The Crawford Dilemma: Sign or Walk Away?

KBIB

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The FWDs are bad at D, but the D-men sure as hell ain't good.
There not as bad as people think.

Maatta isn't bad. CDH is good at moving the puck when healthy. Murphy is a knock off prime Seabrook, and Keith is still Keith albeit a coming back down to earth one.

The Hawks problem is they don't have that guy that was on another planet in Keith any more and need three pairings each and every night instead of relying on just one Seabrook/Keith pairing like they did during the Cup run and had a prime hammer to compensate.

Can Boqvist take the next step? Perhaps.
 

Granada

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There not as bad as people think.

Maatta isn't bad. CDH is good at moving the puck when healthy. Murphy is a knock off prime Seabrook, and Keith is still Keith albeit a coming back down to earth one.

The Hawks problem is they don't have that guy that was on another planet in Keith any more and need three pairings each and every night instead of relying on just one Seabrook/Keith pairing like they did during the Cup run and had a prime hammer to compensate.

Can Boqvist take the next step? Perhaps.

The truth is, both the forwards and the defense are awful defensively. I don't know how many times I've seen both miss their assignments and/or puck-watch. The reason why this team has given up so many odd-man rushes is because the d-men pinch at the wrong times; and the forwards are utterly useless in covering for the D.

Maatta and Koko stepped up in the post-season this year -- and good on them -- but they were sub-par in the regular season. Murphy has been here for the last 3 years and really hasn't proven to be a legit top-4 defender. De Haan -- I'll give the benefit of the doubt and say it's too early to tell considering he was injured the majority of the year and has a small sample size, but he's looked anything but impressive and certainly isn't the fleetest of foot.

People dog Keith but I do think he's still good; I feel like he has to cover for Boqvist and that gets him in trouble, but I don't blame him, because Boqvist makes a ton of mistakes. Keith is not a #1 D-man anymore but, in my view, he is still top-4 on a defensively-deep team -- the problem obviously is, this is not a deep team, both up front and on the back-end.
 

KBIB

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I gotta disagree on Murphy.

He was just under 50% corsi last year at 54% of his zone starts in his own end. The year before he was at 47% with 61% in his own zone. He does his job and is a top four guy. He does too much and is running around half the time trying to cover for others, but he's solid.

Maatta and kookoo were great in the playoffs because they let the play come to them instead of over thinking things. Plenty of times during the regular season they, kookoo especially, overreacted to missed assignments by the forwards.
 

KBIB

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Murphy seems like a pairing right for Keith to balance each others weaknesses, but coach won't do that because he has to protect Bovquist, who I really regret playing in his 19yo season. He didn't get to do much that makes him any good, which is offense and attacking...he should study the shit out of Hughes game..
I agree.

Murphy and Keith is an ideal pairing capable of playing tough minutes.

And honestly, the jury is still out on Boqvist. Like you said, he really would have benefitted from not being rushed. The talent is there, that much is obvious, but there were games where he made some really bad decisions that he shouldn't have been making in the NHL. By Corsi he was the most protected player on defense without enough results to justify it.

And I don't think his game is similar to Hughes. Hughes is such a better, more fluid skater compared to Boqvist who isn't a slouch himself, that I don't think Boqvist can play that aggressive, attacking style.

Boqvist just needs to utilize his best asset, his vision. He sees plays better then everyone on the Hawks not named Kane and should focus more on being a play maker instead of a play driver.

But that's just my opinion.
 

Granada

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I gotta disagree on Murphy.

He was just under 50% corsi last year at 54% of his zone starts in his own end. The year before he was at 47% with 61% in his own zone. He does his job and is a top four guy. He does too much and is running around half the time trying to cover for others, but he's solid.

Maatta and kookoo were great in the playoffs because they let the play come to them instead of over thinking things. Plenty of times during the regular season they, kookoo especially, overreacted to missed assignments by the forwards.

Fair enough, although I'd warn against putting a lot of stock in Corsi. I've never been a fan of Corsi personally, it can be deceptive. Corsi doesn't really tell you anything about a player's actual defensive play (positioning, reads, coverage, if said player was up against an opposition's top line or 4th line, etc); it mostly focuses on how much time a player is on the ice for shots generated and shots against. I remember when Richard Panik had a higher Corsi than Duncan Keith, for example.
 

JimAKABlkhwks918

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Nothing the Hawks have on defense now can sniff the top 4 pairings they had when the team was good:

Keith/Seabs
Hammer/Oduya (on one leg)

were brilliant in 2015.

Keith/Seabs
Hammer/Oduya

in 2013

Keith/Seabs
Hammer/Campbell
Byfuglien

in 2010

Keith is showing his mileage, but is still a good player
Seabrook is completely unknown at this point
You wouldn't get a decent draft pick in return for anything on the Hawks D right now other than Keith.
 

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Fair enough, although I'd warn against putting a lot of stock in Corsi. I've never been a fan of Corsi personally, it can be deceptive. Corsi doesn't really tell you anything about a player's actual defensive play (positioning, reads, coverage, if said player was up against an opposition's top line or 4th line, etc); it mostly focuses on how much time a player is on the ice for shots generated and shots against. I remember when Richard Panik had a higher Corsi than Duncan Keith, for example.
Hockey's advanced stats in general are not up to where baseball is, but hockey has not had a night security guard at a pork and beans canning facility obsessing over statistics since 1977, so it will take time to refine them.
 

