What's up with the skid?

pseudonym

CCS Donator
Donator
Joined:
Jan 11, 2014
Posts:
6,950
Liked Posts:
4,376
Location:
Chicago
So, why are we on this skid?

1. Injuries?
2. Rookies and called up players?
3. Under-performing starters?
4. Bad home plate umps and calls (strikezone, etc.)?
5. Pitching outside of 1/2?
6. Bullpen?

Thoughts? I'm a bit shocked in our play lately. I'm going with injuries.
 

Raskolnikov

CCS Donator
Donator
Joined:
Aug 23, 2012
Posts:
22,555
Liked Posts:
7,576
Location:
Enemy Territory via southern C
So, why are we on this skid?

1. Injuries?
2. Rookies and called up players?
3. Under-performing starters?
4. Bad home plate umps and calls (strikezone, etc.)?
5. Pitching outside of 1/2?
6. Bullpen?

Thoughts? I'm a bit shocked in our play lately. I'm going with injuries.

I'll point out its interesting none of your points highlight opponents attributes. We ran into a stretch of starters just as our starters are adjusting to such rapidly changing catchers and the wearing down of Ross. Its pretty hard to blame Baez/Contreras who are playing their butts off.

I think the obvious marker of the drop off is Fowler going down. Zobrist moving around the lineup, Heyward struggling. Russell moving down the lineup.

I think its part random. Rizzo sitting the day he did lost that game, even though Contreras hit a HR at 1B. Clutch hitting hasn't been here, that can be random too.

Perhaps, a strange attribute of these teams that have given Cubs trouble, is power and the long ball. I think everyone except Arrieta can be susceptible to high power bats, and he happened to get stung too in this stretch. So the cubs have gotton a little taste of their own medicine, but this team is too good even when playing all the youth for this to last.

Lastly, Coghlin they are trying to get going but has been abysmal, hitting into several double plays and striking out. Having a tough year.

Maddon says as Fowler goes they go. So...I'd stick to that primarily.
 

beckdawg

Well-known member
Joined:
Oct 31, 2012
Posts:
11,750
Liked Posts:
3,741
So, why are we on this skid?

1. Injuries?
2. Rookies and called up players?
3. Under-performing starters?
4. Bad home plate umps and calls (strikezone, etc.)?
5. Pitching outside of 1/2?
6. Bullpen?

Thoughts? I'm a bit shocked in our play lately. I'm going with injuries.

Yes? I mean it's a little bit of all of those. I'd also add in "baseball" as one. Sometimes good teams go on a losing streak. If you want a bit of a more in detail answer I'd go with this. The cubs starting pitching thus far has been ridiculously good. Their offense has been streaky. The bullpen has been average with a couple of relievers being fairly bad. If we break into why the offense has been streaky you get injuries which then lead to rookies. Rookies are going to be inconsistent and at times flat out bad.

Whether or not you should worry in my opinion depends on how you feel about the young players the cubs have. Fowler, Zobrist and Heyward aren't typically what I'd think of players who can carry a team. Fowler and Zobrist sort of did when they started incredibly hot but that seems more the exception than the rule. All three should be good on base machines but you still need someone hitting for good average to drive them in. Bryant and Rizzo when going well probably can do that but thus far they haven't killed it like they can. Although, looking at Rizzo's stats he's quietly hitting .277/.402/.558 and his 155 wRC+ is 10th in the majors. I think if the majority of those guys are playing well the cubs will look like the dominant team they started the season as. If not, then you're going to have peaks and valleys.

Russell is so young still that I'm not sure his bat is ready to get where he can. Baez has been really streaky. Almora is probably too young to be in the majors but is here more because of injury. Soler.... who knows. Like Baez he jumps around and is pretty streaky. And between Montero and Ross I'm not expecting much. Montero was great last year but injuries have derailed him this year as they have done in the past. Ross is retiring after the year so that should say all you need to know there. Contreras though is really pretty interesting. He hit AA/AAA like Bryant and Scwharber hit AA/AAA. And unlike Bryant, he did so without striking out much which should play really well in the majors(and thus far has). I think it's going to surprise people how good his bat turns out being.

