2015 Baseball Hall of Fame elections

[brett05]

No. I got the gist of it. Murder = betting on baseball. The gold standard of baseball is 3,000 hits. The man has 4, 256. How long has this been going on? Long enough. Even many murderers have the opportunity for parole.

He had it, even what Bart was alive IIRC. He kept lying about it. He deserves his "reward" for it.

 

[SilenceS]

I am not denying anything. But SilenceS you seem to be.

The rules say and are everywhere about gambling. Same with the punishment of a lifetime ban. Rose was not only caught, but then proceeded to lie about it continually.

He gets to go in, but he gives up the honor of it being done while he is alive. It's the integrity of the game. Some here and elsewhere will say he bet on his own team. That doesn't make it better. He is placing his wager ahead of the team and that is wrong.

Love what Pete did. Hate that he gambled on baseball.

Where did I deny he bet on baseball? I said if you think there isnt a HOF player that bet on baseball then I have a bridge to sell ya. The rest is your opinion. I have my own.

 

[brett05]

Where did I deny he bet on baseball? I said if you think there isnt a HOF player that bet on baseball then I have a bridge to sell ya. The rest is your opinion. I have my own.

You are denying that it did any damage to the game.

 

[SilenceS]

You are denying that it did any damage to the game.

It did damage to the game because a guy denied doing it? Does it have any affect on the game today? I can guarantee you no one gives two stuffs about Pete Rose betting back in the day.

 

[brett05]

It did damage to the game because a guy denied doing it? Does it have any affect on the game today? I can guarantee you no one gives two stuffs about Pete Rose betting back in the day.

That's a pretty silly statement to make. Actually a lot care.

 

[TL1961]

No. I got the gist of it. Murder = betting on baseball. The gold standard of baseball is 3,000 hits. The man has 4, 256. How long has this been going on? Long enough. Even many murderers have the opportunity for parole.

No, you don't even come close to getting it.

NOBODY is suggesting he didn't have a career worthy of HOF induction. NOBDOY!

People who feel he should be out, feel that way because that is the punishment for the crime against the sport that he committed. It was well known. It was absolute. He bet on baseball, and now admits it. The punishment for that is you are OUT of baseball.

It has NOTHING to do with hits. He CLEARLY had the credentials to go in. Clearly!

But 4,256 hits has no more bearing on whether he should pay the price for betting on baseball than it does on whether a person should pay the price for any other crime/transgression, etc.

Anyone who brings up Rose's number of hits simply has no idea WHY people say he should be out. You don't get it.

 

[SilenceS]

That's a pretty silly statement to make. Actually a lot care.

Like who?

 

[SilenceS]

No, you don't even come close to getting it.

NOBODY is suggesting he didn't have a career worthy of HOF induction. NOBDOY!

People who feel he should be out, feel that way because that is the punishment for the crime against the sport that he committed. It was well known. It was absolute. He bet on baseball, and now admits it. The punishment for that is you are OUT of baseball.

It has NOTHING to do with hits. He CLEARLY had the credentials to go in. Clearly!

But 4,256 hits has no more bearing on whether he should pay the price for betting on baseball than it does on whether a person should pay the price for any other crime/transgression, etc.

Anyone who brings up Rose's number of hits simply has no idea WHY people say he should be out. You don't get it.

Im pretty sure people get it. Im just pretty sure that they dont find it enough of an offense to justify keeping him out. He swears he never altered a game. There is no proof he ever did alter the game. It was pretty much a victimless crime that they gave the death penalty for.

 

[TL1961]

It did damage to the game because a guy denied doing it? Does it have any affect on the game today? I can guarantee you no one gives two stuffs about Pete Rose betting back in the day.

The men who run baseball are smart enough to know that if players and managers are known to be betting on the outcome, the game has ZERO integrity. None!

Betting on baseball will kill the sport.

Players driving while drunk, or beating their wife, are bigger crimes against society. And should be dealt with as such. And they will give the sport a black eye, as we see in the NFL.

But they will not kill it. They will not make people stop caring about it, or doubting it.

Do you think for one minute that fans will be following offseason moves or paying attention at the trade deadline to track their teams moves to improve their team when they feel the results on the field are not dependent upon that anyway? No way.

Will they be buying tickets, knowing their pitcher could have $ on the opponent and their team will have little chance to win? No way.