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There not as bad as people think.

Maatta isn't bad. CDH is good at moving the puck when healthy. Murphy is a knock off prime Seabrook, and Keith is still Keith albeit a coming back down to earth one.

The Hawks problem is they don't have that guy that was on another planet in Keith any more and need three pairings each and every night instead of relying on just one Seabrook/Keith pairing like they did during the Cup run and had a prime hammer to compensate.

Can Boqvist take the next step? Perhaps.
Yeah, they are.

Keith is still good...at times. He was abso-fucking-lutely brutal in the last game against Vegas--3 of the GA were completely on him bailing his position. He's good if his minutes and deployments are controlled like they should be for a late 30's D-man.--but any time he's asked to do too much (like babysit Boqvist), his game tanks and he leaves the goalies out to dry. Boqvist hasn't shown anything yet. Maata, DeHann, and Murph are consummate middle pairing guys who are nothing special (none of them could hold a candle to Prime Hjammer). KK is a consummate 7th D-man. Seabs is Cullimore at this point.

The reality is that the 'hawks have a 3-4 guy (Keith), 3 4's (Murph, DeHaan, and Maata), a dubious rookie (Boqvist), and 2 7's (4k and Seabs). That's not a good defense in any stretch of the imagination.
 

Probie2429

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Sounds like Crawford declined the Hawks' offer and will test FA. Most likely he will circle back to Stan when he realizes there aren't any better offers.
 

Granada

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This Crawford thing is starting to irk me -- if his plan is to test free agency, the least he could do is confirm it already and hopefully not wait until the last minute. The guy's had plenty of time to mull the offer.
 

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This Crawford thing is starting to irk me -- if his plan is to test free agency, the least he could do is confirm it already and hopefully not wait until the last minute. The guy's had plenty of time to mull the offer.

I say, let him walk. Best for him if can catch on with a contender, best for us that we don't win meaningless games. You can't rebuild a team until you are willing to pay the price to do so.....and that does NOT mean mediocre, it means being bad. That's 2003-04 Blackhawks bad. You need a few Top 5 picks.
 

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I say, let him walk. Best for him if can catch on with a contender, best for us that we don't win meaningless games. You can't rebuild a team until you are willing to pay the price to do so.....and that does NOT mean mediocre, it means being bad. That's 2003-04 Blackhawks bad. You need a few Top 5 picks.
I just heard something about the Hawks being interested in Matt Murray.
 

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Fair enough, although I'd warn against putting a lot of stock in Corsi. I've never been a fan of Corsi personally, it can be deceptive. Corsi doesn't really tell you anything about a player's actual defensive play (positioning, reads, coverage, if said player was up against an opposition's top line or 4th line, etc); it mostly focuses on how much time a player is on the ice for shots generated and shots against. I remember when Richard Panik had a higher Corsi than Duncan Keith, for example.
I like Murphy because he is one of the few actual physically athletic athletes on the Hawks and we need more of them.
 

hawkinmontreal

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This Crawford thing is starting to irk me -- if his plan is to test free agency, the least he could do is confirm it already and hopefully not wait until the last minute. The guy's had plenty of time to mull the offer.
Our GM has no balls, it’s a trying time and CC is playing it against him. He is holding on while searching for a better offer. I have alot of respect for CC, but come on make a decision for the betterment of the team.
 

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I read that they tried to negotiate with Murray but it didn't work out. If Crawford walks, they better find someone halfway decent out of the group of FA's out there. Someone they can afford, that is.

Subban sure isn't the answer. He stunk with Vegas and they have a way better defense than the Hawks have.
 

Granada

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I say, let him walk. Best for him if can catch on with a contender, best for us that we don't win meaningless games. You can't rebuild a team until you are willing to pay the price to do so.....and that does NOT mean mediocre, it means being bad. That's 2003-04 Blackhawks bad. You need a few Top 5 picks.

I still think we will need a serviceable goalie, even if the goal is to rebuild. You can't just throw throw out guys like Lankinen, Delia, or Subban every game -- especially with this team, you'll get lit up 10-2 every night. That said, if Crawford still can't decide, I agree -- you might just have to let him walk at this point. It's hard to believe that Crow's plan is to not test free agency at this point, so just let him.
 

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Just broke Crow will not be coming back per Stan. Stan said they like what they got with Delia and The Finn. Also Stan would like to bring back Subban
 

Granada

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"We have a couple goaltenders in Lankinen and Delia we really like".....guess that one year, 3.5 deal was for shits and giggles, lol.

Seriously though, I'm fine with Crow not returning -- injury prone and his age, etc. -- but it will tough seeing him in another uni. Had to be done though if he wasn't willing to return for 3.5 for one year -- that was a fair offer. I don't blame Crow though for not wanting to return because, in reality, this team is very far from ever contending; and a lot of solid teams are looking for goalies this upcoming year. I just hope the rumors about Colorado aren't true, but I fear they are -- that will suck seeing him in our division, especially on a team that is on the cusp of a Cup in my opinion.
 

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