Overall, if the guys from the first paragraph do their jobs and play well the cubs are probably fine if they get even below average out of the guys in the second paragraph. As for pitching, some here will tell you the bullpen is a problem but I don't particularly see it that way. It could be better but it's not like the cubs have the Reds bullpen. Rondon, Strop, Cahill and Wood have been fantastic. Grimm hasn't been what he was last year. Richard was a bit of a train wreck. Warren didn't look comfortable in the pen after pitching well there in NY. So you're really talking about 2 bullpen guys in a righty to take Warren's spot and a lefty for Richard. Conception has dominated the past year and a half in the minors as a lefty. He had a 1.24 ERA over 36.1 IP in AA/AAA this year with roughly a 9 k/9 and a 3.46 bb/9. So, I think people will be happy with what he'll do. Not sure about the righty. Edwards in theory can dominate but still walks a lot of batters.

Long story short, think they will keep their eyes on the reliever market but I'm not convinced they will pay the price to get Miller like many are speculating. I see a Rodney/Hunter like move from last year again. I do think they will look at possible young starters and maybe consider addressing the bullpen that way either adding said young starter to the BP or moving Hammel/Hendricks out. They also could really use another vet bat but I'm not sure how they make that work playing time wise. Might be a case where they need to deal someone like Soler for a young starter(my hope is Drew Smyly personally) in order to find the playing time for a more vet bat they pick up in a separate deal.
 

pseudonym

CCS Donator
Donator
Joined:
Jan 11, 2014
Posts:
6,950
Liked Posts:
4,376
Location:
Chicago
Thanks, guys. Great responses.
 

SilenceS

Moderator
Staff member
Donator
Joined:
Apr 16, 2013
Posts:
21,851
Liked Posts:
9,047
Eh, its a mixture of things. Injuries, cooling down, hitting. Zobrist is batting .197 in June. Bryant is at .238 for the month. Rizzo has been the only one hitting. Baez has been up and down. Russell hasnt been good and has struck out a ton. Almora had a spark then died. Contreras provided a spark. Guys being injured and the rest not hitting is a recipe for losses.
 

cubsmann

New member
Joined:
Jun 16, 2016
Posts:
424
Liked Posts:
23
Yes? I mean it's a little bit of all of those. I'd also add in "baseball" as one. Sometimes good teams go on a losing streak. If you want a bit of a more in detail answer I'd go with this. The cubs starting pitching thus far has been ridiculously good. Their offense has been streaky. The bullpen has been average with a couple of relievers being fairly bad. If we break into why the offense has been streaky you get injuries which then lead to rookies. Rookies are going to be inconsistent and at times flat out bad.

This is the best response I think. Its just the nature of the game. No one can dominate over 162 games and that's why no one ever has. Every team gets cold and even the 1939 Yankees actually lost 6 in a row. This team has never lost more than 4. Do you guys realize how impressive that is? Think about it not a single losing streak more than 4 games in almost 80 in the books. You guys will see. Once we get Fowler back that will be huge because he is such a great motivator and his play has been so consistently outstanding that the team has had a hard time getting its bearings without him. One player is that important to the game. And this doesn't mean that the Cubs will suck next year without him. They will easily replace him with one of these guys who are getting valuable playing time now. Contreras and Almora are future stars in the league and combine them with Rizzo, Bryant, Schwarber, Baez, Russell, and Zobrist and were talking dynasty. Is it frustrating to watch the Cubs lose to teams they should be beating? Of course. But you have to put this all in perspective. The Cubs are 22 games over .500 and have a double digit lead in the NL Central. Even while losing 6 out of 7 games and dropping 6 of their last ten, the Cubs are still by far the best team in baseball. Things don't all of a sudden change. The fundamentals of pitching and defense have not been there over the last 7 games so they have struggled. But they've been in every one but 2 of the 7 games. They have some easy games coming up. They should sweep the Reds and play them 6 times in the next 2 weeks. That's at least 5 wins. And the Mets are not the team they were last year. So the Cubs just need to finish strong and go into the break at about 53-55 wins. That is easily doable. But every team struggles and gets cold from time to time. You can not dominate all the time. The talent level in MLB is so high that its really impossible. And you don't have to.
 

Omeletpants

Save America
Donator
Joined:
Aug 20, 2012
Posts:
27,619
Liked Posts:
12,616
My favorite teams
  1. Colorado Rockies
  1. Atlanta United FC
  1. Los Angeles Lakers
  2. Orlando Magic
  3. Phoenix Suns
  4. Sacramento Kings
  1. Columbus Blue Jackets
Writers on ESPN are starting to pounce. Here is a comment:

Here's something we didn't expect when the Cubs started 25-6: The Rangers have passed them for most wins in the majors. The Cubs still hold a small edge in winning percentage (.649 to .640), but they've gone just 23-20 since that hot start. All-time great team? Let's see if they're the best team of 2016.

