20 days to Dawn of Justice

[Jester]

Uhg I just can't stand Ben Affleck in any show. Batman...Really?

 

[brett05]

Uhg I just can't stand Ben Affleck in any show. Batman...Really?

I thought he made a exceptional bitter older Bruce Wayne

 

[BaBaBlacksheep]

Saw it tonight. Went in expecting horrible because of the reviews but liked it. Is it a great movie? Hell no. Is it an entertaining super hero movie? Yes.

 

[remydat]

So the decline this week at the box office was the worst for any comic book movie ever.

 

[airtime143]

I loved it.
I am also incredibly excited that Darkseid is shaping up to be appearing in the future.


DC took a gamble when they chose to start their Justice league run with a combined movie rather than several individual ones, and Hopefully it works out in the long run.
Casual fans understandably were confused by a lot of the movie, as were critics.
To me, knowing there is a literal explosion of movies coming down the pipe, it was a nice start to the franchise. It was light years better than the first and second x-men movie, and that wound up hitting its stride pretty well.

There were funny easter eggs throughout- the original superman cover was on the wall of the legless dude, there was a Riddler question mark spray painted on a wall, and a bunch of Joker spray paint graffitti.


Things I really enjoyed- and this is gonna include spoilers- were...

Darkseid. Those absolutely were parademons in Batmans "dream" (a dream likely induced by The Flash coming back in time to warn him... the "dream" had a real world impact- when the flash disappeared, the papers in the batcave were thrown through the air).
The columns of fire in the wasteland were replicas of the ones on Apocolypse. There was also an appearance of a mother box in the video clip where Vic Stone was being changed in to Cyborg.
Darkseid has always wanted Superman as a champion- perhaps Flash's warning was that it would eventually happen if Superman was not led the right direction.
At the end, Luthor saying the Bell had already been rung makes Darkseid a certainty- Luthor knows he is out there and that his head has turned this direction.
Not to mention the fact that there is a giant omega symbol in the earth when Batman is looking over the scorched city.
A little tiny reference to Darkseid is shown in Luthors upside-down painting as well... They focus in on the Grey demon, and the "cracks" in the painting on his face are very reminiscent of the fissures covering Darkseid's flesh.

Luthor- I did not like the manic hyperactivity... but he certainly is worthy of the tag "Super Villian"- he was 5 steps ahead of Superman, deciphered his secret identity, and set an astounding trap.
They did a fantastic job of showing his influence within the government, as well as showing the philanthropist side that fools the public.
He also had more knowledge of Meta humans than Batman.

Technology- It always bothered me that the Bat plane flew itself around... the technology required for that at the time was just too damn advanced. they made an effort to make it realistic by putting the plane in to alfreds hands via remote.

Batman- This Batman might be may favorite version of Batman- More focus on his mind than his ass kicking ability. He absorbed the changing of the situation between him and Superman instantly- from the moment he found out Luthor was pulling the strings, He stopped trying to put the spear through superman and let him up, and took charge- stopping superman from saving his mother and taking that job himself while sending Superman to deal with Doomsday.


Legendary Comic book imagery and influence- they pulled inspiration from many classic comic book panels and storylines and put them in the movie.
The inspiration drawn from The Dark Knight Returns graphic novel was the most prevalent- Both in imagery and storyline.
Story wise, Superman is getting his strings pulled in both instances- From the president in the novel to Luthor in the movie.

The traps Batman set for Superman and the weapons themselves are similar- In both the novel and the movie, the most impactful weapon was the audio weapon... he was brought to a stop by them.
In both the book and the movie, the Kryptonite was delivered via aeresol.



Imagery wise, from the bat suit designed for fighting superman (from his cowl to his boots, very much unique to that novel) to the cinematic shots- Batman standing on the crane with his "rifle"...

To the image of Superman after getting nuked....

Down to the classic cover panel being hidden in the movie-

 

[DC]

I enjoyed it as well. Good stuff. Cool to see a diff. take on the Sup. He is an alien causing mass destruction afterall, isn't he?

 

[Wintermute]

I loved it.
I am also incredibly excited that Darkseid is shaping up to be appearing in the future.