Do you think Fox or ESPN will pay $ to broadcast an event that is no longer a fair athleltic competition? Not for long!

Interest dies if the integrity of the games are in question. This is such a basic concept to me that I simply have never been able to understand how people don't get it.

 

[brett05]

Like who?

Have you not read this thread?

 

[SilenceS]

The men who run baseball are smart enough to know that if players and managers are known to be betting on the outcome, the game has ZERO integrity. None!

Betting on baseball will kill the sport.

Players driving while drunk, or beating their wife, are bigger crimes against society. And should be dealt with as such. And they will give the sport a black eye, as we see in the NFL.

But they will not kill it. They will not make people stop caring about it, or doubting it.

Do you think for one minute that fans will be following offseason moves or paying attention at the trade deadline to track their teams moves to improve their team when they feel the results on the field are not dependent upon that anyway? No way.

Will they be buying tickets, knowing their pitcher could have $ on the opponent and their team will have little chance to win? No way.

Do you think Fox or ESPN will pay $ to broadcast an event that is no longer a fair athleltic competition? Not for long!

Interest dies if the integrity of the games are in question. This is such a basic concept to me that I simply have never been able to understand how people don't get it.

You do realize thats why Rose took it on the chin. They made an example out of him. Its been 25 years. He never fixed a game. The crime doesnt fit the punishment anymore.

 

[SilenceS]

Have you not read this thread?

2 people?

 

[brett05]

2 people?

I'm not the one that said no one cares. That is you.

 

[TL1961]

Im pretty sure people get it. Im just pretty sure that they dont find it enough of an offense to justify keeping him out. He swears he never altered a game. There is no proof he ever did alter the game. It was pretty much a victimless crime that they gave the death penalty for.

No. The mere mention of 4,256 indicates a person doesn't. Any time someone brings up Rose's stats, I immediately know they don't understand.

He says he never bet against his team, but he also said he never bet. Mountains of evidence proved he was lying. And it doesn't matter.

If players on every team, and/or managers, have $ riding on the outcome, interest goes to hell. No Vegas odds and no fantasy baseball. either. And if you don't think those are huge factors on the overall popularity of a sport, think again.

It's easy to say one guy betting doesn't create a problem. But there needs to be a penalty for it to prevent it. And this harsh penalty is all that can stop it.

 

[TL1961]

You do realize thats why Rose took it on the chin. They made an example out of him. Its been 25 years. He never fixed a game. The crime doesnt fit the punishment anymore.

The penalty most certainly does fit the crime. And you have no idea whether he ever fixed a game. And the uncertainty itself will ruin the game.

Victimless? The men who run baseball know who the victim will be: Baseball.

The penalty was communicated to every player, every day of their careers. No way can it be considered too harsh.

 

[brett05]

If I have money on the game, I am pitching my closer in the ninth. Makes no difference that he actually needed some rest for pitching the past few days, I need to win my wager. That is just an example of why even betting on your own team is bad.

 

[TL1961]

Not to mention that I can alter my teams outcome on Mon, Tues, Wed, for the worse, and then bet on them Thurs or Fri and get better odds. So many ways to go with this.

But I need to remember the lesson my father taught me (or tried to): "You can't reason a man out of a position he wasn't reasoned into."

 

[SilenceS]

The penalty most certainly does fit the crime. And you have no idea whether he ever fixed a game. And the uncertainty itself will ruin the game.

Victimless? The men who run baseball know who the victim will be: Baseball.

The penalty was communicated to every player, every day of their careers. No way can it be considered too harsh.

The uncertainty itself has done nothing to alter the game. He admitted to betting in his book. He has done 25 years of punishment. There have been bigger scandals then him. He deserves a spot in the hall. I think this author sums up my thoughts.

http://www.charlotteobserver.com/2015/01/07/5430238/column-time-to-allow-pete-rose.html

 

[SilenceS]

Not to mention that I can alter my teams outcome on Mon, Tues, Wed, for the worse, and then bet on them Thurs or Fri and get better odds. So many ways to go with this.

But I need to remember the lesson my father taught me (or tried to): "You can't reason a man out of a position he wasn't reasoned into."

LOL :crazydance:

 

[SilenceS]

I'm not the one that said no one cares. That is you.

LOL