Of course the homers and meatballs here are calling the Cubs a dynasty
 

CSF77

Well-known member
Joined:
Apr 16, 2013
Posts:
18,687
Liked Posts:
2,846
Location:
San Diego
Writers on ESPN are starting to pounce. Here is a comment:

Here's something we didn't expect when the Cubs started 25-6: The Rangers have passed them for most wins in the majors. The Cubs still hold a small edge in winning percentage (.649 to .640), but they've gone just 23-20 since that hot start. All-time great team? Let's see if they're the best team of 2016.

Of course the homers and meatballs here are calling the Cubs a dynasty

Maddon was worth 10 wins alone. I felt they were playing over themselves and would come down to earth. That said I'm feeling another streak with Arrieta starting it. The O is good enough right now. It is on the starters to start to put together another run.
 

SilenceS

Moderator
Staff member
Donator
Joined:
Apr 16, 2013
Posts:
21,851
Liked Posts:
9,047
Writers on ESPN are starting to pounce. Here is a comment:

Here's something we didn't expect when the Cubs started 25-6: The Rangers have passed them for most wins in the majors. The Cubs still hold a small edge in winning percentage (.649 to .640), but they've gone just 23-20 since that hot start. All-time great team? Let's see if they're the best team of 2016.

Of course the homers and meatballs here are calling the Cubs a dynasty

Are you telling me the media is flip flopping especially ESPN people? Say it aint so Ommy, say it aint so!
 

Mr. Cub

2016 World Series Champs!
Joined:
Dec 13, 2010
Posts:
4,854
Liked Posts:
1,036
Location:
Earth
Cubs will be Cubs.
 

brett05

867-5309
Joined:
Apr 28, 2009
Posts:
27,226
Liked Posts:
4,579
Location:
Hell
This is the best response I think. Its just the nature of the game. No one can dominate over 162 games and that's why no one ever has.
2001 Seattle Mariners lost only 46 and longest losing streak was 4 games in late September. Outside of that the longest losing streak for them was 2.


This team has never lost more than 4. Do you guys realize how impressive that is? Think about it not a single losing streak more than 4 games in almost 80 in the books.

It's impressive.

Contreras and Almora are future stars in the league and combine them with Rizzo, Bryant, Schwarber, Baez, Russell, and Zobrist and were talking dynasty.

How about win two world series in a row first. Actually win one even before that.


the Cubs are still by far the best team in baseball.

No they are not. two teams are ahead of them in wins (SF and TEX).

So the Cubs just need to finish strong and go into the break at about 53-55 wins. That is easily doable.

You want them to go 5-9 or 7-7 to the break and that is finishing strong against teams like the Reds and Braves?
 

DanTown

Well-known member
Joined:
Mar 31, 2009
Posts:
2,446
Liked Posts:
509
Cubs record in April: 17-5
Cubs record in May: 18-10
Cubs record in June first 17 games: 12-5
Cubs record in June last 7 games: 1-6

I simply don't care that much about a seven game sample. When the sample gets into the 20s and the team is healthy/close to what it wants to be, then I worry.

All that matters is the Cubs are playing well for their last 15-20 games (not regular season). Ask Golden State how much regular season wins matter.

At this point of the year, all I care about is being healthy by the playoffs and adding an elite arm for the bullpen.
 

TC in Mississippi

CCS Staff
Joined:
Oct 22, 2014
Posts:
5,305
Liked Posts:
1,816
Cubs record in April: 17-5
Cubs record in May: 18-10
Cubs record in June first 17 games: 12-5
Cubs record in June last 7 games: 1-6

I simply don't care that much about a seven game sample. When the sample gets into the 20s and the team is healthy/close to what it wants to be, then I worry.

All that matters is the Cubs are playing well for their last 15-20 games (not regular season). Ask Golden State how much regular season wins matter.

At this point of the year, all I care about is being healthy by the playoffs and adding an elite arm for the bullpen.

That's it right there. If there are going to be injuries, and there are always injuries, this is when to have them. The great start provided a cushion that so many teams don't have.
 

TC in Mississippi

CCS Staff
Joined:
Oct 22, 2014
Posts:
5,305
Liked Posts:
1,816
Writers on ESPN are starting to pounce. Here is a comment:

Here's something we didn't expect when the Cubs started 25-6: The Rangers have passed them for most wins in the majors. The Cubs still hold a small edge in winning percentage (.649 to .640), but they've gone just 23-20 since that hot start. All-time great team? Let's see if they're the best team of 2016.

