Movies vs. TV

[Gustavus Adolphus]

I am a big fan of the "movie" type series on television. I am a Game of Thrones junkie, for example. I also loved Deadwood, Boardwalk Empire, of course the Sopranos, and currently Black Sails. Where television has gone is amazing in terms of its special effects and screen writing. I remember the old Flash Gordon series so it has made some tremendous strides in my life-time.

This is what I meant in the initial post. I love the development of the characters over the course of many seasons.

 

[The Hawk]

This is what I meant in the initial post. I love the development of the characters over the course of many seasons.

What is your favorite series?

 

[Gustavus Adolphus]

What is your favorite series?

Tough call. Some things I've enjoyed over the years:
The Sopranos
The Wire
West Wing
The Leftovers*****
Breaking Bad
TWD
Game of Thrones


**** The Leftovers is a tough call to put in here, because they've only had two seasons, and ending with a third this year.

 

[Houston]

Here's an easy way. How many shows/movies came out in the 7 years of TWD?

Also, why would a successful TV show stop others from making movies/shows in the same genre? It didn't stop space shows and movies when Star Trek was on.

Before The Walking Dead:

2002 - 28 Days Later
2002 - Resident Evil
2004 - Dawn of the Dead
2004 - Shaun of the Dead
2005 - Land of the Dead
2007 - 28 Weeks Later
2009 - Zombieland

Flooding the market refers to when an excess amount of inventory for sale causes an undesired drop in price for the product, in extreme cases making the products impossible to sell at any price.

Businesses take measures to avoid this. For examples, publishers will release books from popular authors under pseudonyms, as with the Kenyatta series by Donald Goines, which were published under the name Al. C. Clarke. The same is also the case with Stephen King, when he published several books under the pseudonym Richard Bachman.

The North American video game crash of 1983 was largely caused by excess inventory of low-quality games and systems. Atari so greatly over-produced the game E.T. that they were unable to sell them and buried them in a landfill.

When flooding the market is done intentionally in an effort to eliminate competition, it is known as dumping.

2010 - The Walking Dead
2011 - The Walking Dead
2012 - The Walking Dead
2013 - The Walking Dead
2013 - World War Z
2013 - Warm Bodies
2014 - The Walking Dead
2015 - The Walking Dead
2016 - The Walking Dead
2017 - The Walking Dead

 

[Crystallas]

Okay...... so is there a point? Also why is TWD counted for each season? It's a TV show.

What I said still stands. Releasing a high quality TV show (many rank it in their top-3 all time) is not flooding the market. Star Trek didn't kill Space sci-fi.


Your argument is basically that TV zombie shows shouldn't exist, because it might ruin the idea of releasing movies. Like Batman, the #1 TV series for a while, ruined comic books and the super hero genre, right? TWD doesn't come close to flooding the market, but Batman the TV show did. It was a 'mania'. *hint* it didn't actually ruin the genre.

Examples of flooding the market with TV shows are Courtroom Dramas, Cop Shows, Family Sitcoms, and Westerns. And guess what, only one of those really died and it wasn't due to just one show, but dozens of shows and movies.

 

[Houston]

Your argument is basically that TV zombie shows shouldn't exist, because it might ruin the idea of releasing movies.

No. This is my argument:

2002 - 28 Days Later
2002 - Resident Evil
2004 - Dawn of the Dead
2004 - Shaun of the Dead
2005 - Land of the Dead
2007 - 28 Weeks Later
2009 - Zombieland
2010 - The Walking Dead
2011 - The Walking Dead
2012 - The Walking Dead
2013 - The Walking Dead
2013 - World War Z
2013 - Warm Bodies
2014 - The Walking Dead
2015 - The Walking Dead
2016 - The Walking Dead
2017 - The Walking Dead

If you're talking about my stance, it's that a TV series can flood the market with a product (in this case zombies) and reduce the number of films offering that product. Nothing you've posted disproves or even challenges this theory.

 

[Crystallas]

Nothing you've posted disproves or even challenges this theory.

So Batman, Star Trek examples are just wrong, despite flooding the market (by your subjective metric of one TV show) far more than TWD has? Superhero and Space films expanded afterwards with those two examples, so I would say that is more than a fair comparison, but completely destructive to your premise.

