Kevin Barkley vs Charles Durant thread formerly AtL

[remydat]

Simply pretending that Drexler's presence on the 1997 Rockets somehow means the 1997 Houston Rockets were equal to the 2016 Warriors is significantly more idiotic and short-sighted.

This is a straw man. No one said they were equal. I said it's similar enough for Barkley to be a hypocrite. The Rockets with those 3 were championship contenders. They won the same number of games as the 2016 Cavs who beat the Warriors and they lost to a 64 win team in 6 games.

Once you start chasing rings with championship contenders, crying about another dude doing a better job of it is hypocritical.

 

[Alpha Male]

This is a straw man. No one said they were equal. I said it's similar enough for Barkley to be a hypocrite. The Rockets with those 3 were championship contenders. They won the same number of games as the 2016 Cavs who beat the Warriors and they lost to a 64 win team in 6 games.

Once you start chasing rings with championship contenders, crying about another dude doing a better job of it is hypocritical.

You can make the argument that durant is also a hypocrite for bitching about lebron going to miami and doing the same thing 6 years later only worse (depending on how you look at the situation).

 

[remydat]

You can make the argument that durant is also a hypocrite for bitching about lebron going to miami and doing the same thing 6 years later only worse (depending on how you look at the situation).

I agree Durant is a hypocrite for that so no argument there.

 

[remydat]

Makes sense. When comparing 16 Warriors to 96 Rockets, or any two teams, records are 'meaningless'.




Makes sense. With Curry missing games in the playoffs, the Warriors went to Game 7 of the NBA Finals. With the Rockets being healthy, they were swept in the 2nd round of the playoffs.



How is this relevant to anything?



16 Durant > 96 Barkley
16 Warriors > 96 Rockets

No comparison whatsoever.



Makes sense. 27-year old Durant signs as a free agent from the 3rd best team in the NBA to the best team in the NBA. 33-year old Barkley is traded from a middling Suns team to a 48-34 Rockets team.

Close enough.

It's relevant because the Rockets were clearly a championship contender despite all your crying about age.

Barkley chased a championship and so did Durant. That is the comparison. You don't get to be absolved from being a hypocrite simply because the person you are crying about did a better job chasing a championship.

This would be like 2 people picking a fight and one guy saying the other guy that picked a fight is an asshole because he won his fight whereas the guy crying got his ass kicked. They both fucking picked fights. Barkley and Durant both chased a championship by going to teams that were clear championship contenders.

 

[didshereallysaythat]

I am not getting into the argument with you remy. I really don't care where durant went or whether barkley is a hypocrite. The only thing I want to say is there is no way the 16 dubs can be in the conversation for one of the greatest in history. That is reserved for teams that won a ring.

Exactly. Same goes to the Patriots in 07. People can say "well, if Brady was healthy, they beat the Giants". Fact is they didn't beat them.

 

[Gustavus Adolphus]

We all have our mountains to die upon.

 

[Alpha Male]

Exactly. Same goes to the Patriots in 07. People can say "well, if Brady was healthy, they beat the Giants". Fact is they didn't beat them.

Yep. Brady just got owned by eli. Same thing. Steph curry was great all season but sucked in the playoffs. Can't blame injuries. Injuries were never excuse for the 90s bulls.

 

[didshereallysaythat]

Makes sense to view the situation as being either:

a) 16 Warriors win title, arguably greatest team ever

or

b) 16 Warriors best player injured in postseason, lose title in 7th game....comparable to 1996 Rockets who went 48-34.

Glad we cleared up that discussion.

2016 Warriors are better than the 1996 Rockets. But they are comparable to the 2001 Mariners.

 

[didshereallysaythat]

Yep. Brady just got owned by eli. Same thing. Steph curry was great all season but sucked in the playoffs. Can't blame injuries. Injuries were never excuse for the 90s bulls.

I am not surprised Curry had some wear and tear issues either. 2nd straight year they played 2 months of postseason ball. With his slight build and full throttle approach, nagging injuries can add up.

 

[Alpha Male]

I am not surprised Curry had some wear and tear issues either. 2nd straight year they played 2 months of postseason ball. With his slight build and full throttle approach, nagging injuries can add up.

He was fine. He just sucked. Unless you are derrick rose eveyone plays a little bit hurt come playoff time.

This guy never made excuses.

 

[remydat]

That must have been unprecedented when Charles Barkley was traded from the Suns to the Rockets....I can imagine the bold headline "33-year old forward traded to team that is ALREADY A CHAMPIONSHIP CONTENDER!!!!"


I can see how that situation would be comparable to Durant leaving OKC and signing as a FA with Golden State.


Close enough.

You seem enamored with the media reaction which has nothing to do with my point.

Barkley was traded to a team that was a championship contender. This is historical fact. He's a hypocrite for crying about Durant seeking to do the same thing and having a better opportunity. That is all.

