*2015 AL Central Thread*

[brett05]

He's been starting like he should be.

You, Hawk, and Brett are the brigade that want him to be in the bullpen next year.

Everyone on this board needs to read more.

I said I see both sides and I waffle on it. Stop building strawmen

 

[ChiSoxCity]

You don't draft a relief pitcher with a #1 pick. It really is that simple. Its also a difference in attitude on the mound. That's why being a starter in college matters. Perhaps you are the one who has a simplistic view of pitchers. :dunno:

They have this thing called "development", ever hear of it? That's what smart teams do when they want to bring up young pitching prospects who have never pitched in the big leagues before.

Everyone here seems to think the division is weak, so why are you so worried about one rookie pitcher becoming a starter right away. The kid's going to be great, but we don't need him RIGHT NOW to contend.

There are many examples of young talent being forced to produce too soon. Guys blowing out arms or losing their competitive edge because their confidence got crushed due to bad games/control issues/breakdown in mechanics/problems in their delivery. Teams are smarter now and take steps to avoid this by being patient and meticulous with player "development".




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[Parade_Rain]

They have this thing called "development", ever hear of it. That's what smart teams do when they want to bring up young pitching prospects who have never pitched in the big leagues before.

Everyone here seems to think the division is weak, so why are you so worried about one rookie pitcher becoming a starter right away. The kid's going to be great, but we don't need him RIGHT NOW to contend.

There are many examples of young talent being forced to produce too soon. Guys blowing out arms or losing their competitive edge because their confidence got crushed due to bad games/control issues/breakdown in mechanics/problems in their delivery. Teams are smarter now and take steps to avoid this by being patient and meticulous with player "development".




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I'm not worried about him being a starter right away. He doesn't belong on the Big club as a RP yet either. Development? LOL. That's what the entire MiLB system is for.

 

[ChiSoxCity]

I'm not worried about him being a starter right away. He doesn't belong on the Big club as a RP yet either. Development? LOL. That's what the entire MiLB system is for.

Don't think of Rodon as an RP then. Think of him as a starter getting a little OJT.


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[Parade_Rain]

If he is with the Club from the start as a RP, then he is a RP. They aren't going to magically start him in the middle of the season.

 

[The Hawk]

If he is with the Club from the start as a RP, then he is a RP. They aren't going to magically start him in the middle of the season.

Um.... what happened then with Sale. Was he not a RP when they first brought him up? Did they not then send him to winter ball and spring training as a starter? Didnt they monitor his progress and build him up gradually? No one talked anything about Rodon beginning a season as a RP and then magically starting him in the middle of a season. Now.....the Cubs might do that, but not real major league teams.

 

[Parade_Rain]

Um.... what happened then with Sale. Was he not a RP when they first brought him up? Did they not then send him to winter ball and spring training as a starter? Didnt they monitor his progress and build him up gradually? No one talked anything about Rodon beginning a season as a RP and then magically starting him in the middle of a season. Now.....the Cubs might do that, but not real major league teams.

Rodon is not Sale. Arguably, the Sox are in a different place now. They already have a solid pitching staff. As of right now, Rodon seems to be a luxury. I didn't bring the Cubs into this conversation. You have. It's extremely bizarre and not relevant to the discussion.

 

[ChiSoxCity]

If he is with the Club from the start as a RP, then he is a RP. They aren't going to magically start him in the middle of the season.

LOL! Light that ish, smoke that ish, pass that ish. How is promoting a young pitcher from a bullpen "magic"? [emoji1]


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[Parade_Rain]

LOL! Light that ish, smoke that ish, pass that ish. How is promoting a young pitcher from a bullpen "magic"? [emoji1]


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Because they aren't conditioned to do that in the middle of the season. Arms don't work that way.

 

[The Hawk]

Most typically spend 1.5/2 years in the minors, then get called up. That list includes:

Strasburg, Harvey, Fernandez, etc

The days of minor leaguers hanging out in the minors doesn't happen anymore, guy.

But were not talking about your typical high draft pick pitcher, we're talking about a dude that was highly touted, and most believed he was going to be in the majors before no time. And he only ups his value starting. You literally waste him in the bullpen. The Reds are doing it to Aroldis Chapman.

High draft picks are not certain to even make the major league club let alone play awhile or start. Of 2nd and 1st round pick, only 2/3 of number one picks make a major league roster and only about half of 2nd round picks.


And the time it takes for these picks to make a roster is also a lto longer than you make it out to be. Right now, only about 15% of the two high picks make the big club in THREE YEARS. That is a fact. Generally speaking, a team will give its high picks about 5 years to make it and if they don't, they are gone and doing something else. They keep them around in order to justify the signing bonuses and stuff.

 

[The Hawk]

If he is with the Club from the start as a RP, then he is a RP. They aren't going to magically start him in the middle of the season.

