The Ultimate " So Its 2016 Now" Thread

[JP Hochbaum]

http://www.bullpenbrian.com/2012/09/15/projecting-cubs-2015-rotation/

 

[Shawon0Meter]

Are we going to get any

[video=youtube;fbMKjLe-RFA]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fbMKjLe-RFA[/video]

 

[TC in Mississippi]

Fisch ain't smart enough to be right about anything. Let's remember that this year was originally supposed to be the last year of the rebuild. Pretty darn good rebuilding year for the Cubs.

First I love this thread. It should be added to the Doubting Theo website. Also, yeah 2016 was supposed to be the arrival year and it came a year early. You don't build teams in MLB to win a World Series as the playoffs are a crapshoot, you build them to get a bite at the apple and adjust to win a World Series. 2015 was the first bite and I expect 5-7 more shots at it.

 

[brett05]

First I love this thread. It should be added to the Doubting Theo website. Also, yeah 2016 was supposed to be the arrival year and it came a year early. You don't build teams in MLB to win a World Series as the playoffs are a crapshoot, you build them to get a bite at the apple and adjust to win a World Series. 2015 was the first bite and I expect 5-7 more shots at it.

Initially it was 2015. It only look like a year early because of the change Theo made to push it back a year.

 

[beckdawg]

Initially it was 2015. It only look like a year early because of the change Theo made to push it back a year.

Anyone who realistically expected 2015 was completely ignorant of player development. This isn't football or basketball where you can draft your way to a contender in 2-3 years. Most good college age players in the draft go in the first round. So, you get maybe 1 guy every draft who can contribute in 2-3 years. The rest are high schoolers who usually are 5 years from the majors. The only way people should have realistically expected 2015 is if the cubs spent a lot of money to acquire MLB ready players but from day one this is the opposite of what Theo's front office has done. I mean we've seen this with Almora. He was the first pick Theo/Jedd made and he's not even in AAA yet though he should be by the start of next year.

It's frankly quite impressive the speed at which they have done this because look at their two biggest signings. One was Edwin Jackson.... we all know how that went. The other was Lester who's only been here a year. Their trade for the most part have been masterful. Also consider for a moment what the cubs upper minors circa 2012 has given the teams of the past 3 years. I believe Shark and Cashner were both MLB players by that point so I'm not entirely sure they count. You're talking about Lake and....?

And just to be clear here, there's a difference between "hope" and "expectation." If you want to argue that all things going right cubs could have been where they are now I have no problem with that but my point is basically 2015 is as close as you get to best case scenario. Finding someone like Arrieta for nothing is basically unheard of. Having the success this team has with their top 10 picks is also pretty crazy.

 

[brett05]

Anyone who realistically expected 2015 was completely ignorant of player development. This isn't football or basketball where you can draft your way to a contender in 2-3 years. Most good college age players in the draft go in the first round. So, you get maybe 1 guy every draft who can contribute in 2-3 years. The rest are high schoolers who usually are 5 years from the majors. The only way people should have realistically expected 2015 is if the cubs spent a lot of money to acquire MLB ready players but from day one this is the opposite of what Theo's front office has done. I mean we've seen this with Almora. He was the first pick Theo/Jedd made and he's not even in AAA yet though he should be by the start of next year.

It's frankly quite impressive the speed at which they have done this because look at their two biggest signings. One was Edwin Jackson.... we all know how that went. The other was Lester who's only been here a year. Their trade for the most part have been masterful. Also consider for a moment what the cubs upper minors circa 2012 has given the teams of the past 3 years. I believe Shark and Cashner were both MLB players by that point so I'm not entirely sure they count. You're talking about Lake and....?

And just to be clear here, there's a difference between "hope" and "expectation." If you want to argue that all things going right cubs could have been where they are now I have no problem with that but my point is basically 2015 is as close as you get to best case scenario. Finding someone like Arrieta for nothing is basically unheard of. Having the success this team has with their top 10 picks is also pretty crazy.

Well this all came initially from management/ownership so....

 

[TC in Mississippi]

Initially it was 2015. It only look like a year early because of the change Theo made to push it back a year.

Yeah, not sure where you get that. Theo never specified years. This was a massive undertaking as the Cubs had never been a modern, functional organization. Different minor league teams had different philosophies and methods and prospects sometimes failed because of it. They also had 1/3 the scouting staff of the average MLB organization and their analytics department was nearly nonexistent. The big league club was saddled with terrible contracts and the minor league cupboard was bare. And oh by the way the bankruptcy court saddled them with a debt service that severely hampered payroll. Also two months in MLB changed its rules draft slotting and later its rules for international spending closing the two market inequities the FO had counted on. The fact that they fielded a team in 2015 that won 97 regular season games is a bit of a miracle and yes, well ahead of reasonable expectations.

 

[Bear Pride]

First I love this thread. It should be added to the Doubting Theo website. Also, yeah 2016 was supposed to be the arrival year and it came a year early. You don't build teams in MLB to win a World Series as the playoffs are a crapshoot, you build them to get a bite at the apple and adjust to win a World Series. 2015 was the first bite and I expect 5-7 more shots at it.

What's funny is all the people that criticized the rebuild saying that the Cubs needed pitching. It was clear to me that acquiring pitching was going to be the last step, and the Cubs would do that via FA'cy.

The only real move the Cubs made was Lester. They did try to sign Sheilds as well, but they really haven't gone "all in" on pitching yet. That's what will happen this off season. Why anyone would doubt Theo after this season is crazy, or just trolling.

 

[DJMoore_is_fat]

What's funny is all the people that criticized the rebuild saying that the Cubs needed pitching. It was clear to me that acquiring pitching was going to be the last step, and the Cubs would do that via FA'cy.

The only real move the Cubs made was Lester. They did try to sign Sheilds as well, but they really haven't gone "all in" on pitching yet. That's what will happen this off season. Why anyone would doubt Theo after this season is crazy, or just trolling.

That was me. I said Theo ruined the Cubs forever. I suck at fandom. I was angry and sad because things looked so bleak. The day Ron Santo died, I choked back tears. It was a horrible, horrible time to be a Cubs fan. I thought it was just another chapter in our cursed history.

Now it's a great time to be a Cubs fan, but I still wish Ron were here to see this. And to lose Mr. Cub, its just really sad. When Theo leads us to the WS, a lot of tears will be shed. A lot of all-time greats will never have gotten a chance to witness it.

I believe in Theo, Jed, and Joe Maddon's quest for sports' Holy Grail. A Cubs World Series Trophy.

Can you imagine?

It's gonna happen.

 

[brett05]

What's funny is all the people that criticized the rebuild saying that the Cubs needed pitching. It was clear to me that acquiring pitching was going to be the last step, and the Cubs would do that via FA'cy.

The only real move the Cubs made was Lester. They did try to sign Sheilds as well, but they really haven't gone "all in" on pitching yet. That's what will happen this off season. Why anyone would doubt Theo after this season is crazy, or just trolling.

And Sanchez, and Jackson. Theo has wanted pitching for some time in reality.

Can you show the posts where you said they'd be hittin gup the pitching after tanking three years for minor league hitters with early picks? I won't stop using air while I wait.