Theo Epstein Delivers Death Sentence to Chicago Cubs Future

[brett05]

And the Cubs situation is a totally different beast from the Cardinals, Red Sox, and Yankees, so we can't mention anything correlating between the two and how some think we should do what they do?

Now you can use this for yourself.

Sent from my SCH-I200 using Tapatalk

 

[DJMoore_is_fat]

The bottom line is there is no circumstance in which it's okay to not field a major league-quality ball club at the big league level. NEVER. It is totally unacceptable and completely disgusting and a betrayal of the fan base.

Many teams have maintained their farm systems while putting good products on the major league field. For a franchise that has suffered as much as we have, this is the final death blow in which we may never recover.

 

[dabynsky]

The bottom line is there is no circumstance in which it's okay to not field a major league-quality ball club at the big league level. NEVER. It is totally unacceptable and completely disgusting and a betrayal of the fan base.

Many teams have maintained their farm systems while putting good products on the major league field. For a franchise that has suffered as much as we have, this is the final death blow in which we may never recover.

Isn't a team what its record says they are? If that is true the Cubs have not fielded a major league quality ball club (67 or fewer wins) as many times as they have made the postseason in the two decades prior to Theo Epstein/Jed Hoyer regime. Lets not pretend like we haven't seen this quality of ball before hand. As soon as they make the postseason then all of this will be forgotten.

 

[Sunbiz1]

Isn't a team what its record says they are? If that is true the Cubs have not fielded a major league quality ball club (67 or fewer wins) as many times as they have made the postseason in the two decades prior to Theo Epstein/Jed Hoyer regime. Lets not pretend like we haven't seen this quality of ball before hand. As soon as they make the postseason then all of this will be forgotten.

How long have you been a fan of this team?.

 

[dabynsky]

How long have you been a fan of this team?.

Since '88, and I have seen far more 60 win teams than 90 win teams in that stretch.

 

[Sunbiz1]

Since '88, and I have seen far more 60 win teams than 90 win teams in that stretch.

That was the year the lights went on, also rained like hell that night...after a long drought.

Unfortunately for you, the drought is on-going.

And will continue until somebody figures out that the Cubs must be built to win games in cold weather/April/October. They must also be built to ignore fans, and subsequent pressure of failure.

Which I have serious doubts is being done at this time.

 

[dabynsky]

That was the year the lights went on, also rained like hell that night...after a long drought.

Unfortunately for you, the drought is on-going.

Yes the drought is still going on, but the reality is that last year's 66 win team was about as memorable as any one of the many other 60 win teams that has existed. I don't hear a particularly high amount of angst about '97 team that started the year 0-14 today. The fact is everyone will come back as soon as this team is playing meaningful games in September and October which hasn't happened in four years.

And will continue until somebody figures out that the Cubs must be built to win games in cold weather/April/October. They must also be built to ignore fans, and subsequent pressure of failure.

Which I have serious doubts is being done at this time.

The reality is the front office doesn't care what I or anyone else thinks about the way they built the team. I have faith based on previous track records of drafting and developing talent in Boston and San Deigo. That hardly guarantees success, but I like the signs that we have in some of the best position player talent since the days of Dallas Green in the minor leagues right now.

 

[CubbyBear2290]

Alright, I read OP, but I'm not going to read 6 or so pages of 20 posts, but this what I'm going to say.

1. Generally when you state how long you've been a fan, or when you started watching "Dese Chicago Cubs," you're more than likely an Idiot. A big one, at that.

2. Cubs are spending money, everywhere as a matter of fact, and not just in FA, and yes the Rickets are broke, because of everything the Cubs are spending money on. The Dominican baseball programs, amongst other. Building a new spring training facility, and renovating Wrigley, which should already be starting, if it weren't for the idiot rooftops who are making money off of a product that isn't theirs, and good old Rahm. So to say the Cubs aren't spending money is flat wrong. They are just spending it everywhere, like most great organizations do. So to put it simply, the Cubs organization as a whole were in shambles from the stadium, to outdated facilities (everywhere), to lack of minor league spending. It was needed.

