Got teeth? Keith doesn't.
JoeHawks is a fine gent
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n00b.
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n00b.
BigSoxHurt35
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Noob?? Really that's the best ya got?? Wow man go play world of warcraft loser
ChiSportsRich
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THe Cubs are looking at Konerko. Pauly, although hes slowed down, is better than any first baseman the Cubs have
ChiSportsRich
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I think taking Thornton out of the set-up role is a bad idea, KW said he wanted Sale in the rotation but he is best suited, i feel, to be the closer. I agree that Morel should get a shot to start, not handed to him (like Brian Anderson in 2006)
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and probably better than any of the 1bmn they will start the year off with...hence berkman, chris davis, overbay
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****'n'A. If 39/111 is slowing down, I'd love to have his prior numbers....and, if I'm supposed to take that literally, he's been slow for a loooong time.
Besides, do the Cubs have a line of credit with MasterCard to pay for him? Maybe a second mortgage on the "Confines?"
ChiSportsRich
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By slowing down I meant his defense. Clearly, his offensive numbers were awesome. I doubt the Cubs will go for him.
Lefty
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Come on, Iago, you're better than that. You know as well as anyone that Konerko's 2010 run was a bit of an aberration for a 34-year old 1B with balky knees and a career line of .280/.356/.498. Now don't get me wrong, that slash line would be a fantastic contribution from him next season, but it's unreasonable to make a big decision like this based on last season.
ChiSportsRich
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I agree, Lefty, it was nice to see it but unreasonable to expect it again
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:rolling:
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Gotcha.
Oh, for sure. I really wasn't sure how he meant slowing down. I must have completely missed how the conversation took a turn and focused on PK's defense and pulled his comment out of the context it was meant to be in.
Chi Sox Nut
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Again, why is Paulie nominated for Player of the Year then? How many other guys on that list were? Two. Pujols and Votto. Now I don't follow every player in the MLB because I don't have the time or interest, but why would PK be up for the award, while only 2 others on you list were, if he's such a mediocre 1st baseman?
There is one name on your list I do know isn't as good as Konerko, and that's Adam LaRoche. I live in Phoenix and am also a D-backs fan (second to the Sox), so I watched almost every game last season. I also watched as many Sox games as I could on WGN, etc. and listened to the rest of the games on my iPhone. While I like Laroche and don't want to see him leave the Diamondbacks, he is not the same caliber of 1st baseman Paulie is. He had a relatively good season, with 100 RBIs and made some spectacular plays, but I'd much rather have Konerko on my team than LaRoche.
Lefty
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1) What do you mean by "Player of the Year"? Do you mean MVP?
2) Either way, who cares? Those are all subjective measures of overall value, and rightly don't carry much weight in valuating players. Case in point: Derek Jeter has five Gold Glove Awards, but only two or three seasons of barely-near-average defense. The rest of his career has been filled with absolute garbage defense, yet he continually wins GG's, does this make him a good defender? Hardly.
2) Either way, who cares? Those are all subjective measures of overall value, and rightly don't carry much weight in valuating players. Case in point: Derek Jeter has five Gold Glove Awards, but only two or three seasons of barely-near-average defense. The rest of his career has been filled with absolute garbage defense, yet he continually wins GG's, does this make him a good defender? Hardly.
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good point bringing up jeter. the personal awards do not really mean a hell of a whole lot. the only one i really think is an actual achievement is the triple crown, at the same time I still would not base my evaluations off of that.
As far as this discussion, IMO I would say at this point in Konerkos career he is slightly above average at defense. which chi sox nut, that is basically what we are talking about, we arent talking about the overall aspect of his hitting as well.
Now as far as the list is concerned, i still would take konerko over Helton,Berkman,Overbay,laroche etc the gentleman who posted that about the 1b players doesnt know a whole lot about baseball at all. he is a kid who googles sabre stats and believes he is smarter by using them in his posts...hence his over use of UZR.
As far as konerko being the "leader" and "clubhouse guy" that is very over used and really has no business being brought up as a point in arguing a players overall talent and worth, much like the rule that i have and that is...no grindiness,heart, fire and passion etc to evaluate and misinterpret what a player really is.
Lefty
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Yeah, I really hope that list was aimed solely at marking 1B's that are better defensively than Konerko (I'll get to that in a minute), because if it was meant as an "overall" list, then uhh...yeah, no.
But here's the thing: when talking about "average" or "great" defense at first base, what people need to realize is that even "great" defense at that corner is a bit of a superfluous achievement, for two reasons:
1) First base is a de facto offensive position.
2) First base is the easiest position on the field to play.
Of course, we all remember the out-stretched scoops of a double-play relay throw in the dirt, and all the other flashy "digs" first basemen make, but the fact of the matter is that 1) that isn't all that hard to do (for major leaguers, of course) and 2) those plays/throws are more than likely constitute the minority of plays a 1B is tasked with (here, you have to be able to divorce your natural tendencies towards remembering the flashy and forgetting the mundane [again, see: Jeter, Derek]).
Overall, I am rather suspect of degrading or heaping accolades on first basemen for their defense, mainly because the stats used to judge them (UZR, primarily) are hindered by the fact that they look at the league average (which changes, and is the average of a position where teams are more interested in what they can get offensively from it).
But here's the thing: when talking about "average" or "great" defense at first base, what people need to realize is that even "great" defense at that corner is a bit of a superfluous achievement, for two reasons:
1) First base is a de facto offensive position.
2) First base is the easiest position on the field to play.
Of course, we all remember the out-stretched scoops of a double-play relay throw in the dirt, and all the other flashy "digs" first basemen make, but the fact of the matter is that 1) that isn't all that hard to do (for major leaguers, of course) and 2) those plays/throws are more than likely constitute the minority of plays a 1B is tasked with (here, you have to be able to divorce your natural tendencies towards remembering the flashy and forgetting the mundane [again, see: Jeter, Derek]).
Overall, I am rather suspect of degrading or heaping accolades on first basemen for their defense, mainly because the stats used to judge them (UZR, primarily) are hindered by the fact that they look at the league average (which changes, and is the average of a position where teams are more interested in what they can get offensively from it).
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My favorite teams
Got teeth? Keith doesn't.
JoeHawks is a fine gent
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I've only played that game like once in my life, pretty ***.
Why the **** do you keep bringing up this stupid Player of the Year Award? That includes offense, and pretty much is based 75% off of offense, just like the MVP pretty much. I'm talking about DEFENSIVELY.
Jesus fucking christ...
Chi Sox Nut
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Sheesh this is a testy group...:smh:
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there is only one member here that arguing with is like arguing with a child, dont take offense to that poster....the other poster you are debating with is actually very intelligent with baseball, and actually knows sabre stats and how to use them, unlike most people who spew out sabre stats without having a clue how to interpret them to evaluate a player. relax. dont sweat it.
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