WCSF - 5/23 Game4: Blackhawks (1) vs. (2) Wings 8:00ET. NBCS

LordKOTL

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Agreed Ton</p>


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And Pete, while I agree that there needs to be more verbalization about the shortcomings in officating, The time and place to do it is not by the captain in a game.</p>


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Personally, I'd like to see Q (or Bowman) take out his checkbook, write a blank check to the NHL, and them proceed to rip the living shit out of them at a presser.  But with Toews' comments it just means he's going to get no slack whatsoever and the officialls will be looking to treat him like Lysiak.</p>
 

BigPete

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<blockquote class="ipsBlockquote" data-author="The Canadian Dreamalchuk" data-cid="197271" data-time="1369426401">
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He has been doing a lot of that this series. Funny no one talks about that. </p>
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I think he is pretty pissed that he isn't playing with Sharp or Hossa.  Additionally, I think the Wings have done a great job of eliminating him and Toews with all their illegal shenanigans and the closing of passing lanes.</p>


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The fact that he has been double shifted more than anyone else and at times placed with makeshift 4th lines is annoying him too.</p>


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I bet anyone a hundo that once Q leaves, Kaner will open up about how maddening all the lineup changes were.</p>
 

BigPete

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<blockquote class="ipsBlockquote" data-author="LordKOTL" data-cid="197272" data-time="1369426478">
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Agreed Ton</p>


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And Pete, while I agree that there needs to be more verbalization about the shortcomings in officating, The time and place to do it is not by the captain in a game.</p>


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Personally, I'd like to see Q (or Bowman) take out his checkbook, write a blank check to the NHL, and them proceed to rip the living shit out of them at a presser.  But with Toews' comments it just means he's going to get no slack whatsoever and the officialls will be looking to treat him like Lysiak.</p>
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I beg to differ.  That is 80% of the responsibilities bestowed on a Captain in-game.  The As and Cs are supposed to talk to the refs to get clarification and argue bad calls.  That is how you 'win their favor' and 'earn' make-up calls.</p>
 

Ton

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<blockquote class="ipsBlockquote" data-author="BigPete" data-cid="197277" data-time="1369426814">
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I beg to differ.  That is 80% of the responsibilities bestowed on a Captain in-game.  The As and Cs are supposed to talk to the refs to get clarification and argue bad calls.  That is how you 'win their favor' and 'earn' make-up calls.</p>
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Then by that standard, Toews has failed miserably.</p>
 

supraman

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<blockquote class="ipsBlockquote" data-author="BigPete" data-cid="197266" data-time="1369426179">
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Oh wow.  Holy conjecture.  You don't even know him, how could come out with those notions?</p>


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Here are the facts: He is getting hacked, hooked, held, and slashed like no other captain I have ever seen.  The refs are ignoring the vast majority of those actions and only calling his retaliatory actions to the offender.  While that happens a lot in the NHL and everyone expects it, it doesn't make it right.  If the ref saw him slash Zetterberg, then he must have seen him holding his stick less than a second before.</p>


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This has nothing to do with being a homer, I have always had a problem with the idea that the retaliation should be called.  For the record, I do not enjoy when some of our guys play like hacks.  Bolland certainly has walked the line before and I am not a big fan of it.  Cheap play is just that...cheap, no matter who does it.</p>


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The league took major steps to eliminate the obstruction from the game, but every so often you get a crew who doesn't call it or only calls it one way.  This crew has been calling it against Toews for 4 games now.  I don't blame him for bitching about it.  I wish more players/coaches/GMs/owners were honest about the failures of the refs and league officials.  Maybe it would keep them more honest.</p>
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The keywords are "I'm guessing"</p>


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I don't care that he's being hacked and slashed and all that happy shit. Its happened since his second year. Why is he only whining about it now. This isn't new to him, its old hat. So maybe just maybe there is something wrong in his personal life that is affecting his game</p>
 

BigPete

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<blockquote class="ipsBlockquote" data-author="Supra" data-cid="197281" data-time="1369427291">
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The keywords are "I'm guessing"</p>