DC took a gamble when they chose to start their Justice league run with a combined movie rather than several individual ones, and Hopefully it works out in the long run.
Casual fans understandably were confused by a lot of the movie, as were critics.
To me, knowing there is a literal explosion of movies coming down the pipe, it was a nice start to the franchise. It was light years better than the first and second x-men movie, and that wound up hitting its stride pretty well.

There were funny easter eggs throughout- the original superman cover was on the wall of the legless dude, there was a Riddler question mark spray painted on a wall, and a bunch of Joker spray paint graffitti.


Things I really enjoyed- and this is gonna include spoilers- were...

Darkseid. Those absolutely were parademons in Batmans "dream" (a dream likely induced by The Flash coming back in time to warn him... the "dream" had a real world impact- when the flash disappeared, the papers in the batcave were thrown through the air).
The columns of fire in the wasteland were replicas of the ones on Apocolypse. There was also an appearance of a mother box in the video clip where Vic Stone was being changed in to Cyborg.
Darkseid has always wanted Superman as a champion- perhaps Flash's warning was that it would eventually happen if Superman was not led the right direction.
At the end, Luthor saying the Bell had already been rung makes Darkseid a certainty- Luthor knows he is out there and that his head has turned this direction.
Not to mention the fact that there is a giant omega symbol in the earth when Batman is looking over the scorched city.
A little tiny reference to Darkseid is shown in Luthors upside-down painting as well... They focus in on the Grey demon, and the "cracks" in the painting on his face are very reminiscent of the fissures covering Darkseid's flesh.

Luthor- I did not like the manic hyperactivity... but he certainly is worthy of the tag "Super Villian"- he was 5 steps ahead of Superman, deciphered his secret identity, and set an astounding trap.
They did a fantastic job of showing his influence within the government, as well as showing the philanthropist side that fools the public.
He also had more knowledge of Meta humans than Batman.

Technology- It always bothered me that the Bat plane flew itself around... the technology required for that at the time was just too damn advanced. they made an effort to make it realistic by putting the plane in to alfreds hands via remote.

Batman- This Batman might be may favorite version of Batman- More focus on his mind than his ass kicking ability. He absorbed the changing of the situation between him and Superman instantly- from the moment he found out Luthor was pulling the strings, He stopped trying to put the spear through superman and let him up, and took charge- stopping superman from saving his mother and taking that job himself while sending Superman to deal with Doomsday.


Legendary Comic book imagery and influence- they pulled inspiration from many classic comic book panels and storylines and put them in the movie.
The inspiration drawn from The Dark Knight Returns graphic novel was the most prevalent- Both in imagery and storyline.
Story wise, Superman is getting his strings pulled in both instances- From the president in the novel to Luthor in the movie.

The traps Batman set for Superman and the weapons themselves are similar- In both the novel and the movie, the most impactful weapon was the audio weapon... he was brought to a stop by them.
In both the book and the movie, the Kryptonite was delivered via aeresol.

Excellent post.

 

[Wintermute]

I, too really enjoyed this movie. It most certainly did not deserve the criticism it drew. Was it epic? No. It had a few cheesy moments, like when the JL struck their super hero poses in front of Doomsday. I laughed when Airtime compared this to X-men because I was thinking in a similar fashion except in regard to 'Age of Ultron' or 'Iron Man 3,' - both boorish films riding on the shoulders of their predecessors.

Affleck: Brooding, cynical, and not afraid to kill or (gasp!) use a firearm. Actually drank and bedded women to meet his own needs, not to keep up Bruce Wayne's playboy appearance. Now, what really sold me was the opening scene. Seeing the chaos of two aliens slugging it out and the devastation and loss of life that ensued. Not that Superman is evil of course, but it lent a great perspective to the film and was a strong way to set the tone. Not going to get into Nolan comparisons because that series still represents the gold standard of what comic movies should be. Needless to say I also liked Affleck's portrayal.

Jeremy Irons: Always a treat to hear Alfred's sarcastic barbs. Reminded me of Efrem Zimbalist Jr. from the animated series in the 90's (which was excellent by the way). Was re-watching this lately and I didn't realize how much crap Alfred really gave Wayne. Quite hilarious actually.

Establishment of a specific time period: A minor detail to be sure, but an important one in my mind. The scene where his parents died. Thought I caught the movie poster for 'Excalibur' in the background and then had my subsequent "A-Ha!" moment. Glad they are at least sticking with a fixed period. Not that I disliked the blending of modern and old/art deco and contemporary in the Keaton movies or the cartoon, but it was good to have a point of reference. Liked seeing Jeffrey Dean Morgan sporting his 'Watchmen' porn 'stache.

