and as most of us anticipate...Glennon is an expensive insurance plan

 

[gpphat]

Why do some ignore the sequence of events? Bears cut/release every QB on the team, to wit, they have no starter or back up on the roster prior to free agency. They sign Glennon and Sanchez, then they draft Trubisky. Had they figured they would get Trubisky and, say, just signed a mid level guy like Sanchez and resigned Fales and then Clev or SF decided they wanted Trubisky, how excting would that be right now?

Sanchez, Fales and the likes of Davis Webb would be a shitshow.

1) Pace didn't have any way to know that Trubisky would be available.
2) If FA was after the draft, does anyone think they would have signed Glennon?
3) Glennon was offered $8M , I believe,to remain TB's back up.
4) The money paid him in no way hampers anything the Bears would have done or will do cap wise.
5) Worst case scenario is Glennon sucks on a Brian Hoyer level and the Bears move on with minimal financial effect next season. Best case, Pace ends up with a upper level draft chit that costs him $18M.

My question is, given the ample space the Bears have in the cap, why would anyone care what Glennon makes? How does it impact the Bears or your lives personally?

I get why they signed Glennon, definitely feel they could have gotten him for cheaper but a few million in the grand scheme of things doesn't matter. But how is calling Glennon an expensive insurance plan wrong? That is exactly what he is, if the Bears couldn't draft a 1st round QB then they have a Glennon for at least a year at $14ish million...if they do draft a QB in the first (which they did) at worst they have Glennon in until the rookie is ready to take over at best they have a solid back up.

 

[Teddy KGB]

I get why they signed Glennon, definitely feel they could have gotten him for cheaper but a few million in the grand scheme of things doesn't matter. But how is calling Glennon an expensive insurance plan wrong? That is exactly what he is, if the Bears couldn't draft a 1st round QB then they have a Glennon for at least a year at $14ish million...if they do draft a QB in the first (which they did) at worst they have Glennon in until the rookie is ready to take over at best they have a solid back up.

Its not wrong when you put it that way. I think it might just be an issue of semantics - if by some stretch Glennon becomes a franchise QB, calling him an insurance plan just sounds demeaning, although technically, it would still be true even if that ended up being the case (which I don't think it will, but I think taking it to that extreme illustrates how semantics can get in the way here).

 

[gpphat]

Its not wrong when you put it that way. I think it might just be an issue of semantics - if by some stretch Glennon becomes a franchise QB, calling him an insurance plan just sounds demeaning, although technically, it would still be true even if that ended up being the case (which I don't think it will, but I think taking it to that extreme illustrates how semantics can get in the way here).

It's not really semantics, it's calling a spade a spade. When Glennon was signed to a 3 year contract where $13M of his $18.5M guaranteed money is in the first year, did anyone really think there was a legitimate chance he was in the long term plans for the Bears? Any reasonable fan knew from the get go that Pace would draft a QB in this draft and if not definitely in the next. So no matter how you cut it, Glennon was an expensive insurance plan....albeit a necessary expensive insurance plan.

 

[Teddy KGB]

It's not really semantics, it's calling a spade a spade. When Glennon was signed to a 3 year contract where $13M of his $18.5M guaranteed money is in the first year, did anyone really think there was a legitimate chance he was in the long term plans for the Bears? Any reasonable fan knew from the get go that Pace would draft a QB in this draft and if not definitely in the next. So no matter how you cut it, Glennon was an expensive insurance plan....albeit a necessary expensive insurance plan.

True, and very well put. When Glennon was signed, it was essentially a one year "prove it" deal with a team option for years 2 and 3, based on how it was structured.

It's kind of weird, but I also think there are those who are also hoping for Glennon to do well enough to get the starting job - elsewhere, but still land that starting job, which I think lends to some of the blowback in a weird way. I think there is a segment of Bears fans who love a story of an underdog who succeeds at the QB spot, and project that onto Glennon - he's almost the proxy for the "second string QB is always better" except he's actually the current starter. I don't understand the reasoning behind it, but that sort of Bears QB derangement could also be at play - which I also always felt was never even fair to the quarterback.

But that's just me trying to psychoanalyze meatball fans - its like trying to delve into the mind of a lunatic - good luck making sense of what goes on in there.

 

[Rise]

You can roll cap space year to year in the NFL now, so to act like spending on Glennon doesn't matter is wrong, it does matter. The Bears should hoard space now, and then go all in one year on FAs, then the next year sign nobody again ect. This gives them chances for comp picks, and could infuse a huge jump in talent when the draft picks are ready.

 

[iueyedoc]

I get why they signed Glennon, definitely feel they could have gotten him for cheaper but a few million in the grand scheme of things doesn't matter. But how is calling Glennon an expensive insurance plan wrong? That is exactly what he is, if the Bears couldn't draft a 1st round QB then they have a Glennon for at least a year at $14ish million...if they do draft a QB in the first (which they did) at worst they have Glennon in until the rookie is ready to take over at best they have a solid back up.

