NBA's most overpayed players courtesy of Forbes

[houheffna]

But the primary reason we drafted Rose was Kirk's complete failure as a basketball player during the 07-08 season. In that year, he was counted on to be 1 of our 3 primary scorers.

Okay...that is way, way overboard. And Hinrich was a complete disaster defensively because he gave up a career night to Diener is also overboard. Your hate for Hinrich is beginning to go beyond reason...

 

[pinkizdead]

houheffna wrote:

But the primary reason we drafted Rose was Kirk's complete failure as a basketball player during the 07-08 season. In that year, he was counted on to be 1 of our 3 primary scorers.

Okay...that is way, way overboard. And Hinrich was a complete disaster defensively because he gave up a career night to Diener is also overboard. Your hate for Hinrich is beginning to go beyond reason...

yeah for the most part, the entire team regressed across the board. the reason we drafted rose besides his obvious upside, work ethic, and talent; was also related to our previous drafts. we dafted pf's for 3 years. we needed depth at other positions.
Obviously if we had such little faith in hinrich, it seems absurd that we chose him over gordon.

 

[pinkizdead]

houheffna wrote:

But the primary reason we drafted Rose was Kirk's complete failure as a basketball player during the 07-08 season. In that year, he was counted on to be 1 of our 3 primary scorers.

Okay...that is way, way overboard. And Hinrich was a complete disaster defensively because he gave up a career night to Diener is also overboard. Your hate for Hinrich is beginning to go beyond reason...

yeah for the most part, the entire team regressed across the board. the reason we drafted rose besides his obvious upside, work ethic, and talent; was also related to our previous drafts. we dafted pf's for 3 years. we needed depth at other positions.
Obviously if we had such little faith in hinrich, it seems absurd that we chose him over gordon.

 

[houheffna]

Picking Hinrich over Gordon is not absurd at all. Hinrich is a better all around player, he can do other things besides scoring.

 

[jsain360]

After watching that Clipper game last night, Baron Davis is not a TOP 10 PG, I never seen guy, let alone an entire team take as many questionable shots as he and the Clippers did yesterday.

 

[pinkizdead]

pinkizdead wrote:

houheffna wrote:

But the primary reason we drafted Rose was Kirk's complete failure as a basketball player during the 07-08 season. In that year, he was counted on to be 1 of our 3 primary scorers.

.
Obviously if we had such little faith in hinrich, it seems absurd that we chose him over gordon.

my point is that if we brought in rose, because we thought hinrich was so terrible, why did we pick hinrich over gordon? obviously we di didnt think he was that bad.

if andrew bynum is on this list, i'm okay with putting kirk on it. Bynum is overpaid, but he can be a great player while healthy.

 

[Fred]

Diddy1122 wrote:

Fred wrote:

I completely agree that Deng is overrated. That is a given. Unfortunately, the Chairman and Forman disagree.

There are 20 guys on that list better than Hinrich. Is Kirk better than Duhon? Of course. But the primary reason we drafted Rose was Kirk's complete failure as a basketball player during the 07-08 season. In that year, he was counted on to be 1 of our 3 primary scorers. He led the team in minutes, and shot 41% and 35% from the 3-point line. He was a complete and utter disaster on BOTH ends of the court. (i.e. Travis Diener's career high). He made 11 million that year, and he received little of the blame, when he deserved most of it. I have no idea why this is...I can't figure it out...but he isn't worth his massive contract, and it will be proven out when he never makes more than 5 million a year for the rest of his career after this current contract is completed.

Wow, WOW Fred, are you sure you aren't coming down with something cuz you're speaking nonsense right now.

"The primary reason we drafted Rose was Kirk's complete failure as a basketball player.." God you are flat out WRONG here. We drafted Rose because he was THE BEST PLAYER IN THE DRAFT. PERIOD. Kirk had nothing to do with it, other than would we trade him or wouldn't we. Beasley was NEVER going to be drafted by us. Sure we took a look at him but it was obvious from day 1 that Rose was the man. It was a no brainer. There are other Michael Beasley's out there. PG's of Rose's caliber do not come around that often.

Sometimes your overwhelming hatred for all things Hinrich tends to blind you to logic & reason. And I'm willing to bet that Hinrich gets paid more than $5mill/yr on his next contract, which will be with the Bulls btw. Much to your dismay, I'm 99% certain Kirk will play his entire career in a Bulls uni.

KC: But for the lottery and drafting Derrick, would your long-term Bulls plan be set back greatly after 2007-08?
REINSDORF: Sure. But I knew all along we were going to get Derrick. (laughs) John can tell you this. This is the honest to goodness truth. This was several months before the draft and John said, ‘We really need a point guard.’ And I said, ‘Ah, we’ll win the lottery, take Derrick Rose.’ I was acting silly and it worked out."
http://archives.chicagotribune.com/2009/jul/21/sports/chi-21-bulls-reinsdorf-chicago-jul21

So, John Paxson said, "We really need a point guard" BEFORE THEY HAD AN IDEA THAT ROSE WOULD BE AN OPTION....in the months before we even won the lottery. I thank God every day that Hinrich sucked so bad that year, because taking Beasley wasn't an easy option. THERE WERE A TON OF PEOPLE MAKING A CASE FOR BEASLEY, INCLUDING MY CO-HOST. Go back and listen to those shows. If Hinrich had put up a 44%, 41%-3 point performance in the 07-08 season, I think it would have been easier for the Bulls to take Beasley.