Wonder Woman: Glad they steered clear of the old stars and stripes. Good to see her making use of Amazonian weaponry - slicing and hacking the enemy. Hopefully someone asks her, "Diana, what is best in life?"

Eisenberg: Didn't like getting a second rate Lex Luthor. Liked it even less when the cast him as a petulant and annoying child. Not a cold, calculating villain. Or a shrewd business man. Or someone with focus and motivation. Nope. Instead we get Mark Zuckerburg who majored in physics and then went off his meds. If filmmakers think updating a character here and there is the right move, so be it. Couldn't help but feel this was a feeble attempt at appealing to the tweener crowd a bit. Zack Snyder was successful in emotionally vesting me into hating this character at least. So good for him.

Doomsday: Not really sure how I feel about this one. Too soon? Couldn't help but wonder if they couldn't have used this plot at some other time. However, I doubt the Death of Superman would have the same wow factor on the big screen as the comic did back in the 90's if they did a standalone. It sure didn't in this film.

Batman's sudden change of heart: After all that built up resentment towards Superman, Bats sure had a lightning quick change of heart over killing him. Thought it might take a little more convincing than that, but oh well. Film time was running out and they had to keep it moving. Holy plot device Batman.

Overall, this movie exceeded my expectations. Solid 4/5 stars. Will be watching again to take in the subtle points I missed and Zack Snyder's imagery. I am curious of the direction this franchise moves after getting blasted by critics. And hopefully they get Darkseid right, because Thanos certainly doesn't look menacing in the Marvel universe.

 

[DC]

Great reviews by Winter and Air. Agreed nearly 100%. Especially Eisenberg as Lex. Total fail.

 

[airtime143]

So after watching this movie multiple times and speaking to geeks and non-geeks alike, I am pretty disappointed by the criticisms.

A lot of the bitching comes in the form of not understanding the point of the story. I also think that the next few flicks will help people understand the first one better.

Some have said the story jumps around, and that the moral is murky(darkly portrayed batman.. is he the moral high ground for stopping superman and his immense collateral damage or is he simply killing for a grudge?)... that Luthor made Batman and Superman look foolish and played them like fiddles.

Those people completely missed the point. Perhaps the director thought too highly of the ability of moviegoers, perhaps he should have succinctly stated the point with a brief summation so people could get it.
To me, The story was clear as day and spelled out in the title... Batman vs. Superman, DAWN OF JUSTICE.
The bottom line is that Luthor suffered the fate of many a villian of lore- He was hoist with his own petard.


It isn't ABOUT Batman vs. Superman. It is about the dawn of the Justice League. It made its point VERY well. The point is, No matter how smart, rich, powerful, influential a person is, No single individual can be all powerful. Everyone is subject to lapses of judgement.
Luthor drives the plot, and Luthor is the Moral.

Lets begin with Superman- He was forced to doom his own people to save his new planet. Despite being willing to sacrifice himself and his race, he still caused massive damage to his new planet by making poor decisions. He could have left Zod in space. He could have killed him sooner. Letting Zod live and bringing him back down to metropolis to continue the battle led to Waynes building being destroyed.

So here comes Bruce Wayne- immediately he is shown to be limited in power. Saving a man who turns in to a bomb. Saving a girl and promising to find her parents, to immediately find out her parents were a pile of laser beamed goo.

So Batman wants to take out Superman. He has trouble getting the Kryptonite- in part because he left alfred out of most of the planning, But mostly because Superman showed up to shut him down.


So here you have Batman and Superman. Both extremely powerful. Both ready to take out the other, because both think they are the final word on what is right.


Then you Have Luthor. One of the richest, most powerful, most influential men on the planet. He runs his companies. He has the ability to order around the politicians and Military.
Yet he cannot stand the thought of a challenge to his power. He has uncovered Superheros that prefer to remain in the dark. Cyborg, Flash, Aquaman, and Wonder Woman are completely dormant and have no desire to enter the world of man as Heroes.
Yet Luthor is compelled to eliminate them. His desire to eliminate them is what pulls Wonder Woman out of hiding.