 

[Crystallas]

Maybe I'm wrong, Zombie movies are as big as ever. Look.

[video=youtube;g18Dn4-cdnw]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=g18Dn4-cdnw[/video]

 

[Spunky Porkstacker]

Maybe I'm wrong, Zombie movies are as big as ever. Look.

[video=youtube;g18Dn4-cdnw]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=g18Dn4-cdnw[/video]

:rofl:How did you come across that ?

 

[Crystallas]

:rofl:How did you come across that ?

Went here and sorted by year just to see if TWD was listed once for every year of existence.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_zombie_films

 

[Houston]

So Batman, Star Trek examples are just wrong, despite flooding the market (by your subjective metric of one TV show) far more than TWD has?

No. Batman and Star Trek just have nothing to do with The Walking Dead and zombie films.

Scream reinvigorating slasher films had no effect on what was going on in the romantic comedy genre. Strange, it's almost as if you have to take these things on a case by case basis...

a TV series can flood the market with a product (in this case zombies) and reduce the number of films offering that product.

Again, do you have anything that disproves that this can happen?

 

[Houston]

Night of the Living Dead filmmaker George Romero has come forward to discuss his struggles in getting financing for a new zombie film, saying he can no longer make one of "substance," thanks in large part to AMC's hit series The Walking Dead.

Romero then went on to cite the success of both The Walking Dead and World War Z as a major reason why he can no longer pitch "sociopolitical" zombie films with a modest budget. "I used to be able to pitch them on the basis of the zombie action, and I could hide the message inside that. Now, you can't," he said. "The moment you mention the word 'zombie,' it’s got to be, 'Hey, Brad Pitt paid $400 million to do that.'"

"Then, all of a sudden, here came The Walking Dead," he added, concluding that he simply could no longer make "a zombie film that had any sort of substance," because "it had to be a zombie film with just zombies wreaking havoc," which Romero says, "is not what I'm about."

Wow, it's almost as if his services (films) are no longer needed because people are getting their zombie fix elsewhere. Almost as if The Walking Dead is partially responsible for him not having any new zombie films. Interesting...

"Once they bleed out of pop culture I’ll be able to go back and do them again. I don’t want to touch them now. Gosh, they are all over the place. The Walking Dead is the number one television series in the States"

Wow wow wow. For some reason he seems to think that his chances will be better after The Walking Dead is off the air for a considerable amount of time. My god, why would he think that?

 

[Crystallas]

Fine, whatever. The Walking Dead prevented a 77 year old director from getting funding, because TWD is some conspiracy production that requires bilinear monopoly status to get people to watch it, therefore they told everyone to not fund Romero. When TWD talks, everyone listens.
And of course, when I said Batman and Star Trek, apparently I meant Zombie movies as an example of flooding the market.

Is this some kind of troll?

 

[Tater]

Maybe I'm wrong, Zombie movies are as big as ever. Look.

[video=youtube;g18Dn4-cdnw]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=g18Dn4-cdnw[/video]

:thinking: ...... :smh:

 

[Crystallas]

Okay guys. I need your help. Serious time.

How should I word this change.org petition to stop The Walking Dead from being a good show, so more Zombie movies get made?

 

[number51]

Fine, whatever. The Walking Dead prevented a 77 year old director from getting funding, because TWD is some conspiracy production that requires bilinear monopoly status to get people to watch it, therefore they told everyone to not fund Romero. When TWD talks, everyone listens.
And of course, when I said Batman and Star Trek, apparently I meant Zombie movies as an example of flooding the market.

Is this some kind of troll?

Houston has very very strong feelings about TWD and FTWD. He has taken some abuse for expressing his opinion that FTWD > TWD. No one agrees with him and I think this has 'left a mark'. The epic awfulness that is The Walking Dead has become a bit of a crusade for Houston. I believe this is not an intentional troll job, this is a long overdue, sincere, cathartic release.