3. No future, really? C'mon now the Cubs have what is considered to be pretty much a top 5 consensus system, that is only getting better, because the Cubs have one of the few organizations in sports that have 3 of the brightest younger minds in their respective fields in Hoyer, McLeod, and of Epstein. They know what they are doing. In 2 FREAKING seasons they've gone all the way up from bottom 5 to top 5. Of course we as fans should know (I'd hope) that all these prospects aren't all going to be great players. But it's nice to have the potential there. I will be the first to admit I'm frustrated as well, but I'm also fairly certain that we as fans need to be patient. These guys are just entering the 3rd season together. The Cubs are on the right track and doing this thing right.

4. The Cubs will eventually spend on big time free agents. Hell there's even a chance we see a big name added to the team this off-season via trade or FA. Who is it? I have not the slightest clue. But I'm going to wait and see how it plays out. As I'm fairly certain this is the only Front office that I truly trust who I have seen run the Cubs. Hell we as fans could have been seeing it earlier if the Cubs had the renovations started and fan would have been coming to see an already started remodel of the Wrigley this upcoming season.

5. Lastly, stop with the chicken little act. It's a needed process the Cubs are going through and I have no problem with them doing this. Patience is a virtue and honestly as much stock as we put into the 100+ year curse as fans, who cares? These aren't the same players, same team or same Front Office. Maybe it's time we as fans progress and trust what we are seeing. Even though there is not guarantee of a championship, as there are 29 other teams that are getting paid millions of dollars to field a winner. If you do not trust the process or whats being done, leave the fandom, get rid of the Cubby blue, lose address to Wrigley, don't jump on Cubs.com, and flat out find another team to root for. I'm tired of the idiocy that comes along with so many of the Chicago teams, because of this "i'm a long time fan" mentality. Games progress, teams progress, the fronts offices and league offices progress. Maybe it's time the fans start progressing with all of this.

 

[DJMoore_is_fat]

Alright, I read OP, but I'm not going to read 6 or so pages of 20 posts, but this what I'm going to say.

1. Generally when you state how long you've been a fan, or when you started watching "Dese Chicago Cubs," you're more than likely an Idiot. A big one, at that.

2. Cubs are spending money, everywhere as a matter of fact, and not just in FA, and yes the Rickets are broke, because of everything the Cubs are spending money on. The Dominican baseball programs, amongst other. Building a new spring training facility, and renovating Wrigley, which should already be starting, if it weren't for the idiot rooftops who are making money off of a product that isn't theirs, and good old Rahm. So to say the Cubs aren't spending money is flat wrong. They are just spending it everywhere, like most great organizations do. So to put it simply, the Cubs organization as a whole were in shambles from the stadium, to outdated facilities (everywhere), to lack of minor league spending. It was needed.

3. No future, really? C'mon now the Cubs have what is considered to be pretty much a top 5 consensus system, that is only getting better, because the Cubs have one of the few organizations in sports that have 3 of the brightest younger minds in their respective fields in Hoyer, McLeod, and of Epstein. They know what they are doing. In 2 FREAKING seasons they've gone all the way up from bottom 5 to top 5. Of course we as fans should know (I'd hope) that all these prospects aren't all going to be great players. But it's nice to have the potential there. I will be the first to admit I'm frustrated as well, but I'm also fairly certain that we as fans need to be patient. These guys are just entering the 3rd season together. The Cubs are on the right track and doing this thing right.

4. The Cubs will eventually spend on big time free agents. Hell there's even a chance we see a big name added to the team this off-season via trade or FA. Who is it? I have not the slightest clue. But I'm going to wait and see how it plays out. As I'm fairly certain this is the only Front office that I truly trust who I have seen run the Cubs. Hell we as fans could have been seeing it earlier if the Cubs had the renovations started and fan would have been coming to see an already started remodel of the Wrigley this upcoming season.

5. Lastly, stop with the chicken little act. It's a needed process the Cubs are going through and I have no problem with them doing this. Patience is a virtue and honestly as much stock as we put into the 100+ year curse as fans, who cares? These aren't the same players, same team or same Front Office. Maybe it's time we as fans progress and trust what we are seeing. Even though there is not guarantee of a championship, as there are 29 other teams that are getting paid millions of dollars to field a winner. If you do not trust the process or whats being done, leave the fandom, get rid of the Cubby blue, lose address to Wrigley, don't jump on Cubs.com, and flat out find another team to root for. I'm tired of the idiocy that comes along with so many of the Chicago teams, because of this "i'm a long time fan" mentality. Games progress, teams progress, the fronts offices and league offices progress. Maybe it's time the fans start progressing with all of this.