So- Luthor, not content to let Superman and Batman go after each other on their own timeline, Sets his plan in motion. He kidnaps Supermans mother and uses that to send Superman after Batman.
Keep in mind, Bats was going after Supes regardless. With Luthors intervention, he gave Superman the single weapon that would stop Batman- pity.
Without the mention of his mother, Superman would have a brain full of kryptonite spear. Batman would have been hunted to the ends of the earth.
When Superman and Batman decide not to kill each other, Luthor releases his abomination.
Batman and Supes divide the work load.
Doomsday, a failsafe designed to destroy both bats and supes is the straw that broke the camels back for Diana- After a century of being Dormant, she comes out to fight.


Batman was not correct wanting to kill superman. Superman was not correct for wanting to stop Batman. Wonder Woman was not correct for wanting to hide from the world.
Luthor thought he was solidifying his stranglehold on power by creating a set of circumstances to destroy all the heroes.. yet it backfired spectacularly.
Without his intervention, without his meticulous planning, without his investigative work, the world would be minus superman (dead) Wonder Woman (retired) Batman (hunted by the entire world), Aquaman, Flash, and Cyborg (all completely unknown and unfound-inactive aside from small little things here and there).

Luthor taught the most powerful beings on the planet the value of cooperation and teamwork, to trust others to do the right thing.
He put in motion a situation where Superman was forced to trust Batman's logic and put the life of his mother in his hands... the very guy that was trying to kill him minutes before.


I am shocked at how many people see the story arc as an incoherent jumble of unrelated story lines.
It is all tied together with a nice, neat, cohesive bow- Luthor tried to eliminate multiple threats that would have eliminated themselves without his meddling. As a result, the lone fellow who thinks he is the smartest man on the planet instead created his own demise, providing intel to other heroes to the 3 he galvanized together.
The 3 who thought they were above reproach went the other way- they put thier faith in others and as a result were victorious.

A story of learning and earning trust, and the dangers of imposing your singular will.

 

[remydat]

Like anything some of the criticism is fair and some of it is not. In the end, it was a poorly constructed movie for many reasons. The two most glaring issues I had with it aside from Lex Luthor being a whiny emo ***** are as follows:

1. Nothing was resolved regarding the core rift between Batman and Superman. Batman spends the whole movie opposing Superman because of the destruction he causes then basically drops the whole fucking beef that led to him almost killing Superman in like 15 seconds of film time. This was hailed by Batman fanboys as "Oh he processed the situation with Luther and Doomsday instantly because he is a great strategist," but this is simply horseshit. The fact is regardless of what Luthor did, Superman did in fact cause a **** ton of destruction including all those deaths at the start of the movie. Nothing in the movie resolves this core conflict. Instead we get a bait and switch where Batman and everyone in the audience just forgets the whole cause of the rift in the first place and Luthor and Doomsday are used in a cool fight scene to distract us from the whole reason Batman was fighting.

2. Which leads into the next big issue. The fight scene was the dumbest display of strategy by superheroes I have ever seen in a movie. This from the 3 biggest superheroes in DC and one whose entire existence is based on being a strategist. To illustrate how fucking stupid this fight scene was I will reimagine the dialogue in the climatic battle.

Wonder Woman: So do you think one of us should go get the spear?

Batman: Nah, let's just risk our lives dodging Doomsday for a few minutes and hope that the spear will find us.

Wonder Woman: You sure you shouldn't just go get it while Superman and I fend off Doomsday since you are practically worthless in this fight and the most squishy of us?

Batman: Nah, even if for some strange reason, the spear doesn't magically find its way to us, we can simply count on Lois Lane still being around and she can bring it to us as I am sure she will survive all this utter destruction that it's taking 3 Superheroes to stop.

Wonder Woman: But what if a building collapses on her or something?

Batman: No worries, we can count on Lois magically surviving any collapsing building's long enough for Superman's super sensitive hearing to hear her drowning and then and only then will Doomsday magically allow Superman to exit the battle to go save her.

Wonder Woman: Wait, shouldn't you go get the spear if that happens since you are immune to Kryptonite and again the most squishy out of us? Then you can just give it to me since I have weapons training, and am durable and strong enough to attack Doomsday with it and survive while you and Superman distract him?