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I don't care that he's being hacked and slashed and all that happy shit. Its happened since his second year. Why is he only whining about it now. This isn't new to him, its old hat. So maybe just maybe there is something wrong in his personal life that is affecting his game</p>
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It's always a possibility.  I'll jump on my unicorn and fly up to Chicago to ask him.  Give me 5 minutes, I'll be right back.</p>
 

BigPete

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<blockquote class="ipsBlockquote" data-author="Ton DeFrancesco" data-cid="197280" data-time="1369427059">
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Then by that standard, Toews has failed miserably.</p>
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I guess I can't deny that, lol.  Why isn't Q sending one of the As to do the talking when he sees JT get red faced at a ref?</p>
 

Ashor-redtribe

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<blockquote class="ipsBlockquote" data-author="Supra" data-cid="197281" data-time="1369427291">
<div>


The keywords are "I'm guessing"</p>


 </p>


I don't care that he's being hacked and slashed and all that happy shit. Its happened since his second year. Why is he only whining about it now. This isn't new to him, its old hat. So maybe just maybe there is something wrong in his personal life that is affecting his game</p>
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He needs to get laid.... </p>
 

supraman

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<blockquote class="ipsBlockquote" data-author="BigPete" data-cid="197283" data-time="1369427651">
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It's always a possibility.  I'll jump on my unicorn and fly up to Chicago to ask him.  Give me 5 minutes, I'll be right back.</p>
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Then you explain without using the hacked and slashed excuse because again since his 2nd year in the league it has happened to him every playoff game and he wasn't a pussy about it until this year.</p>
 

Pez68

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Maybe, just maybe, Toews is pissed off at the coaching staff? From what I understand, he's good friends with Stalberg.. Maybe the entire team is frustrated with the idiocy going on?</p>
 

Ashor-redtribe

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<blockquote class="ipsBlockquote" data-author="BigPete" data-cid="197284" data-time="1369427713">
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I guess I can't deny that, lol.  Why isn't Q sending one of the As to do the talking when he sees JT get red faced at a ref?</p>
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Again, you can look, tell, about Toews all you want, but this is not his first year in the playoffs, if he were producing the past two years in the playoffs, I would not be so harsh on the kid, but come on you can't sit here and tell me that he has shown up in the playoffs after winning the cup, aside from the one shot that took us into overtime two years ago. Im sorry but 6.75 mill or what ever it is, should be more usefull in the playoffs at the end of the day, he can ***** all he wants, talk to his team all he wants, but he has not put the puck in the net when asked too. DO not be a hommer about this, is obvious, I am sick and tired of hommers defending these players when they don't deserve it making that much money and just because they have the best record thinking they should breeze in the playoffs and and get all the calls. I can tell you why he is PISSED, and acting like a 5 year old.....cause he is frustrated he has done jack shit all post season.</p>


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on a better note.....</p>


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<span style="font-size:12px;"><span style="font-size:18px;">I was so worried after losing games two and three, but after last nights loss....something is telling me were in for an epic comeback......</span></span></p>
 

the canadian dream

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<blockquote class="ipsBlockquote" data-author="BigPete" data-cid="197276" data-time="1369426710">
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I think he is pretty pissed that he isn't playing with Sharp or Hossa.  Additionally, I think the Wings have done a great job of eliminating him and Toews with all their illegal shenanigans and the closing of passing lanes.</p>


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The fact that he has been double shifted more than anyone else and at times placed with makeshift 4th lines is annoying him too.</p>


 </p>


I bet anyone a hundo that once Q leaves, Kaner will open up about how maddening all the lineup changes were.</p>
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I'll give Q shit when Q deserves shit and he deserves his fair share. But Kane floating isn't on the coach and if its a case of Kane giving up then that doesn't say much about Kane does it? I don't think it's about Kane "giving up though". HNIC did a montage of Kane after game 3 and it was ugly some of the passive aggressive stuff he was doing. I bash on Ovechkin, Gaborik and the likes when they float and get passive so I'm going to be fair and rip on Kane too. If he is frustrated that's fine and understandable because like you said he has been shadowed really well by Detroit. But find a better way to channel that frustration than easing up on plays and stopping after plays to get mad at your stick when you miss short side shots that never go in anyways.</p>


