[A] LEAVE BOWMAN ALONE!

[R K]

Best Game i ever saw the 91 All Star Game all the way in back 2nd balcony by the concession stand

Mine was Daryll Sutter scoring a hat trick against the Oilers in 1981.

 

[daze71]

then why did you ask the question in the first place?

More so an observation to the point about Mc Shithead being in charge of a shitty team at the time but still selling out Wrigley field on a regular basis.

 

[R K]

More so an observation to the point about Mc Shithead being in charge of a shitty team at the time but still selling out Wrigley field on a regular basis.

But were the Cubs a shitty team, or just a team that hasn't won a WS? There were some times in the 70's and 80's Wrigley was a ghost town. There were some very good Cub teams in there to. There was also this thing called WGN Superstation that pumped Cubs games all over the Country on a daily basis. Making Cub fans everywhere.



Mcdonough was also responsible for 180mil contract for a guy that can't lead off, can't play left field in a conference without the DH. Similar to Huet.

 

[JOVE23]

But were the Cubs a shitty team, or just a team that hasn't won a WS? There were some times in the 70's and 80's Wrigley was a ghost town. There were some very good Cub teams in there to. There was also this thing called WGN Superstation that pumped Cubs games all over the Country on a daily basis. Making Cub fans everywhere.



Mcdonough was also responsible for 180mil contract for a guy that can't lead off, can't play left field in a conference without the DH. Similar to Huet.

Soriano is having a great year, but your comment stands.

 

[PatrickShart]

ok we all get after years of reading posts that pmx doesn't like Dale, but this isn't about what Dale is doing. It's about what STAN is doing. Stan is way in over his head. His daddy didn't do him any favors, and his ineptitude as a GM is showing. Nobody will trade with him, and that's been confirmed, so Rockstar should just step in and insist on a new GM with less baggage. McD won't have to worry about Scooter telling any tales out of school, because it would tarnish the Bowman name if he did.



As far as Mueller goes, if he proves anything to be what Fleischmann is, then it was a great pick up. Remember, nobody want Flas because of his health issue...but this is a discussion for the Panther boards.....

I don't have a problem with Dale...just think people have a short memory if a plethora of his mistakes/or seem to look the other way...where as Stan hasn't made too many mistakes other than 'why didn't he sign this guy or trade for him...he sucks/is sleeping in the job'



People want to make fair criticism, that's fine...but just making shit up for the sake of having something to ***** about while claiming everything Dale did was golden is BS

 

[R K]

I don't have a problem with Dale...just think people have a short memory if a plethora of his mistakes/or seem to look the other way...where as Stan hasn't made too many mistakes other than 'why didn't he sign this guy or trade for him...he sucks/is sleeping in the job'



People want to make fair criticism, that's fine...but just making shit up for the sake of having something to ***** about while claiming everything Dale did was golden is BS

See that I disagree with. I've mentioned numerous times Dales clear mistakes coming out of the lockout. But as I do with Stan, he was learning a new job and had Pulford breathing down his neck. I suppose similar to Mcdonough and Stan, although Mcdonough is why Stans there. Pulford was not why Tallon was there.



As for the making stuff up I for one have made nothing up, and I also am not slamming Stan for what he hasn't done this off season as there are/were three pretty clear holes and not many fillers for those holes available. He filled one of them with Brookbank, and another could possibly already be filled with Saad. The Center position is not an easy one to fill, nor was it for Tallon either.



Tallon has one thing stan doesn't and that's class. If you think the rest of the NHL GM's give Stan a fair shake in trades, offers, general dealing that I question. He and Mcdonough pissed off a lot of folks. There is no doubt about it. You know they are a "good old boys" group for the most part. Minus an exception here or there. Do you honestly think Wilson throws an offer sheet on a Hawk player if Tallon is still GM. Not a chance. It's not like Holmgren to Poile there.



I don't like Stan for the way he got his job. I like Tallon for learning on the job and BUILDING a Stanley Cup team. I would have liked to see what Tallon did after the Cup run to dig out of the Cap mess and possibly keep the core rolling. His players played for him, liked him, and wanted to continue playing for him. Money or not.



I go back to the sign "the team Tallon Built".... Every single on of those players on the ice skated over and left a puck just beneath the sign. It wasn't by chance they did that, it was out of respect for the sign, which most players try at all cost to avoid paying attention to during preskate as a rule, as you know.