Batman: True but this is a Batman vs Superman movie so Superman should be the one to save Lois and kill Doomsday even though it makes no fucking sense for him to expose himself to Kryptonite when we are in the middle of fighting a ridiculously dangerous foe. Besides we won't be able to have two cool funeral processions if Superman doesn't sacrifice himself by stupidly insisting on being the one to wield the Kryptonite spear that is capable of killing both he and Doomsday.

Wonder Woman: Yeah I guess you are right as my killing Doomsday and ensuring everyone lives doesn't make for the OMG moment that Superman recklessly attacking Doomsday and not even making sure I can provide backup does. Glad we figured out the best way to take down Doomsday in a way that is totally believable to the audience.

 

[DC]

High stakes drama going on here.

 

[remydat]

Come on bro, you know deep down that ending battle was the worst display of strategy ever. No one went looking for the spear until Superman happened to hear Lois Lane drowning. Fucking absurd. And then let's let the guy that can die from Kryptonite carry around a Kryptonite spear instead of the the durable and super strong Wonder Woman.

I mean holy ****, there was this 8 year old kid that was crying in the theater when Superman died and even he in between sobbing asked his Dad why didn't Wonder Woman use the spear. When an 8 year has a better strategy for killing the enemy than the great strategist Batman then you've got a problem.

 

[dweebs19]

Remy, you summed up perfectly the issues that I had with the movie. The whole reason for Batman disliking Superman was just forgotten because his mother's name is Martha? I mean damn...if the name was Paola, Batman would have been like "**** Paola, I don't know who that is"?..That was the dumbest thing ever. Dumb. Also, Batman had legit reasons to be mad at Superman, but the issue was not really ressolved

 

[remydat]

Lol, I actually forgot that the thing that stopped Batman initially was that their mothers had the same fucking name. But you're right, the way the scene was set up, you get the impression that Batman would have driven that spear through Superman's heart without a second thought if Superman's mother's name was anything but Martha.

I guess it's a good thing Doomsday's mom's name wasn't Martha too. Otherwise Superman and Batman would have stopped fighting while Wonder Woman got her ass kicked. **** it, maybe her mom's name is Martha too and they all would have stopped fighting and gone to Starbucks for an espresso and argued about whose Martha was the bestest mom ever.

 

[airtime143]

Lol, I actually forgot that the thing that stopped Batman initially was that their mothers had the same fucking name. But you're right, the way the scene was set up, you get the impression that Batman would have driven that spear through Superman's heart without a second thought if Superman's mother's name was anything but Martha.

I guess it's a good thing Doomsday's mom's name wasn't Martha too. Otherwise Superman and Batman would have stopped fighting while Wonder Woman got her ass kicked. **** it, maybe her mom's name is Martha too and they all would have stopped fighting and gone to Starbucks for an espresso and argued about whose Martha was the bestest mom ever.

Saying her name made Batman pause long enough for the explanation to come out- no more, no less. Batman was willing to plunge the spear in Supes head, but paused to find out what the hell he meant.

 

[TheeUndyingFan]

So I finally saw this... Before I say anything I have to say that I do respect everyone's opinion and I know the importance of these characters vary based on the fan or non-fan of said characters.

Here goes...

This movie did not work for me on any level whatsoever. It had, in my opinion, not one single redeeming quality in its entire 2hr 40min runtime. Zack Snyder... My goodness. You would be hard pressed to find another director in history that could **** something up as bad as this guy. How an entire braintrust of DC execs could be okay with this movie is just fucking jarring!

Superman was garbage, Batman was garbage. They were stiff caricatures of who they're supposed to be and by the time Wonder Woman comes to the rescue it's over an hour too late. Why oh why does DC take their characters so damn seriously? And why do I need heavy 9/11 undertones in my superhero movie?!? The CGI (which I hate anyway) was terrible. The musical score was bad, boring, and irritating. The writing was shit, the acting was... Fine I guess but it hardly mattered.

The whole "Martha" bit is a microcosm of how awful the movie really is. You mean to tell me the only way you can think to get Batman and Superman to relate is by parentage? Jee-zus.

That Aquaman reveal has to be the single most cringeworthy moment ever put to film. My first instinct was to close my eyes out of embarrassment. Both parts with the Flash were bad but the convenient store part was far from exciting. Cyborg looked cool. I have to wonder why DC didn't think Martian Manhunter would be appealing but Aquaman is?

