Thibs: Butler to start at SG

[houheffna]

He's a wing and can defend both 2's and 3's. What's the problem? Don't get so fixed up on a player being at a certain position. It doesn't always work that way.

Especially in today's NBA...Butler is a swingman...they grow them on trees, no need to pigeon-hole him into one position.

 

[Bear Pride]

The difference is that now the Bulls run a 2G on the court that's 6'7" and is a lockdown defender, and match him up on the opposing team's starting 2G. This is a matchup advantage for the Bulls, and allows the Bulls to start Deng and still bring some scoring off the bench.

 

[houheffna]

I don't think Butler is a lockdown defender yet, nor do I think his bettering his jumpshot makes the Bulls unstoppable. If he can create his own shot, they become a tougher team to beat. But people seriously underestimate the rest of the league with those statements.

 

[Axl Rose]

I don't think Butler is a lockdown defender yet

did you watch him last year? he was pretty good on defense...he made guys like kobe and melo struggle bad and did a damn good job on lebron...bout the best you can play bron 1 on 1

i'd say heres right there at being elite on defense

but a agree with the 2nd part i dont think jimmy with a improved shot gets us over the hump...we need a 2nd shot creator plain and simple...and even then its still no guarantee

 

[FrenchieBully]

did you watch him last year? he was pretty good on defense...he made guys like kobe and melo struggle bad and did a damn good job on lebron...bout the best you can play bron 1 on 1

Yep, it's always Bosh that plays like a Superstar against us. Loozer and Vaj can't stop him.

 

[RoseMVP1]

Butler held LeBron to 42% in the playoff series. Enough said.

 

[Crystallas]

I think it's fair to call Butler a potential lock-down defender(only potential, because there are still match-ups he hasn't mastered yet). Especially when the best counterarguments compare his defensive performances against the elite tier.

 

[RC_Skinny22]

[video=youtube;LHwMkn6tvnE]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LHwMkn6tvnE&hd=1[/video]

 

[RC_Skinny22]

[video=youtube;sPxUErecR4k]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sPxUErecR4k&hd=1[/video]

 

[houheffna]

did you watch him last year? he was pretty good on defense...he made guys like kobe and melo struggle bad and did a damn good job on lebron...bout the best you can play bron 1 on 1

i'd say heres right there at being elite on defense

but a agree with the 2nd part i dont think jimmy with a improved shot gets us over the hump...we need a 2nd shot creator plain and simple...and even then its still no guarantee

I thought he was a very good defender, just not on that level yet.

We will agree to disagree on Butler's defense. I don't know of any players who walked into the league as lockdown defenders. You have to learn how to lockdown opponents, tricks of the trade. Rodman, Jordan, Pippen, Payton...does boys had to learn how to guard on the perimeter. Doesn't happen overnight.

 

[clonetrooper264]

I thought he was a very good defender, just not on that level yet.

We will agree to disagree on Butler's defense. I don't know of any players who walked into the league as lockdown defenders. You have to learn how to lockdown opponents, tricks of the trade. Rodman, Jordan, Pippen, Payton...does boys had to learn how to guard on the perimeter. Doesn't happen overnight.

Perhaps you could make the argument that Tony Allen and Avery Bradley kind of walked in as "lockdown" defenders, but even then they took a couple years to really get to that status. I think a fair statement is that Butler is on his way to being a lockdown defender. Undeniably he's at least very good.

 

[czman]

Perhaps you could make the argument that Tony Allen and Avery Bradley kind of walked in as "lockdown" defenders, but even then they took a couple years to really get to that status. I think a fair statement is that Butler is on his way to being a lockdown defender. Undeniably he's at least very good.

By just about all advanced stats Butler was about the best defender at the SG position in basketball. At the SF he was slightly better than average. At SG he was elite.

 

[clonetrooper264]

By just about all advanced stats Butler was about the best defender at the SG position in basketball. At the SF he was slightly better than average. At SG he was elite.

That's interesting, but I'd rather hold out and see him guarding every elite scoring wing for a full season before I say he's the best defender at the SG position.