How do you know this? It isn't true, but how do you know this? You seem to have some kind of fantasy idea of how baseball works??

 

[The Hawk]

Rodon is not Sale. Arguably, the Sox are in a different place now. They already have a solid pitching staff. As of right now, Rodon seems to be a luxury. I didn't bring the Cubs into this conversation. You have. It's extremely bizarre and not relevant to the discussion.

It wasn't bizarre. It was a joke. And Rodon is not a luxury as far as I am concerned. I think but more importantly, I think that the Sox think, that he can help the Sox pretty quickly. I do not see the Sox as having any luxuries. They aren't good enough to be talking about luxuries. Hell, if the guy proves taht he can start in spring training, I have no doubt that they will put him in the rotation. Personally, I doubt that he would be ready, but why would they not do it? Its not like their 4 and 5 guys are very good. In fact, they are not very good and they need help in the starting rotation. And if they think that Rodon can help in the middle of the pen and Cooper can really help make his ready quicker, then they will do that.

I'm just a realist as far as assessing the team that I follow. I see Rodon as a big time asset and a team who is not afraid to put guys that they think can handle the pressure and have the talent to succeed in when they can. It will be fun to watch.

 

[Parade_Rain]

How do you know this? It isn't true, but how do you know this? You seem to have some kind of fantasy idea of how baseball works??

It's truth. A marathon runner doesn't go out and run 26.2. He must be conditioned. A Closer can't go more than a handful of batters, etc. If you;ve conditioned a player to be a sprinter, he isn't going to be a long distance runner just because you want him to be. That's why Czar keeps discussed stretching out his arm.

 

[Parade_Rain]

...And Rodon is not a luxury as far as I am concerned. I think but more importantly, I think that the Sox think, that he can help the Sox pretty quickly. I do not see the Sox as having any luxuries. They aren't good enough to be talking about luxuries.

That's why he starts in MiLB as a SP. They can call him up when ready.

Hell, if the guy proves taht he can start in spring training, I have no doubt that they will put him in the rotation. Personally, I doubt that he would be ready, but why would they not do it? Its not like their 4 and 5 guys are very good. In fact, they are not very good and they need help in the starting rotation.

That would be a big leap, but if he could prove that, I agree.

And if they think that Rodon can help in the middle of the pen and Cooper can really help make his ready quicker, then they will do that.

They could, but odds are greatly against it.

I'm just a realist as far as assessing the team that I follow. I see Rodon as a big time asset and a team who is not afraid to put guys that they think can handle the pressure and have the talent to succeed in when they can. It will be fun to watch.

Rodon is an asset. He's a #1 draft pick with a lot of promise. It will be fun to watch the season and also see if you can PM me when camp breaks to say "I told you so".

 

[brett05]

It's truth. A marathon runner doesn't go out and run 26.2. He must be conditioned. A Closer can't go more than a handful of batters, etc. If you;ve conditioned a player to be a sprinter, he isn't going to be a long distance runner just because you want him to be. That's why Czar keeps discussed stretching out his arm.

Not stirring the pot, more of a question. I seem to recall a lot of pitchers being BP arms and within a month getting the arm stretched to be a full time starter. No?

 

[Parade_Rain]

Do you really want to be jacking around with that while the team is making a playoff run? The answer is that some of this depends on how the Sox as a team are performing.

 

[brett05]

Do you really want to be jacking around with that while the team is making a playoff run? The answer is that some of this depends on how the Sox as a team are performing.

I understand the situation part. But If I read this thread right some are saying you never do the BP to SP at the MLB level during a season and I feel that the statement might be wrong.

 

[Parade_Rain]

I understand the situation part. But If I read this thread right some are saying you never do the BP to SP at the MLB level during a season and I feel that the statement might be wrong.

The long relievers would be the emergency starters. Again, those pitchers are conditioned to go further than others in the pen. A club might send a short reliever down to AAA for starts to get them acclimated. It isn't likely to happen at MLB level. BP to SP is a broad brush. There are different types of arms in the Pen.

 

[brett05]

The long relievers would be the emergency starters. Again, those pitchers are conditioned to go further than others in the pen. A club might send a short reliever down to AAA for starts to get them acclimated. It isn't likely to happen at MLB level. BP to SP is a broad brush. There are different types of arms in the Pen.

I agree different types but I don't think anyone sees Rodon as a specialist.

 

[Parade_Rain]

I agree different types but I don't think anyone sees Rodon as a specialist.

Is he going to be long relief or are you bringing him in for an inning? And BTW, for all the talk that the bullpen issues were fixed in the offseason, that Top Ten list guy didn't have the Sox pen in the top half, I get why you would consider wanting Rodon up. Smoltz is an example I'm thinking of. He went from being a successful starter for years to being a closer for about 3 seasons and then went back to being a starter at the end of his career because he felt he could help the club more in the SP role. He returned to being a starter after an off-season of training.