Crying because another dude got a better job opportunity than you is lame.

 

[Alpha Male]

It's like draymon green said in 2015 cavs don't get to makes excuses for their injured players.

http://www.cbssports.com/nba/eye-on...omment-if-i-was-6-11-id-be-like-anthony-davis

 

[SilenceS]

The homerism is strong with alpha male

 

[Alpha Male]

I love how an argument of whether barkley is a hypocrite turned into an argument about 96 rockets vs 16 warriors.

 

[Alpha Male]

The homerism is strong with alpha male

yes it is. :lol:

 

[Alpha Male]

Makes sense. We have 4 variables in this situation...Barkley, Durant, the 97 Rockets, and the 16 Warriors. None of the variables are similar. Yet Barkley's situation is exactly the same as Durant's situation.

I really don't care about barkley but i hate when people say that the warriors are one of the greatest. You have to win a ring to be considered. That is why you play. Have some injuries. Too bad. Its all part of the game. It would be like a meatball fan saying well the bears would have won super bowl 41 if tommie harris played. Ugh. They might be one of the greatest losers but at the end of the day that don't mean a thing.

 

[Alpha Male]

Good analogy with the Lovie Smith era Bears. Its not like the Warriors didn't win the title in 15, go 73-9, have their best player injured in the playoffs, and lose in Game 7 of the Finals. I agree that it was dumb for people to think that the 2016 Warriors were one of the best teams of all-time...it would make more sense for people to compare the 2016 Warriors to the 1997 Rockets or 2006 Chicago Bears. Furthermore, I expect the 2017 Warriors to perform at a level similar to the 98 Rockets...win 57 games, contend for the division, lose to the Jazz in the playoffs.

Good call.

I think you missed my point entirely. It's okay for you to argue back and forth with remy about 16 warriors vs 96 rockets. I really dont care. But a few times in your argument you have called warriors the best team. That is not the case. The NBA champions are the best team. That is the cavs. You have also called them one of the best teams in history. That is also false. All the bolded teams in this list are better than them. You don't need me to tell you why.

http://www.landofbasketball.com/championships/year_by_year.htm.

 

[remydat]

Makes sense. I do 40mph in a 35mph zone and get a $100 speeding ticket. My friend does 100mph in a 35mph zone and gets a $100 speeding ticket. Would it be "hypocritical" of me to complain about the situation, since we were both speeding?

Durant from OKC to Warriors is like:

a) James from Cleveland to Heat
b) Gretzky from Oilers to Kings
c) Sanders from 49ers to Cowboys
d) Barkley from Suns to Rockets


e) remydat from Bears forum to Bulls forum

57 win teams have beat 73 win teams so the disparity between the two is not as great as your example suggests.

For evidence of this please refer to the 2016 playoffs where a 55 win OKC team was up 3-1 on the 73 win Warriors and the 57 win Cav team defeat the 73 win Warriors.

So in conclusion your analogy is fucking stupid. The 57 win Rockets team was championship caliber. To pretend otherwise is to ignore historical reality.

A better analogy is that you were going 90 in a 70 in your BMW and your friend was going 80 in a Nissan. Your friend crying that you're a douche because you were speeding in a better car is asinine.

Durant chose a better car in trying to get to his final destination. That is all.

 

[remydat]

I think you missed my point entirely. It's okay for you to argue back and forth with remy about 16 warriors vs 96 rockets. I really dont care. But a few times in your argument you have called warriors the best team. That is not the case. The NBA champions are the best team. That is the cavs. You have also called them one of the best teams in history. That is also false. All the bolded teams in this list are better than them. You don't need me to tell you why.

http://www.landofbasketball.com/championships/year_by_year.htm.

He is not arguing with me about Rockets vs Warriors because no one claimed they were equal or that the Rockets were better. I simply said they were both championship caliber teams which Rory being the consummate builder of strawmen has decided to argue with himself that someone said they were equals.

 

[Alpha Male]

I think I did, too.



Would you say that, without Durant, the Warriors are the best NBA team heading into the 2016-2017 season? I would. Would you say that, with Durant, the Warriors are the best NBA team heading into the 2016-2017 season? If not, then God help you.

Would you say that, without Barkley, the Rockets were better than the 72-10 Bulls heading into the 1996-97 season? I wouldn't. Would you say that, with Barkley, the Rockets were better than the 72-10 Bulls heading into the 1996-97 season? I wouldn't.

Not exactly "comparable", "similar", or "hypocritical", is it?

im not talking about the rockets. What I am saying is there is a playoff to determine the best team. The most recent one determined that hte cavs were indeed the best team. Now going to next season sure. But I am talking about 16 warriors place in history. That is all. Carry on with your rockets barkley durant discussion.