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As for playing with the better talent on the team. Kane has had ample ice time with guys like Sharp and Toews this series to do something with it but he hasn't.  And being double shifted is a testament to how much Q trusts him and has faith in his abilities..not sure how that can be seen as a negative Kanes always been a guy who wants the extra ice time and to have the games put in his hands. He gets ample enough time on the PP to do his business and he has been as bad as anyone else on it. Love Kaner and I always will but he has been horrible this series also at both ends of the game. He showed vast improvements in his defensive game this season but that too has gone to crap this series. Has he needed better linemates all season esp right now? Yes without a doubt. Did he have a fantastic season in spite of having lesser line mates? Yes of course. Perhaps that has caught up to him now? Wouldn't say that isn't an incorrect thought. Doesn't excuse some of the passive things he has done on the ice this series. Hate to go this road but if you are getting paid huge dollars and being treated like a king by the franchise you better not half ass it along the boards or start easing up on plays.</p>


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THIS ALL GOES FOR HOSSA ALSO WHO HAS BEEN HORRIBLE. I might be one of the few who thinks Sharp has actually played hard this series without results. In my opinion he's been the best Hawks forward this series in all aspects of the game accept being able to score which everyone is failing at. Partially his fault for turning back into can't hit the net Sharp..but his work ethic has been there. This from a guy who came off a really bad shoulder injury. Not sure what excuses of Hossa and Kane are as far as being passive at spots. Again like last night the Hawks have had their fair share of chances to score goals. They haven't been able to finish. I have no idea in the world how that gets pinned on Q. Was it Q who botched the 2 two on ones? Was it Q who botched getting more than 1 shot on 3 powerplays? Is it Q that misses the net on one on one chances? 2 goals in the last 3 games. Yikes. Detroit is playing amazing but 2 goals in 3 playoff games. That's not on Q. It can be spun as a coaching fault until the cows come home but it's not on Q. And I am willing to bet the players will be the first to tell you that also off the record.</p>


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However one of my biggest gripes with Q this series is he waits to long to stack his top line esp in that game 2 and game 3 he waited too long also. He had Kane playing with Toews to start the game in game 4 but he gave up on it way too early. Q's defensive match ups were out of whack the last 2 games also but its harder to get the match ups you want on visitors ice (Q's never been great with first line change). That's not a good enough excuse for Q either though..he has to take some heat there even though team defence wasn't that bad yesterday..team offense was a failure. He has failed in many aspects of his line rotations no doubt about it. But the players need to start taking the right amount of blame here too. 2 goals in 3 games is not acceptable for any playoff teams roster.</p>


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crazy fan in me thinks the Hawks can actually take 3 games in a row if the real Hawks team starts showing up again. The concern is that team hasn't shown up in a while. I think it will at least get pushed to 6 games. When it does then game 6 will be Q's to lose when he shows his inept to coach in detroit yet again.</p>
 

BigPete

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I am not going to argue with any of that.  I am just proposing alternate, and very possible, reasons for his reluctance to play hard. </p>


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Kane definitely has a pouting kid side to him.  That is the biggest way that he and Oshie differ (other than Kane's skills of stick handling and passing that no one rivals), Oshie loses a puck and goes right after the guy that took it.  Oshie whiffs a pass/shot and goes right after it.  Kane sulks and like you said, looks at his stick like "what is wrong with this thing?"</p>
 

BigPete

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You guys have heard me say it a thousand times.  You can't change the lineup as frequently as this coach does if you expect any kind of chemistry to develop.  Chemistry amongst wingers, especially in a system and at this level of talent and speed, is very important and does not happen in one game, let alone one shift.</p>
 

mikita's helmet

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What's three parts red and one part black?

Toews with Zetterburg, Kronwall and Erickson draped over his back.
 

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