 

[Fred]

clonetrooper264 wrote:

20 players on that list? I see maybe 15. Is Stuckey really a better PG than Hinrich? Really? Chalmers? Brooks? I know TJ Ford is lightyears quicker than Hinrich, but is he really a better PG overall? Is DJ Augustine truly better? I haven't seen anything of Tyreke Evans yet so I won't judge him as better or worse yet. I still think Lou Williams is by no means a better PG. And we've already agreed on Duhon being worse. Now my math may be off by a player or two, but I do believe that leaves me with about 15 people ahead of Hinrich, which makes Hinrich a top 20 PG.

And the reason we got Derrick Rose was because he was clearly the best player in that draft and he has the potential to be a superstar in the future. He is clearly better than Hinrich at PG. This is undisputable. However we did not draft him because Hinrich absolutely sucked.

TJ Ford is 10 times the point guard Kirk Hinrich is. To support my argument, I provide Exhibit A: Vinny benches Rose, plays Kirk, and T.J.'s torching of Mr. Defense:
http://www.chicagotribune.com/sport...-23-bulls-pacers-chicagofeb23,0,3375939.story

Don't want to argue about the other names. You've already admitted he's not in the top 15. He's paid like it. Therefore, he's overpaid. Thanks for agreeing with me on the original argument.

 

[Fred]

Diddy1122 wrote:

Fred wrote:

In his rookie year, I ws shocked at how many people were showering love on a guy who shot 38%, and it continues to this day.

I like Hinrich. I think he's a good player who can start on any number of teams. He's overrated by the media, that's a given, but the most overrated within the Bulls organization, not so much. That honor is bestowed upon Mr. Glass, who will never be an All-Star despite being paid as one.

Again, I agree with most of this. He's overrpaid relative to other backup point guards. He could start for a few teams. How many....that is up for debate. But he clearly could not start for half of the teams in the league at PG.

 

[houheffna]

Again, compared to other contracts on the Forbes' list, Hinrich is not on that level. His contract actually depreciates over time. The high end of the contract has passed already.

 

[clonetrooper264]

Fred wrote:

Diddy1122 wrote:

Fred wrote:

In his rookie year, I ws shocked at how many people were showering love on a guy who shot 38%, and it continues to this day.

I like Hinrich. I think he's a good player who can start on any number of teams. He's overrated by the media, that's a given, but the most overrated within the Bulls organization, not so much. That honor is bestowed upon Mr. Glass, who will never be an All-Star despite being paid as one.

Again, I agree with most of this. He's overrpaid relative to other backup point guards. He could start for a few teams. How many....that is up for debate. But he clearly could not start for half of the teams in the league at PG.

Technically he could start for ANY team in the league, but he won't on half of them because those teams have better PG's. Could Hinrich start on the Spurs if Parker wasn't there? Absolutely. I see no reason why not.

 

[clonetrooper264]

Fred wrote:

clonetrooper264 wrote:

20 players on that list? I see maybe 15. Is Stuckey really a better PG than Hinrich? Really? Chalmers? Brooks? I know TJ Ford is lightyears quicker than Hinrich, but is he really a better PG overall? Is DJ Augustine truly better? I haven't seen anything of Tyreke Evans yet so I won't judge him as better or worse yet. I still think Lou Williams is by no means a better PG. And we've already agreed on Duhon being worse. Now my math may be off by a player or two, but I do believe that leaves me with about 15 people ahead of Hinrich, which makes Hinrich a top 20 PG.

And the reason we got Derrick Rose was because he was clearly the best player in that draft and he has the potential to be a superstar in the future. He is clearly better than Hinrich at PG. This is undisputable. However we did not draft him because Hinrich absolutely sucked.

TJ Ford is 10 times the point guard Kirk Hinrich is. To support my argument, I provide Exhibit A: Vinny benches Rose, plays Kirk, and T.J.'s torching of Mr. Defense:
http://www.chicagotribune.com/sport...-23-bulls-pacers-chicagofeb23,0,3375939.story

Don't want to argue about the other names. You've already admitted he's not in the top 15. He's paid like it. Therefore, he's overpaid. Thanks for agreeing with me on the original argument.

I never said he wasn't overpaid (because he's getting starter's money as a current bench player so yeah, he is) BUT that was not my point.

TJ Ford is 10 times the PG Kirk is? I doubt that. You've been saying that players will revert back to their career averages. Let's look at those in closer detail.

Ford: 0.435 FG% 0.318 3pt% 0.825 FT% 0.7 OR 2.6 DR 3.3 RPG 6.5 APG 1.2 SPG 0.1 BPG 2.66 TO 2.40 FPG 12.4PPG

Hinrich: 0.415 FG% 0.380 3pt% 0.814 FT% 0.4 OR 3.0 DR 3.4 RPG 6.1 APG 1.3 SPG 0.2 BPG 2.28 TO 3.20 FPG 13.9 PPG

Similar numbers. The only outstanding difference in these stats is Hinrich's higher 3pt% and foul rate. Everything else is really marginal. If this is the case, it would seem that if Ford is truly the better player, he is by no means 10 times the player.

We can look at playoff numbers too if you like.

Ford (3 appearances): 0.449 FG% 0.348 3pt% 0.878 FT% 0.7 OR 2.6 DR 3.3 RPG 5.6 APG 0.9 SPG 0.1 BPG 2.50 TO 2.30 FPG 13.6 PPG

Hinrich (4 appearances): 0.421 FG% 0.394 3pt% 0.762 FT% 0.3 OR 3.2 DR 3.6 RPG 6.1 APG 1.4 SPG 0.4 BPG 2.38 TO 3.30 FPG 15.8 PPG

As you can see, both players stepped up in the playoffs. The differences in the numbers is pretty much the same. So if you're going to be adamant about Ford being better than Hinrich (which is quite debatable based on numbers) you can't really say that he's 10 times better than Hinrich is based on the numbers. The only thing Ford is 10 times better than Hinrich in is running fast. Ford is like a lightening bolt, I cannot and will not deny that.