 

[Bear Pride]

did you watch him last year? he was pretty good on defense...he made guys like kobe and melo struggle bad and did a damn good job on lebron...bout the best you can play bron 1 on 1

i'd say heres right there at being elite on defense

but a agree with the 2nd part i dont think jimmy with a improved shot gets us over the hump...we need a 2nd shot creator plain and simple...and even then its still no guarantee

I thought Leonard did a very nice job on LJ as well. Jimmy being a lockdown defender at 2G means he doesn't have to be that 2nd shot creator. However, the Bulls are making an effort to spread the floor. With the two 3 pt shooting rooks as well as Dun, and then add DRose again, I think Jimmy will be able to slash to the basket a little more, helping a little bit offensively.

Imo, the Bulls need more scoring and shot creation from a big. And Imo, it would be best to replace either Boozer or Deng with someone that can take the ball to the rim against tough defenses. This will keep guys like LJ from checking DRose at the end of games. This will open up the wings and the 3 pt shooters as well.

 

[Daa Bearrs]

My eye test tells me that Jimmy Butler is currently the best man to man defender on the team. I don't know about help defense and I haven't looked at advanced stats, but again my eyes tell me he is already the best man to man defender on the team.

As far as everyone being so concerned about a 2nd shot creator, while I empathize with your concerns, whatever happened to good ol' fashion ball movement and unselfish play? We have one of the best scorers in the league (Rose) whose job is also to set up his teammates. On top of that, all of the players on this squad are good passers. Noah and Boozer in particular are great passers for being bigs. We also have an elite coach who will/should design the best offensive sets, and I expect Rose to continue to improve as a player maker.

But can we at least all agree that Butler at the 2 is far better than Keith Bogans and the corpse of RIP Hamilton?

EDIT - I think Jimmy's ceiling is prime Ron Artest (without the crazy)

 

[Bear Pride]

I thought he was a very good defender, just not on that level yet.

We will agree to disagree on Butler's defense. I don't know of any players who walked into the league as lockdown defenders. You have to learn how to lockdown opponents, tricks of the trade. Rodman, Jordan, Pippen, Payton...does boys had to learn how to guard on the perimeter. Doesn't happen overnight.

Jimmy was a lockdown defender in college. He was drafted with Thibbs in mind for his defense. And he has now played two years with one of the best defenses in the NBA. He's been pretty good defensively for a while, and he is still getting better. Look for Snell to be similar as well.

Scouts rave about Butler's basketball IQ. and his intangibles, but those alone aren't what earned him the Portsmouth Invitational's MVP award. Butler's best trait is his defensive ability, which he used to lock down some of the Big East's best scorers as a junior and senior. He can score inside and outside, and is a solid rebounder and decent passer

http://mynorthwest.stats.com/nbadraft/players.asp?id=81185&name=Jimmy_Butler

 

[czman]

This will either be Butler's break out season or the season most people find him lacking. 3rd season is where a lot of guys mature. I think most talk at this point is a bit premature.

Some will look at his numbers and say too small a sample size.

Others will not even look.

Others will will point to them as a basis for reasonable conclusions.

If people cannot even agree on a metrics there is little change people will have any ability to have an intelligent conversation. I suspect we will all know a lot more at the beginning of next season.

 

[ChiSoxCity]

This will either be Butler's break out season or the season most people find him lacking. 3rd season is where a lot of guys mature. I think most talk at this point is a bit premature.

Some will look at his numbers and say too small a sample size.

Others will not even look.

Others will will point to them as a basis for reasonable conclusions.

If people cannot even agree on a metrics there is little change people will have any ability to have an intelligent conversation. I suspect we will all know a lot more at the beginning of next season.

So I think we can all agree that Butler is the key to the 2013/14 campaign. If he developes good chemistry with Rose and can provide some offense, the Bulls should dominate the eastern conference, including and especially Miami. Miami is not a great regular season team anyway, so it should getting the #1 overall seed should not be hard for Chicago.

 

[houheffna]

I hope you are all right...I hope Butler becomes Scottie Pippen...he won't...but I hope he does. Looking forward to it, I really like Butler...he actually did very well in the summer league last year, kind of like Teague did this year...just sayin'

 

[houheffna]

So I think we can all agree that Butler is the key to the 2013/14 campaign. If he developes good chemistry with Rose and can provide some offense, the Bulls should dominate the eastern conference, including and especially Miami. Miami is not a great regular season team anyway, so it should getting the #1 overall seed should not be hard for Chicago.

Didn't Miami go on a 27 game winning streak? I think that constitutes a great regular season team.