 

[R K]

I do agree with you people are not in the room and have no idea what players are being offered either way. I will say I have a feeling other GMS ask far more from Stan than they do other GMs if they even make the offer to him in the first place. That's the price he and Mcdonough pay for Karma as well.



Dallas was not trading in the conference. It's well known they prefer not too.



CBJ was not trading in the division it's well known, by proof of Nash's offer from detroit, they won't. IE Vermette.



So there are tangibles people just tend to overlook when suggesting he's sleeping. I don't think he's sleeping rather I think his job is twice as hard in consequence to what they purposely did to the guy before him. Who, contrary to popular belief is extremely admired by his peers, friends and just about anyone that's ever had the pleasure of meeting him. I have spoken to Dale many times and have nothing but repespect for him.

 

[PatrickShart]

You and I have discussed this, I've never not liked Dale. So I was addressing that statement.



Players play for each other/the team...more than any front office. Sure, they liked Dale but that doesn't make someone play/try harder on the ice or give more or less.



I think Stan is building a Stanley Cup team again - through the draft. Just not the trade/FA route. It's not a fun or instant gratification, but its a plan and he's sticking to it.



As far as people keep mentioning "playoff failures" the last 2 years, well what teams out there have made it out of the first round in each of the last 2 years? NASH, PHIL, WASH. Which one of them has won a cup? I'll hang up and wait for an answer. This teams playoff failures has had to do more with injuries than coaching or the talent the GM has put on the ice.



As far as Wilson and the offer sheet? Hindsight is he should've let Wilson take him and be stuck with Hjarllmarsson. Wilson would've looked bad. But I think he should concentrate on making his own team better. Thats a guy that also brought in Heatly....how's that doing for him? NHL teams in general don't throw offer sheets out there out of some sort of "respect" is foolish - but probably due to Burke's rant about it....but I bet that changes more and more in the future. Teams/GMs should make offers based on making their team better and not about hurting feelings in the good ol' boy network.



And as far as Mueller...and a "good GM" in Tallon getting him while Stan has his pants down during this - which spurned this discussion - Mueller isn't a center, was an underachiever in PHX, couldn't/wouldn't play for Tippet (scratched often)...then oft injured in COL - whose Dr's know his history and didnt even qualify him a contract...I have no problem passing on a 1.75mil RW'r who has major concussion issues and won't claim our GM got pantsed.

 

[R K]

I think he has to do it with the draft because of the bed they created three years ago. But I do agree that's the route he's going. His drafting of McNeil clearly shows that.

 

[IceHogsFan]

I don't think Mcdonough is the one that will be questioning it. IT will be his boss who pays the bills and or gets the playoff rev. Maybe Stan gets another year, but if not finding any tools to add to the Mix how can it be all Q's fault. I think it's a telling season for both of them. Assuming that is theres hockey to begin with. No one I've read think theres a chance in hell the season starts on time.

And when (if) Scooter is gone, what established hockey mind will want to be the GM of the Blackhawks under McD?

 

[R K]

And when (if) Scooter is gone, what established hockey mind will want to be the GM of the Blackhawks under McD?

Very good question. I know I wouldn't want to work in that situation. I like a boss where I can voice my opinions and they matter. He was a giant prick to Tallon and all Tallon did was give Mcdonough everything he inhereted. Like allowing his and Blunks name to be on the Stanley Cup. Seriously Jay Blunk is etched on the Stanley Cup and Rick Dudley is not. That's fucking sickening!

 

[Shantz My Pants]

PMXC essentially you get what my main point of this whole article was, and that was building the team through the draft and good development. Yes, it's obviously less exciting, but when one of these kids come up and makes a big impression, there will be a lot of people raving about how great of developing talent Bowman is.

 

[xatruio]

in a pipedream somewhere down the line Blunks and hopefully even mcdonuts names get those Xs slashed over them and hopefully Dudley gets his name in there, too...

 

[the canadian dream]

Stan has 2 jobs. Build the Hawks future team which all GMs have to do and build support for the Hawks team now. This is what happens when you walk onto a team where a very strong main core is already in place and there are higher expectations. We aren't dealing with a rebuilding GM here...so I find the term "building the team" a lose term when we are talking about the current Hawks team.



It's a tough job for any GM to look to the future teams while working with a strong current roster which has to be added too under a certain time frame. Probably won't be seeing Stan have the luxury of top 5 picks anytime soon to help boost the current roster and make the future more promising. So he is at a disadvantage in some sense. Dale was great but he also had the help of great draft positions stemming from poor seasons (not to say guys like Keith weren't solid late picks). It's really tough when you are picking from the middle of the pack every draft season. It's going to take smart drafting and trading up and yes this will be what Stan will be judged on. This is where really good GMs shine to be honest. Staying consistant and building for the future at the same time. Hard balancing act at times.

