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Mighty Joe Young

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I think some things are pretty clear

-The Bears need to get cheaper and younger on defense.
-Resources need to move to offense to maximize Fields.

My question is moving forward how many "big" contracts [like 10+ million average] do you see the Bears carrying moving forward?

Who do you think those players will be?

So I don't think it's going to be something where there is this obvious shedding of salary.

I'm sure that at some point they will restructure with Mack to give him more upfront money when the cap allows. I expect Hicks to be gone after this year. Other than that in the short term they can't get rid of much more. Unless Quinn comes on this year, I do see them getting out of that contract two or three years from now.

The flip side of this is the Bears have two very young cornerbacks in Johnson and vildor who saved them a ton of money and from which potentially we could get top flight play.

Being able to draft a top starting quality CB tandem is practically unheard of in the league.

Having them both young but also very good will help them in the long run.

Beyond that really, there are too many questions that we won't have answers to until the end of the season.

A lot is going to be based on how the defense looks with Desai helming it.

Does Eddie Jackson look like Eddie Jackson again? Or will he be the Eddie Jackson under pagano who just looked lost and useless?

Too many questions up in the air right now.
 

nc0gnet0

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So I don't think it's going to be something where there is this obvious shedding of salary.

I'm sure that at some point they will restructure with Mack to give him more upfront money when the cap allows. I expect Hicks to be gone after this year. Other than that in the short term they can't get rid of much more. Unless Quinn comes on this year, I do see them getting out of that contract two or three years from now.

The flip side of this is the Bears have two very young cornerbacks in Johnson and vildor who saved them a ton of money and from which potentially we could get top flight play.

Being able to draft a top starting quality CB tandem is practically unheard of in the league.

Having them both young but also very good will help them in the long run.

Beyond that really, there are too many questions that we won't have answers to until the end of the season.

A lot is going to be based on how the defense looks with Desai helming it.

Does Eddie Jackson look like Eddie Jackson again? Or will he be the Eddie Jackson under pagano who just looked lost and useless?

Too many questions up in the air right now.
You can't restructure mack again, how far down the road you want to kick that can?
 

msadows

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You can't restructure mack again, how far down the road you want to kick that can?

I mean, sure, not too smart, but then again mack is also only 30 this upcoming nfl season. Dude should have a few good years left.

I know a lions fan probably isn't used to having elite talent stick around much past 30, but you can still be a very productive nfl player going into the early side of 30.
 

nc0gnet0

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I mean, sure, not too smart...........
Should have stopped right there.

You can't restructure money already allocated to prior signing bonus's, only his base salary of 12 mil. So yeah, in theory you could restructure his base of 12 mil, spread it out over the next three years, and save yourself a whopping 8 mil, only to increase his cap hits even more over 2023 and 2024.
 
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msadows

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Should have stopped right there.

Restructuring mack's deal isn't an issue.

I fully expect him to perform well into his 30's.

If you think you have a window next year w/ fields then do it. We can also cut him with minimal cap implications(actually saves us cap).

Not like we are extending him to another deal bud.
 

ThatGuyRyan

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the smart thing to do would ride these contracts out, and draft defense 2022. If JF1 flopss then it’s rebuild anyway . Can’t really get a good idea until we set what desai can pull out of Quinn, Jackson and DT.
 

nc0gnet0

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the smart thing to do would ride these contracts out, and draft defense 2022. If JF1 flopss then it’s rebuild anyway . Can’t really get a good idea until we set what desai can pull out of Quinn, Jackson and DT.
yup
 

nc0gnet0

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Restructuring mack's deal isn't an issue.

I fully expect him to perform well into his 30's.

If you think you have a window next year w/ fields then do it. We can also cut him with minimal cap implications(actually saves us cap).

Not like we are extending him to another deal bud.
You would have to cut him prior to march, still hits you with 12 mil in dead cap, 17 mil cap savings this year, but even more dead cap the following year. Then you have to spend at least 10-12 mil on his replacement, which puts you right back in the same boat.
 

ThatGuyRyan

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He’s right. They have to get out of this “sign big deal then cut guy and carry his guaranteed money pattern” Pace likes to put himself into.. it’s cost the team millions.. fuck trey Burton is still on our books!
 

Britbuffguy

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Don't really have a lot of draft capital to do what you suggest though. If AR walks after next season, then WR is a huge concern. No first round pick, no 4th round pick, now missing AR, Mack, and Quinn, which direction do go?
What do they miss with Mack and Quinn? They barely make an impact now....Mack dos how up from time to time, but Quinn has been trash the entire time...and he's already hurt this year.
 

nc0gnet0

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What do they miss with Mack and Quinn? They barely make an impact now....Mack dos how up from time to time, but Quinn has been trash the entire time...and he's already hurt this year.
I already said Quin was gone next year, the discussion is entirely about Mack now.
 