By the end of the movie I had no interest or care for any characters well being, not one of them maybe save for Lois, is relatable. Of the two hour and forty minute length they used exactly none of it to build and grow characters. Oh but we did get to see bullet casings eject from various guns how many fucking times holy shit! I liked MoS and I also like Ben Affleck as well but my god, just a total failure of a movie for me personally. Fantastic 4 must have been a real barrel of shit to be worse than BvS was.

This series should be aborted.



Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[airtime143]

So I bought the ultimate edition.

It is a damn shame that they didnt release the entire thing right off the bat. (ha!)

Total spoiler alert here- stop reading if you dont want to hear what was added in.






So to start- the opening scene with lois in the dessert we know was a setup by luthor. However, much was left out in the theatrical release. Luthor engineered the interview with Lois and the warlord. His mercs worked for the warlord, and killed everyone when the interview was set up.
Olsen, the photographer, was cia- what they cut out was there was a cia party waiting to pounce on the warlord, and the US sent in a drone to bomb the compound. Supes destroys the drone and missile, saves lois, and boogies.
Luthors Mercs kill everyone and torch the bodies with a flamethrower, staging them to look like supes went on a rampage.
The lady who testifies to the committee was in luthors pocket- her parents were alive and well, and she testified against superman for cash. She was later killed to keep her quiet (she had fessed up to the senator).

That, plus the wrecking of metropolis, was key to making Batman want to take out Superman.
The final straw was the wheelchair bomb in the Hearing- there was a cut scene where it comes out that the bomb was lead-encased... preventing superman from seeing and reacting to it. The goal was to make it look like superman let the bomb wipe out everyone rather than stop it.


To pit Superman against Batman, Luthor pays a thug to kill any prisoners that have the batman brand on them. (funny enough, Green Bay Packer Ahman Green was in that scene).
Kent hates the vigilante justice, but knowing the people batman puts away are being murdered for it puts him over the edge.


The bottom line is, Due to time restraints, they completely undermined Luthors credibility as a supervillian- almost all of the cut scenes relate to the behind the scenes engineering he did... down to the fact that he brought the kryptonite in to the country specifically knowing Batman would take it and use it- he is pleased as can be when he shows up at his lab and finds the kryptonite missing and the batarang in its place.

The turn on a dime change of attitude wayne has when lois shows up and explains it to him is understandable at that point- Wayne sees the set-up for what it is.


As for superman grabbing the spear- deal with it. Batman brought Doomsday back so he could use the spear... and almost got fried. Wonder woman shows up, they start trying to whoop doomsday, and before anyone has a chance to peel off and look for the weapon, Lois gets trapped under the water retrieving it. Supes hears her mid-battle, saves her, grabs the spear and goes to work. Poor choice on his part, but he took an opportunity- wonder woman had Doomsday in the lasso and Batman had just blasted the ****** with his last kryptonite shell- it was the one moment where doomsday was vulnerable.

Nobody except Lois knew where the spear was. They certainly were not in a position to go on a scavenger hunt at any point.
When supes hears lois and saves her, that is the first time they laid eyes on it.
So what to do? Run away, tell wonder woman where it is at, and hope to contain doomsday while she runs to get it?
Or strike when Doomsday is weakened?

Would Wonder woman have fared any better? Maybe not- she is powerful, but my guess is she may very well have been stabbed through the heart as well (bullets bounce off of superman, but in comics, Wonder woman deflects them with her bracelets- maybe she can be shot? that is all over the map- she has been pierced by arrows in the comics, but also in an offshoot she has been shown to withstand bullets.)
Supes would have been Just fine had he gotten a better shot at Doomsday, he just had the bad luck of Doomsday stabbing him. The same fate could very well have awaited Wonder Woman- and to be fair, Superman did not know jack shit about wonder woman- for all he knew, the shield may have been the only thing super about her.
We know as fans what wonder woman is- But all Superman knew was that he was fighting next to a human with great toys and some crazy woman. His decision was solid in the heat of the moment.

 

[Wintermute]

So I bought the ultimate edition.

It is a damn shame that they didnt release the entire thing right off the bat. (ha!)

Total spoiler alert here- stop reading if you dont want to hear what was added in.