 

[Ton]

Stan has 2 jobs. Build the Hawks future team which all GMs have to do and build support for the Hawks team now. This is what happens when you walk onto a team where a very strong main core is already in place and there are higher expectations. We aren't dealing with a rebuilding GM here...so I find the term "building the team" a lose term when we are talking about the current Hawks team.



It's a tough job for any GM to look to the future teams while working with a strong current roster which has to be added too under a certain time frame. Probably won't be seeing Stan have the luxury of top 5 picks anytime soon to help boost the current roster and make the future more promising. So he is at a disadvantage in some sense. Dale was great but he also had the help of great draft positions stemming from poor seasons (not to say guys like Keith weren't solid late picks). It's really tough when you are picking from the middle of the pack every draft season. It's going to take smart drafting and trading up and yes this will be what Stan will be judged on. This is where really good GMs shine to be honest. Staying consistant and building for the future at the same time. Hard balancing act at times.

Now this I agree with 100%. It's hard to compare Stan and Dale considering they walked into different situations regarding the make-up of the team. I can't really say which ob is harder to accomplish but we all know Dale was successful at his job as the result was a Cup, as far as Dale's ability to keep making the right decisions after winning the Cup, we'll never know, but I would speculate that he would have done a great job in that area as well. Stan on the other hand is certainly under the microscope at a much deeper degree than Dale felt in Chicago, and we'll see if he can do it... but I do think there is one thing he is lacking: the balls to make a gutsy move. Dale was able to keep the course while also improving the team via trade while Stan really hasn't taken his balls out of McD's purse yet. Versteeg and Sharp come to mind as brilliant moves (steals) Dale made along with signing Niemi, while Stan found one steal in Leddy thus far (other moves are yet to be determined). As far as gutsy, the Havlat trade was gutsy, Ladd trade was gutsy, and I haven't seen that sort of push from Bowman yet. Of course Havlat was not part of the Cup team, and I would argue that Havlat would have been just as effective as Hossa in that Cup run but that is just pure speculation and we'll never know. Ladd was vital and maybe Ruutu would have contributed in the same way but we'll never know that either.



At this point in his career as GM, I think he needs to make that gutsy deal. Take a chance. Bowman has shown he can draft well (still to be determined but I am confident in Stan as well as the scouting staff to make the right move at the table) and he has shown that he is hit-or-miss on FA's, much like Tallon (Hossa, Kopecky were hits... Brunette, Pisani misses). Main issue comes with those trades for me. But as RK has said, it could be that Stan is getting low-balled at every corner. Can you really blame him for that? No, but good GM's will find a way. Dale sure didn't walk into the best situation either and had to make Chicago a preferred destination in that FA hunt and I believe at the end of his Chicago tenure he succeeded in that... if Dale can turn his fortunes around I think I should be able to expect Stan to make a trade to improve the club and turn the cards in his favor as well.

 

[Shantz My Pants]

What's a gutsy deal?



Outside of trying to land a 2nd line C, what would be gutsy? There really isn't too much IMO that you need to do on this team, and nothing really shouts out as "gutsy".

 

[Shantz My Pants]

If anybody needs to get gutsy, it's Q.



Obviously his idea of style the Hawks are "playing" ("puck possession") is not working. Why not try and find success in other ways? Change up the forecheck, try different systems, go to a man on man style of defense, force the defensemen to defend.



He also needs to get tougher on these guys. He's admitted himself that he's loosen the reigns on the guys after the Cup season (I would have to find the interview for proof) and maybe it's time to hold the skaters more accountable for their level of play? If (insert skater here) doesn't want to skater hard every shift, have him be the grocery stick on the ice, or up in the press box. I'm sure that will get everyone's attention.

 

[Maiden]

What's a gutsy deal?



Outside of trying to land a 2nd line C, what would be gutsy? There really isn't too much IMO that you need to do on this team, and nothing really shouts out as "gutsy".

Gutsy Deal = Obtaining PK Subban

 

[R K]

Gutsy Deal = Obtaining PK Subban

Would cost him Kane.

 

[IceHogsFan]

Gutsy Deal = Obtaining PK Subban

Me likey........... or his bro? Then again his brother would not be so gutsy.