 

[Crystallas]

That's fair if he likes something more than another. I don't think it's useful to debate subjectivity (entertaining time wasters to debate, sure, but a person likes what they like in the end regardless). I personally like them both. FTWD not as much, but I think it's still a good show, just a lot to live up to. If he likes it more, that's fine too. None of that is the problem.
The issue is blaming one enormously successful TV show for the demise of an entire genre. It would be like suggesting The Simpsons destroyed the genre of animations about cartoonists families (notice: I don't blame the Simpsons for the demise of Zombie movies). The Simpsons at peak has a much larger market share than TWD did, genre for genre(again, notice: Not saying the Simpsons is in the Zombie genre). King of the Hill, Rugrats, Family Guy, American Dad, Incredibles, Bobs Burgers, etc etc. (notice: Not suggesting King of the Hill, Rugrats, Family Guy, American Dad, Incredibles, or Bobs Burgers are Zombie shows.)

 

[Tater]

That's fair if he likes something more than another. I don't think it's useful to debate subjectivity (entertaining time wasters to debate, sure, but a person likes what they like in the end regardless). I personally like them both. FTWD not as much, but I think it's still a good show, just a lot to live up to. If he likes it more, that's fine too. None of that is the problem.
The issue is blaming one enormously successful TV show for the demise of an entire genre. It would be like suggesting The Simpsons destroyed the genre of animations about cartoonists families (notice: I don't blame the Simpsons for the demise of Zombie movies). The Simpsons at peak has a much larger market share than TWD did, genre for genre(again, notice: Not saying the Simpsons is in the Zombie genre). King of the Hill, Rugrats, Family Guy, American Dad, Incredibles, Bobs Burgers, etc etc. (notice: Not suggesting King of the Hill, Rugrats, Family Guy, American Dad, Incredibles, or Bobs Burgers are Zombie shows.)

Could you clarify? Please use detail.



:lol:

 

[Houston]

The issue is blaming one enormously successful TV show for the demise of an entire genre. It would be like suggesting The Simpsons destroyed the genre of animations about cartoonists families (notice: I don't blame the Simpsons for the demise of Zombie movies). )

Twilight, Batman, and now The Simpsons. You keep mentioning things that have nothing to do with The Walking Dead or the zombie genre.

If I'm providing circumstantial evidence that my house burned down because my dryer caught on fire, you giving me three examples of dryers that didn't catch on fire does not disprove my theory. Whatever effect The Simpsons had on animation has nothing to do with The Walking Dead.

Minus Resident Evil sequels, what was the last successful American zombie film? When was the last time any of your friends, family members, or coworkers talked about a new zombie film? When was the last time a zombie film was #1 at the box office?
My position is that the surplus of zombies that The Walking Dead provided is part of the reason why the zombie film market has come to a screeching halt. Still, you have yet to show how I am wrong. And how these things somehow aren't connected.

 

[Crystallas]

You claimed a TV show flooded the market, and counted each season as one whole to the zombie genre. I said both, that is not what flooding the market is and pretty much had the opposite effect. Then I used examples of shows that had higher levels of overexposure that did not ruin their genre. It's funny, because you cite the video game crash, and guess what? That was a trend from all over the market, that example should have helped you understand what flooding the market means, instead it was a whoosh moment, and you twisted it to mean something else.

Video Game crash of 1983 = The Walking Dead ??? Is this what you define as circumstantial evidence?

Also, don't ignore the absolute fact that any one genre of film must compete with every other genre of films at the same time. Grandma (who is one mean momma who watches slasher films) might yawn at another living dead film, but pay to see the Power Rangers movie. I bet irate fans of the Power Rangers series were pissed that Miruthan got funding a few years before their reboot, right? Maybe Dean Israelite (the director of Power Rangers 2017) aught to blame his inability to fund a the same old idea that seems new only to him and a small group of people, before blaming other successful projects. (notice: Not saying the Power Rangers are in the Zombie genre).

Tired ideas are tired. There is only so much a person can go, 'what tool would I grab from the hardware store...'. My friends and family don't talk about zombie movies, because they really aren't anything special to begin with. You should be grateful as a fan of the genre to have what you do have. Also be happy that nearly 100 years of movies are in the library. Oh, but princess needs them to be constantly new and American? Give me a break. What next, you're going to argue that they need to all match the highest budget thresholds to qualify? Wheel can only be reinvented so many times.