Update- Santo in! 15 of 16 votes

[Jntg4]

Point well taken, but didn't you say a page up that you didn't read the posts? My apologies.

I never said it wasn't, but I never said it was either.

I listed why and those are more then likely the same reasons he wasn't in earlier.
or how it is relevant considering that he is already in.
It's not anymore.

Good post!

Those "reasons" don't equate to not deserving to get in, at least in my honest and unbiased opinion (wasn't alive when he played, so I have no bias or special feelings for him, just another player who deserved the Hall).

 

[FirstTimer]

No I did not say that. I said you look at other things to see if a guy gets in which is where I showed a lack of production away from a hitters park like Wrigley Field (previously provided a link that showed that to be true), his lack of playoff numbers (he has none), I mentioned that he was not considered a clutch player (I really only have comments from others and I have no way to prove he was or wasn't since he retired when I was 1), he was a bad teammate (called at least one guy out in public and accounts are he was not a nice player), bad to the media (it really shouldn't matter, but Eddie Murray was awful to the media and it did not hurt him)

LOL at those being your reasons as to why Santo doesn't belong.

What a weak stack of bullshit.

Santo has been on it once.

False. The VC are still technically "ballots"

Keep failing ass clown.

Baines has never had the rules changed for him.

LOL at this.

The rule change that helped Santo, could have helped Baines..except no one gave two shits about Baines and the HOF. So he was allowed to drift away.

To say a case can't be made for Harold being a Hall of Famer is a lack of baseball knowledge

It absolutely is not.

You making the case for him is laughable.

In fact, you have yet to do so....because there is no case.

 

[FirstTimer]

The Cubs legend and third baseman was named on 15 of the 16 ballots.

Ron Santo elected to Hall of Fame by Veterans Committee


Come at me bro

 

[FirstTimer]

Pretty funny thread.

brett says something completely false. Goes away.

Doesn't understand a stat. Goes away.

Lather rinse repeat.

 

[FirstTimer]

What's OPS+?

Derp derp derp

 

[Rice Cube]

What's OPS+?

Derp derp derp

That was pretty bad... :lol:

I think these special committees to re-evaluate players are important because evaluation systems evolve over time and hopefully get better. Santo's stats were compared to those of his contemporaries (ergo OPS+) and they were excellent.

The thing is that you hope nobody ever has to be elected by special committee, but in this case the ends did justify the questionable means. They did rig the crap out of the system, but when the previous system was biased and misinformed, what else can you do?

 

[FirstTimer]

That was pretty bad... :lol:

I think these special committees to re-evaluate players are important because evaluation systems evolve over time and hopefully get better. Santo's stats were compared to those of his contemporaries (ergo OPS+) and they were excellent.

The thing is that you hope nobody ever has to be elected by special committee, but in this case the ends did justify the questionable means. They did rig the crap out of the system, but when the previous system was biased and misinformed, what else can you do?

It's not even just against Santo's contemporaries but every player who played the position across every era. Santo falls right in the middle by most evaluations. He's not even a fringe 3B candidate.

The old system was obviously stupid and flawed. Santo's exclusions shows that Hell, same with Andre Dawson's.

Meanwhile, brett wants to state that Harold Baines has a case, but doesn't know what OPS+ is and is basing Santo's "not belonging" around Santo not hitting well away from home(which other HOF'ers have done) and Santo being a dickhead. Does Santo being a jerk mean he should be in the HOF even though numbers dictate it? No. A reason for him not being in doesn't mean it's a valid explanation or even sensible in a baseball sense.

I'm not surprised brett is the one making these nonsensical arguments, but it's no less annoying or flat out wrong minded.

 

[brett05]

Those "reasons" don't equate to not deserving to get in, at least in my honest and unbiased opinion (wasn't alive when he played, so I have no bias or special feelings for him, just another player who deserved the Hall).

If you have no bias bleeding Cubbie Blue then I have none as well since I was only alive fir his lone year on the Sox. His numbers are good but not enough and his ancillaries just don't exist

 

[brett05]

Pretty funny thread.

brett says something completely false. Goes away.

Doesn't understand a stat. Goes away.

Lather rinse repeat.

Sorry FT, you misread everything I can't comment with you any more

 

[Jntg4]

If you have no bias bleeding Cubbie Blue then I have none as well since I was only alive fir his lone year on the Sox. His numbers are good but not enough and his ancillaries just don't exist

1. Don't use words that I have to look up in a dictionary, it's just not cool brah.

2. And his numbers are good enough, as his OPS+ and Gold Gloves show, and I don't care about the ancillaries, he's in by performance alone (should be anyway), not contributions to other organizations.

 

[FirstTimer]

Sorry FT, you misread everything I can't comment with you any more

Lulz at this. You got completely kicked around in this thread.

Santo didn't hit well away from Wrigley....

No idea what OPS+ is...

Santo was mean...

Derp derp derp

Quit trying to run away.

 

[brett05]

1. Don't use words that I have to look up in a dictionary, it's just not cool brah.

2. And his numbers are good enough, as his OPS+ and Gold Gloves show, and I don't care about the ancillaries, he's in by performance alone (should be anyway), not contributions to other organizations.

1. Read more.

2. I was speaking just baseball but since you brought it up it was those ancillaries of non baseball organizations that got him in this time around

 

[Jntg4]

1. Read more.

2. I was speaking just baseball but since you brought it up it was those ancillaries of non baseball organizations that got him in this time around

Don't care how he got in, he deserved to get in from his play. If it took his death and charitable works to get him in, then at least they finally made the right decision. Bad rationale, but good decision-making.

 

[brett05]

Don't care how he got in, he deserved to get in from his play. If it took his death and charitable works to get him in, then at least they finally made the right decision. Bad rationale, but good decision-making.

And how is that unbiased?

 

[Jntg4]

And how is that unbiased?

It's unbiased because I believe he should have made it in by number alone, and that is not bias. I don't care how it happened, just that it happened. Their rationale doesn't have to be right for the decision to be right.

 

[FirstTimer]

Derp derp derp

 

[Uman85]

Ron Santo's election into Hall of Fame is shamefully late - ESPN Chicago

 

[brett05]

Harold is in

 

[fatbeard]

Harold is in

Me: "You know, it's possible brett is not as small and petty as he comes off. I should give him the benefit of the doubt more often."

You: "Hold my beer, gotta necro a seven year old thread to crow over my Harold Baines for the HOF vindication."

 

[anotheridiot]

They should name that wing after Santo.