Whatever one chooses to call it, it was the smart way of doing things. Go in to the draft wanting but not desperate. With the lack of high $ players on the Bears at this point, paying Glennon $5, 15, or 25M makes no difference, they have money to spare and no one to give it to at this time.

I just don't get the hand wringing by fans over money that is not theirs, when it makes zero difference on the teams player acquisitions. Maybe it is just fans gobbling up lazy sports writers '"he fooled himself and overpaid" crap.

This time next year the Bears will either cut him with a zero team altering $4.5 M cap hit, or, the less likely scenario, having to decide whether to keep or trade a now top 10 NFL QB.

 

[gpphat]

Whatever one chooses to call it, it was the smart way of doing things. Go in to the draft wanting but not desperate. With the lack of high $ players on the Bears at this point, paying Glennon $5, 15, or 25M makes no difference, they have money to spare and no one to give it to at this time.

I just don't get the hand wringing by fans over money that is not theirs, when it makes zero difference on the teams player acquisitions. Maybe it is just fans gobbling up lazy sports writers '"he fooled himself and overpaid" crap.

This time next year the Bears will either cut him with a zero team altering $4.5 M cap hit, or, the less likely scenario, having to decide whether to keep or trade a now top 10 NFL QB.

I think the frustration the fans had was that there were positions that needed to be addressed like CB, S, WR, DT, and to a lesser degree LT and with the FA money Pace had it was a pretty underwhelming free agency. So to see Glennon as the "high" dollar acquisition fans will throw the blinders on and wonder what the hell Pace is doing. I think if Pace was able to get Bouye or retain Jeffery the Glennon contract wouldn't be a focal point. But with the lack of quality free agents available along with Pace not being able to get the any of the few that were quality free agents. It's only natural to look at $14M+ for Glennon and say he overpaid for him, but when you look at everything as a whole the Glennon contract is just a drop in the bucket since he can be cut at a low price next year

 

[Teddy KGB]

You can roll cap space year to year in the NFL now, so to act like spending on Glennon doesn't matter is wrong, it does matter. The Bears should hoard space now, and then go all in one year on FAs, then the next year sign nobody again ect. This gives them chances for comp picks, and could infuse a huge jump in talent when the draft picks are ready.

Just a point - If you think Pace is going to go all in one year on FA's like the Dan Snyder Redskins did, you are cheering for the wrong team.

Pace is rebuilding the Bears the right way - through the draft. All those years Snyder went all in every year on FAs and how many Superbowls did that get them? None. How many playoff appearances? Very few if any.

I could see Pace going for one or two big name free agents once the Bears are routinely in playoff contention to get them over the hump, but for now, get used to the 1 year "prove it" FA deals.

 

[didshereallysaythat]

I think the frustration the fans had was that there were positions that needed to be addressed like CB, S, WR, DT, and to a lesser degree LT and with the FA money Pace had it was a pretty underwhelming free agency. So to see Glennon as the "high" dollar acquisition fans will throw the blinders on and wonder what the hell Pace is doing. I think if Pace was able to get Bouye or retain Jeffery the Glennon contract wouldn't be a focal point. But with the lack of quality free agents available along with Pace not being able to get the any of the few that were quality free agents. It's only natural to look at $14M+ for Glennon and say he overpaid for him, but when you look at everything as a whole the Glennon contract is just a drop in the bucket since he can be cut at a low price next year

I would rather overpay at the QB position (since it is so important) to guarantee you get your guy. Overpaying for a 1 hit wonder like Bouye can really hurt a team in the long run if they get in a habit of doing it.

 

[gpphat]

I would rather overpay at the QB position (since it is so important) to guarantee you get your guy. Overpaying for a 1 hit wonder like Bouye can really hurt a team in the long run if they get in a habit of doing it.

Call me crazy but I would like to see Pace gamble on a CB then to "overpay" a QB who he doesn't expect to be the starter the following year...especially when the plan is to draft a QB. Pace had the cap room to go for both but lost out on getting Bouye...but if it were an either/or situation on spending money on Glennon and losing Bouye or spending money on Bouye and missing out on Glennon...give me Bouye every single time

 

[xer0h0ur]

It's not really semantics, it's calling a spade a spade. When Glennon was signed to a 3 year contract where $13M of his $18.5M guaranteed money is in the first year, did anyone really think there was a legitimate chance he was in the long term plans for the Bears? Any reasonable fan knew from the get go that Pace would draft a QB in this draft and if not definitely in the next. So no matter how you cut it, Glennon was an expensive insurance plan....albeit a necessary expensive insurance plan.

Except that isn't calling a spade a spade. YOU are the one who keeps labeling Glennon a potential backup quarterback. So what Teddy said is in fact correct. You are playing with words by calling Glennon a backup in the event that Trubisky winds up the starting quarterback over him. Be that this year or the next. The only scenario in which you would be correct and Glennon truly is a backup quarterback is if he doesn't play well enough to prove he is a starting caliber quarterback. Should he end up proving to be a competent enough quarterback to be a starter then what you have is a starter backing up rookie with Trubisky taking the helm. This is in fact semantics. By definition he would be a backup quarterback but that doesn't make him any less of starting quarterback at that point. The point of contention here is merely whether or not he would remain in Chicago as a "backup" or if he is then traded to another team who is in need of a "starter." Semantics...