So to start- the opening scene with lois in the dessert we know was a setup by luthor. However, much was left out in the theatrical release. Luthor engineered the interview with Lois and the warlord. His mercs worked for the warlord, and killed everyone when the interview was set up.
Olsen, the photographer, was cia- what they cut out was there was a cia party waiting to pounce on the warlord, and the US sent in a drone to bomb the compound. Supes destroys the drone and missile, saves lois, and boogies.
Luthors Mercs kill everyone and torch the bodies with a flamethrower, staging them to look like supes went on a rampage.
The lady who testifies to the committee was in luthors pocket- her parents were alive and well, and she testified against superman for cash. She was later killed to keep her quiet (she had fessed up to the senator).

That, plus the wrecking of metropolis, was key to making Batman want to take out Superman.
The final straw was the wheelchair bomb in the Hearing- there was a cut scene where it comes out that the bomb was lead-encased... preventing superman from seeing and reacting to it. The goal was to make it look like superman let the bomb wipe out everyone rather than stop it.


To pit Superman against Batman, Luthor pays a thug to kill any prisoners that have the batman brand on them. (funny enough, Green Bay Packer Ahman Green was in that scene).
Kent hates the vigilante justice, but knowing the people batman puts away are being murdered for it puts him over the edge.


The bottom line is, Due to time restraints, they completely undermined Luthors credibility as a supervillian- almost all of the cut scenes relate to the behind the scenes engineering he did... down to the fact that he brought the kryptonite in to the country specifically knowing Batman would take it and use it- he is pleased as can be when he shows up at his lab and finds the kryptonite missing and the batarang in its place.

The turn on a dime change of attitude wayne has when lois shows up and explains it to him is understandable at that point- Wayne sees the set-up for what it is.


As for superman grabbing the spear- deal with it. Batman brought Doomsday back so he could use the spear... and almost got fried. Wonder woman shows up, they start trying to whoop doomsday, and before anyone has a chance to peel off and look for the weapon, Lois gets trapped under the water retrieving it. Supes hears her mid-battle, saves her, grabs the spear and goes to work. Poor choice on his part, but he took an opportunity- wonder woman had Doomsday in the lasso and Batman had just blasted the ****** with his last kryptonite shell- it was the one moment where doomsday was vulnerable.

Nobody except Lois knew where the spear was. They certainly were not in a position to go on a scavenger hunt at any point.
When supes hears lois and saves her, that is the first time they laid eyes on it.
So what to do? Run away, tell wonder woman where it is at, and hope to contain doomsday while she runs to get it?
Or strike when Doomsday is weakened?

Would Wonder woman have fared any better? Maybe not- she is powerful, but my guess is she may very well have been stabbed through the heart as well (bullets bounce off of superman, but in comics, Wonder woman deflects them with her bracelets- maybe she can be shot? that is all over the map- she has been pierced by arrows in the comics, but also in an offshoot she has been shown to withstand bullets.)
Supes would have been Just fine had he gotten a better shot at Doomsday, he just had the bad luck of Doomsday stabbing him. The same fate could very well have awaited Wonder Woman- and to be fair, Superman did not know jack shit about wonder woman- for all he knew, the shield may have been the only thing super about her.
We know as fans what wonder woman is- But all Superman knew was that he was fighting next to a human with great toys and some crazy woman. His decision was solid in the heat of the moment.

Stopped reading after "It is..." lol

Mine's arriving in the mail tomorrow.

 

[remydat]

The 2 key flaws in the movie still were not resolved.

1. Batman only pauses from killing Superman because their mothers have the same name. That's one hell of a coincidence that stopped Batman from basically being a cold blooded murderer.

2. They returned to the scene and no one bothers looking for Lois despite Batman and Superman knowing that she was just there recently with them. Batman is still 100% worthless in this fight so not sure why he just doesn't go looking for her and the spear while Superman and Wonder Women deal with Doomsday. Again, the movie relies on one hell of a coincidence/good fortune that Superman hears Lois in the middle of the battle and that the roof doesn't simply crush her instantly when it collapses rather than just cause her to drown.

Both of course were done for dramatic effect, but it still causes one to roll your eyes at how fortuitous things played out. Although I will say to airtime's point the new edition makes Luthor seem like less of a bumbling tool who magically almost gets two supposed superheroes to murder each other.