Hilarious head-in-sand ostrich post. You reference the Cubs spending money on Wrigley renovations -- but they haven't even started yet. Once they begin, it will take, what, five years? So we're looking at 2018 before we have a renovated stadium? If thats what we're waiting on, we're in big trouble.

Then, in classic ostrich fan form, you reference the beacon of Cubs hope: The Farm System. Our farm system doesn't have A SINGLE TOP-10 PROSPECT BY ALL ACCOUNTS. Do you not realize that a top-5 farm system doesn't mean anything? Why you think that automatically equates to a Dynasty is beyond me. Furthermore, pitching wins World Series -- not hitting. And our top prospects are not pitchers. But you make no mention of this.

Then....my favorite line....the Cubs will eventually spend on big time FA's. How the hell do you know? Are you friends with Theo? Did Jed tell you that? You don't know shit. Quite frankly, you're a dumb apologist homer who is maladjusted to life and living in a fantasy world.

 

[dabynsky]

Then, in classic ostrich fan form, you reference the beacon of Cubs hope: The Farm System. Our farm system doesn't have A SINGLE TOP-10 PROSPECT BY ALL ACCOUNTS. Do you not realize that a top-5 farm system doesn't mean anything? Why you think that automatically equates to a Dynasty is beyond me. Furthermore, pitching wins World Series -- not hitting. And our top prospects are not pitchers. But you make no mention of this.

Bolded is flat out untrue at this point. I am sure there will be more added to this list but according to Jason Parks the Cubs have three prospects that are at worst top 15 and most likely top 10 prospects in baseball. Baez was the tenth best prospect on Baseball America's midseason top 50 as well.

 

[nwfisch]

Bolded is flat out untrue at this point. I am sure there will be more added to this list but according to Jason Parks the Cubs have three prospects that are at worst top 15 and most likely top 10 prospects in baseball. Baez was the tenth best prospect on Baseball America's midseason top 50 as well.

The parade will be ready in 2031................................

 

[dabynsky]

The parade will be ready in 2031................................

[video=youtube;23kFiqFiOlA]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=23kFiqFiOlA[/video]

 

[Parade_Rain]

That was the year the lights went on, also rained like hell that night...after a long drought.

Unfortunately for you, the drought is on-going.

And will continue until somebody figures out that the Cubs must be built to win games in cold weather/April/October. They must also be built to ignore fans, and subsequent pressure of failure.

Which I have serious doubts is being done at this time.

A retractable roof for the inclimate weather of April/early May and September/October would be nice. This is one of the many reasons why I have not been fond of the Cubs remaining in Wrigley.

 

[Parade_Rain]

Alright, I read OP, but I'm not going to read 6 or so pages of 20 posts, but this what I'm going to say.

1. Generally when you state how long you've been a fan, or when you started watching "Dese Chicago Cubs," you're more than likely an Idiot. A big one, at that.

This has to be one of the strangest comments I have ever read on the internet and I've been on the internet since Al Gore invented it.

 

[CubbyBear2290]

Hilarious head-in-sand ostrich post. You reference the Cubs spending money on Wrigley renovations -- but they haven't even started yet. Once they begin, it will take, what, five years? So we're looking at 2018 before we have a renovated stadium? If thats what we're waiting on, we're in big trouble.

Then, in classic ostrich fan form, you reference the beacon of Cubs hope: The Farm System. Our farm system doesn't have A SINGLE TOP-10 PROSPECT BY ALL ACCOUNTS. Do you not realize that a top-5 farm system doesn't mean anything? Why you think that automatically equates to a Dynasty is beyond me. Furthermore, pitching wins World Series -- not hitting. And our top prospects are not pitchers. But you make no mention of this.

Then....my favorite line....the Cubs will eventually spend on big time FA's. How the hell do you know? Are you friends with Theo? Did Jed tell you that? You don't know shit. Quite frankly, you're a dumb apologist homer who is maladjusted to life and living in a fantasy world.

