Hammel to Cubs?

[fatbeard]

Every day you are trolling someone on this forum. Maybe you could get a life?

You know what? You're right.

From now on, I will endeavor to only post high-quality baseball content, like sober critiques of Kris "Dr. Loopyswing" Bryant's mechanics, or insightful projections on whether the 2016 Chicago Cubs would ever, given a quantum multiverse in which all outcomes are simultaneously possible, win even a single playoff game, or share with the forum my personal sketches of Kyle Schwarber's nude body in titillating baseball action poses.

 

[Adipost]

Sounds like Lacy other unknown.

This could go a few ways.

Chatwood pen
Montgomery pen
6 man.

hint choose option 1

You think Chatwood will do any better in the bullpen?

 

[beckdawg]

It's not a terrible deal for the cubs but I really like Rollie Lacy. For those unaware, he's basically a guy who doesn't have dominating stuff but who pitches really well. Over 110 professional innings he has a 2.45 ERA and 9.9 k/9 with a 2.3 bb/9. So, while scouts are going to heap praise on him, ultimately for a guy who's a bit of a non-prospect those are some serious numbers.

Another way to look at this though is the cubs have done a really good job finding pitching later in drafts. They have got Hamels and Chavez for a 7th and 11th round pick plus whatever the PTBNL is. So, while I'm a bit sad to see both those two go this july, they've left a lot of quality in their system while improving on the mlb level.

Edit: Should probably add that I think Hamels was a really smart get by the cubs at this price. Only reason I'm even slightly negative is like I said I like Lacy but the process I like a lot. Hamels while older is the same age as Lester. And perhaps like Verlander did last year a fresh scene can reinvigorate him. As an added perk you potentially also have him next year though unless he's really good he's going to be a bit expensive.

 

[beckdawg]

You think Chatwood will do any better in the bullpen?

If it were me I'd piggy back him and Monty. I don't think you can put Chatwood in the pen but I think you can have a really quick hook on him if he starts to get in trouble with monty waiting in the wings.

 

[chibears55]

Maybe Hamel could help with Darvish when he cleared to pitch and get him back to focusing better...

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[CSF77]

If it were me I'd piggy back him and Monty. I don't think you can put Chatwood in the pen but I think you can have a really quick hook on him if he starts to get in trouble with monty waiting in the wings.

I was thinking Hendricks myself. Joe gets trigger happy.

But I would approach it as 1st through 5th behind or injury Chatwood. 2 innings Butler. Main middle man Chavez. Rest are more so 6-9th inning.

Now when Morrow returns they will need to cut again. That on most likely Rosario

Duesing is owed 3.5 mil next year so yes it would cost them but designing him over the 26 mil owed Chatwood.

Both suck in their own way but it comes down to finances and Chatwood you can target it as command vs lack of talent. This might be fixable in a off season rebuild of his faulty pitching mechanic.

 

[CSF77]

Has it happened before where the Cubs ran 4 lefties?

 

[anotheridiot]

Coomer was on the score this morning, said he has seen plenty of guys go to the pen, throw everyday and start throwing strikes again. Chatwood is a swing and miss pitcher since rarely do his pitches start or end in the zone, but most of them are in there at one time or another. Put him against more impatient hitters in the late innings and maybe he gets more swings and misses and in turn confidence.

But knowing Theo and Maddon, Monty will be back in the pen.

 

[TC in Mississippi]

Coomer was on the score this morning, said he has seen plenty of guys go to the pen, throw everyday and start throwing strikes again. Chatwood is a swing and miss pitcher since rarely do his pitches start or end in the zone, but most of them are in there at one time or another. Put him against more impatient hitters in the late innings and maybe he gets more swings and misses and in turn confidence.

But knowing Theo and Maddon, Monty will be back in the pen.

You can't put Chatwood in the pen, that's idiotic. The best they can do is use a Chatwood/Monty combo to help in those starts. I don't love the trade but it can't really hurt.

 

[beckdawg]

You can't put Chatwood in the pen, that's idiotic. The best they can do is use a Chatwood/Monty combo to help in those starts. I don't love the trade but it can't really hurt.

I mean you could also theoretically DFA Chatwood though I'm guessing he'd elect for FA rather than accepting the assignment because he keeps the remaining money anyways. But in general I agree. I think what you're gonna see is Hamels replacing Darvish(or more accurately monty) until probably September as given the time Darvish has been off you'd likely expect at least 2 rehab starts which he's not even had 1 yet. So best case you're probably talking 15th-20th of August before he's back. At that point you just need to shuffle around guys for a week or so and then you're in september with a full 40 man roster available.

After that you get to the post season where Chatwood really is irrelevant. Hopefully if he shows any signs of being better you can likely void Hamels' final year and go with Chatwood again. If not and if Hamels is good, you theoretically could package money with Chatwood to a team like Tampa or Oakland next offseason. For example, if the cubs were to eat say half the remaining $25.5 mil left on Chatwood's deal that's a pretty cheap buy low candidate for a team like Oakland who will struggle to find money for premium FAs. You're essentially talking about $6-7 mil a year for 2 years which is probably worth the gamble for them if it only takes something like a PTBNL to get him.