WindyCity

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Realistically, Hicks, Quin and Trevathon are all gone next year. Mack will be gone in 2023. Good chance AR is gone next year as well. If you want to keep Hicks on the roster in 2021, you have to account for his 12 million cap hit, which is not figured into the link I posted.
They can’t cut Trevathan, he counts more to cut next year than keep.

Hicks and Quinn are gone.

Mack is likely gone in 2024 if his play dips. The contract doesn’t have an easy out before then and he is still playing at a high level.

If AR leaves they will be flush with cap space. But obviously down a very good player.
 

WindyCity

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We need to leave Mack’s deal alone. It has been redone so many times it is like Frankenstein.
 

WindyCity

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Mack’s Deal

22: 30/27 guaranteed
23: 28/14 guaranteed
24: 26/6 guaranteed
25: Void Year/3 million dead

You push any more money out it is going to be in Fielss extension territory
 

nc0gnet0

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They can’t cut Trevathan, he counts more to cut next year than keep.

Hicks and Quinn are gone.

Mack is likely gone in 2024 if his play dips. The contract doesn’t have an easy out before then and he is still playing at a high level.

If AR leaves they will be flush with cap space. But obviously down a very good player.
Am I reading it wrong? I show a 3.5 post june 1 cap savings. I think you might be missing the per game roster bonus in his contract that should be added to the base.
 

FozzyBear

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I think obviously Fangio has a positive impact on the drafting and developing of defensive players.

I just think most GMs have areas where they are stronger. Whether they played that position or side of the ball, or coached it, or came up scouting those guys.

Pace has been much better, especially on day 3, of defensive scouting.

Pace was a DE in college.
 

Mighty Joe Young

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You can't restructure mack again, how far down the road you want to kick that can?

I'm not saying that it would be the wise thing to do but it may be something they end up doing nonetheless.
 

WindyCity

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Am I reading it wrong? I show a 3.5 post june 1 cap savings. I think you might be missing the per game roster bonus in his contract that should be added to the base.

If we cut him next year we have 9 million of dead money.

We can spread that out to get some cap relief in 2022, but we are just eating that in the next years.

Unless he sucks, I don’t see them eating 9 million, even spread out, to punt him.
 

HearshotKDS

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Realistically I don't see Hicks, Goldman, or Quinn still on the team to start the '23-24 season. We'll see what happens this year, but I'm not even certain 2 of those 3 will still be in the NFL for that season. Unless Jackson returns to form, he may be out too. Bears cap situation is complicated - Pace had an unfortunate habit of backloading gauranteed money on his large contracts to lower cap hits the year of signing. The covid "rogue wave" cap drop has punished the Bears a bit for that practice. It may be in their best interest to just bite the bullet before the '22-23 season and cut a lot of the dead weight. Theres likely to be a large pop in cap after '21-22 so that gives you some room to pay whatever excess dead money that comes from the cuts.

Going forward I think Pace needs to apply his strategy at addressing S the last few seasons to the entire defense. He pays a (alleged) star at the position big money, but then kind of barrel scrapes to find the best "just some guy" he can to put next to his star. He needs to apply that to all levels of the defense. This team can't afford to have 2 OLBS with 8 figure cap hits, they can't afford to have a $10M NT next to a $12M DE in HIcks. They can't afford to pay a Trevathan big money to ultimately be "the other ILB next to Roquan Smith". He's going to have to start filling a lot of these positions with cheaper contract guys - so look for reclamation projects that out play their "prove it" contract or you hit on rookies who play above their rookie contract. Hell he should have already been doing that - Trevathan was a luxury they couldnt afford when they resigned him over KPL and they doubly cant afford his contract now.

The highest $ positions on defense are CBs and EDGE - Bears have a lot of promising youth at DB but for EDGE you just have Gipson for youth. Hope Gipson takes a massive step forward this year because so far he looks like he may be "just some guy" - which isn't the worst thing for the player but the Bears desparately need youth at that position that shows the potential to replace what Quinn was supposed to be here. Pace does have a really decent string of reclamation successes with both the SS position and moreso the DL - Nick Williams, Mario Edwards, Brent Urban, etc. i'm pretty confident in his ability to find cheap decent guys to replace Hicks/Goldman/maybe Nichols depending on cost to resign. Its really hard to replace the production of a prime goldman and hicks with anyone, let alone from the discount rack, but the Bears are in a cap position where they have to be happy to get 75% of the player for 25% of the cost.
 

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