 

[Rise]

Just a point - If you think Pace is going to go all in one year on FA's like the Dan Snyder Redskins did, you are cheering for the wrong team.

Pace is rebuilding the Bears the right way - through the draft. All those years Snyder went all in every year on FAs and how many Superbowls did that get them? None. How many playoff appearances? Very few if any.

I could see Pace going for one or two big name free agents once the Bears are routinely in playoff contention to get them over the hump, but for now, get used to the 1 year "prove it" FA deals.

It's the wrong way to do it in today's NFL. All those one year prove it deals cost us mid round picks, just like the ones some through hissy fits about losing for Trubisky. We are drafting 5-7 players a year while smart teams are drafting 9-12. This can not continue or we will never get ahead, unless Pace hits on an insane number of picks compared to the rest of the league.

The way to do it is to have Buy years and sell years. Of course I don't want a Snyder like sign every washed up big name player, but I do want to see the Bears start to play the game the right way based on the rules.

 

[gpphat]

Except that isn't calling a spade a spade. YOU are the one who keeps labeling Glennon a potential backup quarterback. So what Teddy said is in fact correct. You are playing with words by calling Glennon a backup in the event that Trubisky winds up the starting quarterback over him. Be that this year or the next. The only scenario in which you would be correct and Glennon truly is a backup quarterback is if he doesn't play well enough to prove he is a starting caliber quarterback. Should he end up proving to be a competent enough quarterback to be a starter then what you have is a starter backing up rookie with Trubisky taking the helm. This is in fact semantics. By definition he would be a backup quarterback but that doesn't make him any less of starting quarterback at that point. The point of contention here is merely whether or not he would remain in Chicago as a "backup" or if he is then traded to another team who is in need of a "starter." Semantics...

He was the insurance plan the minute the ink hit the paper...unless you are delusional enough to believe he was considered the long term solution for the Bears when Pace signed him. Him becoming the backup doesn't change the fact that Glennon was signed as his just in case player. Pace got Glennon just in case he couldn't get his guy in the draft. Pace got Glennon just in case the QB he drafts isn't ready to start from day 1. Pace got Glennon just in case the QB he drafted becomes the starter and a decent veteran backup is needed. That is the definition of an insurance plan, you have insurance just in case something happens.

I don't know why you are getting so offended that I keep calling him an expensive insurance plan. It's what he is...even in the unlikely scenario that he starts for the whole year and goes into next year as the starter. He is the insurance plan until Trubisky takes over.

 

[iueyedoc]

I think the frustration the fans had was that there were positions that needed to be addressed like CB, S, WR, DT, and to a lesser degree LT and with the FA money Pace had it was a pretty underwhelming free agency. So to see Glennon as the "high" dollar acquisition fans will throw the blinders on and wonder what the hell Pace is doing. I think if Pace was able to get Bouye or retain Jeffery the Glennon contract wouldn't be a focal point. But with the lack of quality free agents available along with Pace not being able to get the any of the few that were quality free agents. It's only natural to look at $14M+ for Glennon and say he overpaid for him, but when you look at everything as a whole the Glennon contract is just a drop in the bucket since he can be cut at a low price next year

I agree. The pace of salary increases has so outpaced inflation for the top tier players in all sports that guys are now making decisions on where to play based on quality of life factors, like chance to win a championship or family, so offering a Gilmore or a Bouye the most money doesn't guarantee his acquisition anymore. Some guys will solely follow the $$'s, but not all.

And as much fun it is to see your team land those guys, I can't remember the last good team built that way. All I see is the Philly dream team failure or any number of Redskins debacles. You don't build a team through high priced free agents, you get that missing piece that way.

 

[Teddy KGB]

It's the wrong way to do it in today's NFL. All those one year prove it deals cost us mid round picks, just like the ones some through hissy fits about losing for Trubisky. We are drafting 5-7 players a year while smart teams are drafting 9-12. This can not continue or we will never get ahead, unless Pace hits on an insane number of picks compared to the rest of the league.

The way to do it is to have Buy years and sell years. Of course I don't want a Snyder like sign every washed up big name player, but I do want to see the Bears start to play the game the right way based on the rules.

Well, I've seen teams do it your "right way" and they seem to get all the press in April, but rarely a Superbowl, and more often than not miss the playoffs.

So with all due respect, I'll take Ryan Pace's way over your way. 2 prominent teams that do it the way Pace does? Green Bay Packers and New England Patriots, 2 teams that despite personal hatred for them, are always in the playoffs and contending for Superbowls.

So yeah, I'm glad we don't do it your way. From 2007 on, Jerry Angelo tried doing it your way, which is why we are in the mess we are in now...