 

[CSF77]

I mean you could also theoretically DFA Chatwood though I'm guessing he'd elect for FA rather than accepting the assignment because he keeps the remaining money anyways. But in general I agree. I think what you're gonna see is Hamels replacing Darvish(or more accurately monty) until probably September as given the time Darvish has been off you'd likely expect at least 2 rehab starts which he's not even had 1 yet. So best case you're probably talking 15th-20th of August before he's back. At that point you just need to shuffle around guys for a week or so and then you're in september with a full 40 man roster available.

After that you get to the post season where Chatwood really is irrelevant. Hopefully if he shows any signs of being better you can likely void Hamels' final year and go with Chatwood again. If not and if Hamels is good, you theoretically could package money with Chatwood to a team like Tampa or Oakland next offseason. For example, if the cubs were to eat say half the remaining $25.5 mil left on Chatwood's deal that's a pretty cheap buy low candidate for a team like Oakland who will struggle to find money for premium FAs. You're essentially talking about $6-7 mil a year for 2 years which is probably worth the gamble for them if it only takes something like a PTBNL to get him.

I can't see them pushing Monty out of the rotation. Yu most likely returns in Sept and they have the full 40 in play. At that point nothing matters.

Duensing has been poor all year so I can't see them holding him. Chatwood has command issues going on. What that opinion said is not far fetched honestly. Late inning the game pressure is higher where that dancing fastball may get more bites vs early inning where hitters are looking to blow up pitch counts.

It feels Marmol a bit. I wouldn't put him in hold opportunities unless he becomes filthy.

 

[anotheridiot]

You can't put Chatwood in the pen, that's idiotic. The best they can do is use a Chatwood/Monty combo to help in those starts. I don't love the trade but it can't really hurt.

OK, we will let Ron Coomer know he is an idiot....too.

 

[anotheridiot]

I can't see them pushing Monty out of the rotation. Yu most likely returns in Sept and they have the full 40 in play. At that point nothing matters.

Duensing has been poor all year so I can't see them holding him. Chatwood has command issues going on. What that opinion said is not far fetched honestly. Late inning the game pressure is higher where that dancing fastball may get more bites vs early inning where hitters are looking to blow up pitch counts.

It feels Marmol a bit. I wouldn't put him in hold opportunities unless he becomes filthy.

It only does not matter if you are going to a 6 or 7 man rotation. You know Lester wants to pitch every 5 and Maddon will cater to that even if they used 6.

 

[TC in Mississippi]

OK, we will let Ron Coomer know he is an idiot....too.

I like Ron Coomer just fine but that's the only suggestion I've heard that they put Chatwood in the pen. It just doesn't make sense, you can't have a reliever walk like that and the idea that he'll somehow figure something out is just wishful thinking, as is this idea that Hamels will suddenly remember how to pitch. Again a piggyback with Monty seems to be the best they can do and I sure hope Hamels is good, but there are no numbers that suggest it.

 

[PickSix]

My wild ass guess.
Duensing gets shit canned.
They try to salvage the Chatwood investment. Chatwood gets the 5th starter spot with a real quick hook. Monty gets his clean up duty and gets back to relieving which is where he will be used/provide value in the post season.

 

[beckdawg]

I sure hope Hamels is good, but there are no numbers that suggest it.

Eh... I wouldn't go that far. If you look at why he's died this year it's HRs. His xFIP is 4.18 which again isn't fantastic but keep in mind what price we're talking here. That's a decent #4 starter these days. But to me its more important how he's had the HR problems. At home in texas he has a 23.9% HR/FB which is absurdly high. On the road it's a much more reasonable 15.9%. That alone takes his home fip from 6.16 to 4.18 and his away xFIP goes down to 3.84. His strand rate at home was also a low 68.4%.

I'd also point out that he's going from a pretty poor defensive team to a far superior defensive team. I'm not expecting him to be peak Hamels by any means but I think it's a pretty smart trade. I'd rather have Hamels than Eovaldi or Happ and I think having another vet on the team especially in the playoffs is a good thing.

 

[TC in Mississippi]

Eh... I wouldn't go that far. If you look at why he's died this year it's HRs. His xFIP is 4.18 which again isn't fantastic but keep in mind what price we're talking here. That's a decent #4 starter these days. But to me its more important how he's had the HR problems. At home in texas he has a 23.9% HR/FB which is absurdly high. On the road it's a much more reasonable 15.9%. That alone takes his home fip from 6.16 to 4.18 and his away xFIP goes down to 3.84. His strand rate at home was also a low 68.4%.

I'd also point out that he's going from a pretty poor defensive team to a far superior defensive team. I'm not expecting him to be peak Hamels by any means but I think it's a pretty smart trade. I'd rather have Hamels than Eovaldi or Happ and I think having another vet on the team especially in the playoffs is a good thing.

I agree the pickings were slim. I would have preferred Eovaldi because he actually has a little upside but the price was right on Hamels so I get it.

 

[TC in Mississippi]

The deal is final. Rollie Lacey, Eddie Butler and a PTBNM later to Texas.

 

[anotheridiot]

well, at least its not another off the 25 man and the other spot duty guy is replaced.

I guess technically, it will start a 6 man rotation since Monty is throwing tonight.

 

[jooo83]

Chatwood should be relegated to mop up duty, long relief, or spot starter.