I have my head in the sand? If thats the way you feel, then fine. We also know that the Chicago Cubs front office wants to win. The fact you're so cynical is actually funny to me.

But yes I realize that the chicago cubs system means nothing. Then again neither did spending big 6 years ago. When the cubs lost what was it 6 straight playoff games in 2 seasons, under the reign of Hendry and Sweet Lou, yah that was fun.....

They may have a top 10 prospect, in Baez or Bryant.....But the 2014 top 100 lists haven't really been released to my knowledge. Then again you do have a point pitching wins a lot, much like defense and hitting. All 3 facets are needed. But lets take a look at the 2 teams in the world series. The Red Sox (#1) and the Cardinals (#8) yah who cares about system when 1 can throw money at all problems because, you know the Cards payed Pujols.

Having a farm system allows to let guys go get paid for past performances, and allows to pay younger players reasonable rates and maintain a competitive team season in and season out. The Cubs are aiming at that while be able to pay for the big time free agent occasionally. Unlike the Rays, but much like the Red Sox. You know the team that just won the world series? The one that had 13 or 14 player Theo Epstein drafted/signed in his tenure there?

IDK when the Cubs will spend, but I know eventually they could/will. I may be a dumb apologist homer, but I'd rather be that and trust the same blue print that 2 of the most successful and to another stretch 4 of the most successful franchises of the past 10-15 seasons use. But yah, keep thinking throwing money at FA that are 30+ is going to win everything, because the Dodgers have won a WS recently, or the Angels, and the Yankees have also.

The other portion of building a farm system is to trade for the player that some players that fit your organizational ideas and make them even further competitive. Much like the Cards are targeting a Tulo or even Castro because they have the excess resources to do so.

It's not guaranteed to work completely by building internally, or by completely just by throwing money at it. It's always a combo of the 2. But I have no problem with how the cubs are going about this. Especially with the Cubs being connected to Tanaka and could be very well connected to the Grandy man.

So, they are willing to spend possibly this off-season. But hey we all have our own views.

 

[Jntg4]

I have my head in the sand? If thats the way you feel, then fine. We also know that the Chicago Cubs front office wants to win. The fact you're so cynical is actually funny to me.

But yes I realize that the chicago cubs system means nothing. Then again neither did spending big 6 years ago. When the cubs lost what was it 6 straight playoff games in 2 seasons, under the reign of Hendry and Sweet Lou, yah that was fun.....

They may have a top 10 prospect, in Baez or Bryant.....But the 2014 top 100 lists haven't really been released to my knowledge. Then again you do have a point pitching wins a lot, much like defense and hitting. All 3 facets are needed. But lets take a look at the 2 teams in the world series. The Red Sox (#1) and the Cardinals (#8) yah who cares about system when 1 can throw money at all problems because, you know the Cards payed Pujols.

Having a farm system allows to let guys go get paid for past performances, and allows to pay younger players reasonable rates and maintain a competitive team season in and season out. The Cubs are aiming at that while be able to pay for the big time free agent occasionally. Unlike the Rays, but much like the Red Sox. You know the team that just won the world series? The one that had 13 or 14 player Theo Epstein drafted/signed in his tenure there?

IDK when the Cubs will spend, but I know eventually they could/will. I may be a dumb apologist homer, but I'd rather be that and trust the same blue print that 2 of the most successful and to another stretch 4 of the most successful franchises of the past 10-15 seasons use. But yah, keep thinking throwing money at FA that are 30+ is going to win everything, because the Dodgers have won a WS recently, or the Angels, and the Yankees have also.

The other portion of building a farm system is to trade for the player that some players that fit your organizational ideas and make them even further competitive. Much like the Cards are targeting a Tulo or even Castro because they have the excess resources to do so.

It's not guaranteed to work completely by building internally, or by completely just by throwing money at it. It's always a combo of the 2. But I have no problem with how the cubs are going about this. Especially with the Cubs being connected to Tanaka and could be very well connected to the Grandy man.

So, they are willing to spend possibly this off-season. But hey we all have our own views.

It isn't that they may have a top ten prospect, it's that they in almost all certainty have at least one. So his comment on not having a single Top-ten prospect or anything even close to it seems odd to me.