Of course the homers and meatballs here are calling the Cubs a dynasty

So that 23-20 is a .535 winning percentage. If the Cubs duplicate that winning percentage the rest of the season they win 95 games and I think it's a pretty fare bet that they exceed that winning percentage. This is what a fast start gets you, a chance to weather the storm that always comes.
 

cubsmann

New member
Joined:
Jun 16, 2016
Posts:
424
Liked Posts:
23
Right see this is the thing. Sportscasters need something to talk about. What better to talk about the the Cubbies coming back to Earth? I don't give them much credit because these same guys were talking about the Cubs being a great team since spring training. I can tell you this, when the Cubs get hot again and start dominating teams like everyone knows they will, this stretch in the end of June will be a memory; a minor footnote in what will be a historic season. The still are the best team in baseball, yeah the Rangers and the Giants have more wins but the Cubs have a better win pct. So ESPN ranked the Cubs third in its latest power rankings. This is because the Giants and Rangers have been hot as hell lately and playing way over their collective heads. The Cubs are probably going to win 10-12 games before the All Star Break which would but them at 59-61 wins which would be half way to where they need to be. If this team wins 100+ games that would be an improvement over last year.

And lets face it, all of this is just hot air until the playoffs. We can argue here these point here until were blue in the face. I don't see the point other than arguing purely for arguments sake. Which is fine. It makes the season more interesting.

And anyone who doesn't see dynasty from this team considering how good they've been and how young they are. Well Im sorry but you're just blind. I am a homer. That's what Cubs fans are. But Im also a realist and see a great team full of young kids who haven't even peaked yet. This team could easily win 2 or 3 World Series in the next 5 years and I fully expect them to.
 

Omeletpants

Save America
Donator
Joined:
Aug 20, 2012
Posts:
27,619
Liked Posts:
12,616
My favorite teams
  1. Colorado Rockies
  1. Atlanta United FC
  1. Los Angeles Lakers
  2. Orlando Magic
  3. Phoenix Suns
  4. Sacramento Kings
  1. Columbus Blue Jackets
Yeah, dynasty that cant even get to the world series, let alone win it. Meatball homer
 

DJMoore_is_fat

New member
Joined:
Aug 26, 2012
Posts:
4,143
Liked Posts:
1,792
Thank God we're playing our worst baseball in June. By October, we'll be ready to roll. It's a long, long season. Once we get back Fowler, Soler, and La Stella, we'll be back to playing great ball.

We have as good of a shot to win the WS as any team in the majors.
 

Omeletpants

Save America
Donator
Joined:
Aug 20, 2012
Posts:
27,619
Liked Posts:
12,616
My favorite teams
  1. Colorado Rockies
  1. Atlanta United FC
  1. Los Angeles Lakers
  2. Orlando Magic
  3. Phoenix Suns
  4. Sacramento Kings
  1. Columbus Blue Jackets
Thank God we're playing our worst baseball in June. By October, we'll be ready to roll. It's a long, long season. Once we get back Fowler, Soler, and La Stella, we'll be back to playing great ball.

We have as good of a shot to win the WS as any team in the majors.
You think having Soler back solves anything? I think it just muddies the water. Offensively Soler in not an improvement over any fo the alternatives and defensively he is a liability that needs to be pulled in the 7th inning. With Contresas playing LF and that shithead Coghlan in the mix, Soler is irrelevant
 

TC in Mississippi

CCS Staff
Joined:
Oct 22, 2014
Posts:
5,305
Liked Posts:
1,816
You think having Soler back solves anything? I think it just muddies the water. Offensively Soler in not an improvement over any fo the alternatives and defensively he is a liability that needs to be pulled in the 7th inning. With Contresas playing LF and that shithead Coghlan in the mix, Soler is irrelevant

Soler slashed .308/.438/.590 with 3 HR in his last 15 games before the injury and .250/.345/.421 in the last 30. I think a guy with that kind of OPS would help plenty. He was really figuring things out.
 

Omeletpants

Save America
Donator
Joined:
Aug 20, 2012
Posts:
27,619
Liked Posts:
12,616
My favorite teams
  1. Colorado Rockies
  1. Atlanta United FC
  1. Los Angeles Lakers
  2. Orlando Magic
  3. Phoenix Suns
  4. Sacramento Kings
  1. Columbus Blue Jackets
Soler slashed .308/.438/.590 with 3 HR in his last 15 games before the injury and .250/.345/.421 in the last 30. I think a guy with that kind of OPS would help plenty. He was really figuring things out.
I dont beleive your sample size suggests he has anything figured out. Given his stint on the DL he might have lost what he gain
 

Top